Tim K Posted October 31, 2013 Share Posted October 31, 2013 Personally I would hope there would never be a day when a DCI Championship corps does not have a battery, so I would hope no corps wins a percussion title without it. That being said, I am often amazed at the talent and versatility of the front ensembles of many corps. Many of the instruments used: synthesizers, electric guitars and bass, the crazy thing used by Surf last year and introduced if I'm not mistaken by Teal Sound that looks like an electronic clarinet, keyboards of all varieties, and just about anything that is not a woodwind or trombone or French horn, are not percussion instruments. So I would wonder whether it is time for the front ensemble to be judged apart from percussion. In the not too far distant past color guard was thought of as adornment but in time the talent grew, especially in the 1970's, and eventually the color guard became indispensable and accounted for more of the score. I feel the same has happened with the front ensemble. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garfield Posted October 31, 2013 Share Posted October 31, 2013 It is in the sheets. http://issuu.com/drumcorpsinternational/docs/2012_judging_sheets_full_set/16?e=0 Music Percussion - Content "To what degree do the performers demonstrate simultaneous or layered responsibilities of playing an instrument, moving in and through forms, listening and responding to others, and manipulating body position." "What is the range of musical, physical and environmental challenges." Music Percussion - Achievement "considering all challenges, do the performers demonstrate musicality, precision and accuracy" So it doesn't say they "have to have it" but if 2 ensembles are equally proficient, but one is moving ... winner, winner, PB&J dinner. Thanks for saving me the work of finding this. I knew it was in there as soon as I read Stu's challenge. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garfield Posted October 31, 2013 Share Posted October 31, 2013 According to the judging sheets you provided, they do not indicate what type of percussion instruments have to be used, nor do the sheets indicate that they have to be ‘marching’. All a percussion ensemble has to do is perform some type of choreographed form movement (ie dance moves can be considered as 'form' movement) while playing, which certainly can be accomplished in a concert type percussion ensemble without performers actually ‘marching’; and even do this without battery type instruments. Therefore, according to the sheets, a corps with a marching battery and a corps without a marching battery should be judged equally as long as both corps’ percussion performers are exhibiting some type of form movement choreography while playing. That's not what it says, Stu. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garfield Posted October 31, 2013 Share Posted October 31, 2013 This is not theoretical; it is based on sheet ‘interpretation’ because the official wording is so very vague. Convince the current group of percussion judges, or better yet hire in a new crop of percussion judges, to interpret the vague wording on the sheets in a different manner and it will happen. It's not "interpretation", it's the wording. "...in and through..." is interpreted literally. That's not possible with grounded instruments. Besides, the demand of dancing on the sidelines doesn't approach the "layering" of the responsibility to move "...in and through..." the ensemble, so the field battery will win of the two. Especially if the sheets are interpreted as they were written, not as you dream they might read. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garfield Posted October 31, 2013 Share Posted October 31, 2013 This is not theoretical; it is based on sheet ‘interpretation’ because the official wording is so very vague. Convince the current group of percussion judges, or better yet hire in a new crop of percussion judges, to interpret the vague wording on the sheets in a different manner and it will happen. I question if you know who actually writes the sheets. Sure, bring in a new group of judges and re-write the sheets and even Boo's cockatoo could show up on the field. But, with this group of judges, percussion will be judged based on "...in and through..." as written. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garfield Posted October 31, 2013 Share Posted October 31, 2013 At first I thought this might be an intelligent thread........But was sadly mistaken.....didn't take too long into for someone to start the BD / G7 bashing........I guess I am surprised that nobody threw Hopkins into the mix. Although, the more I think about it, I shouldn't be to surprised........I am more angry at myself that I keep trying to come back on to this site and expect that anything would change I'd sure like to know what you read that I didn't. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IllianaLancerContra Posted November 1, 2013 Share Posted November 1, 2013 In the past some corps won what is now Open Class without a battery...not sure about the drum major. it is more common in the band world, especially smaller bands to go the grounded percussion route. I've actually taught it that way, and it created some challenges with older judges who felt it wasn't as demanding, but our approach was to cross train the kids on multiple instruments so no one was glued to one instrument the entire show. I've seen some really creative and musical presentations done this way,and I'm proud of the work my team did the two years I was with them. if done right...yeah it could happen, but I'm not sure a larger corps would ever go for it I seem to recall Academie Musicale making it into the top 20 or so in the early 90's w/ all perc in the pit and a rather small horn line. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stu Posted November 1, 2013 Share Posted November 1, 2013 (edited) double post Edited November 1, 2013 by Stu Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stu Posted November 1, 2013 Share Posted November 1, 2013 (edited) That's not what it says, Stu. But it can be 'interpreted' that way if desired. This is the day and age of relativism. While “moving in and through forms” means marching now it can easily mean dance forms if agreed upon by the design staff and judges without changing a word. It's not "interpretation", it's the wording. "...in and through..." is interpreted literally. That's not possible with grounded instruments. Besides, the demand of dancing on the sidelines doesn't approach the "layering" of the responsibility to move "...in and through..." the ensemble, so the field battery will win of the two. Especially if the sheets are interpreted as they were written, not as you dream they might read. It is not a dream. The way the sheets are interpreted today may change drastically tomorrow. Again, we are living in the day and age of relativism. And besides, the grounded pit already throws a huge kink in all of this layering and movement judging. I question if you know who actually writes the sheets. Yes, I know who writes the sheets, and I know who 'interprets’ the sheets. ... bring in a new group of judges and re-write the sheets... Bolded what is the key and italicized what does not matter; so if the design staff and judges are in agreement to change the ‘interpretation’ of the sheets the contextual definitions of the sentences on the sheets will then also change without having to rewrite a single word. Again we are in the day and age of relativism. Edited November 1, 2013 by Stu Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Ream Posted November 1, 2013 Share Posted November 1, 2013 I seem to recall Academie Musicale making it into the top 20 or so in the early 90's w/ all perc in the pit and a rather small horn line. I think old school A/A60 would have been ok with it. With Open Class corps now being up to 150 members, probably not as much Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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