cadetzoid Posted August 7, 2014 Share Posted August 7, 2014 Of course they didn't "TRY" to do that. That obviously wasn't their stated goal from the get go. That doesn't change the fact that it ended up being exactly what they did, and I'm guessing you're probably smart enough to read between the lines and understand palmettomello's point. If I can step in, I hope you are not alluding to the fact that either this was all on purpose, or that there was a faction of people that knew this would happen, and let it. Either is unfathomable and irresponsible, with no care for the members. Hope I am way off at understanding the "in between the lines" meaning. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cadetzoid Posted August 7, 2014 Share Posted August 7, 2014 (edited) No, it will not be easy, it will take, in my opinion, change some things in place that are lacking...Leadership, clear direction & vision, goals, those on the leadership team who can support and drive things in the direction it needs to go...and I know *they* want this too... It starts at the top and filters down... Well, so many rebuilding efforts in all areas of business, social constructs, and drum corps starts with "they". My question to you is who are "they"? Were "they" around the past three years of great success? If so, why did "they" let that staff go and allow for such a drastic approach to design? Were "they" supportive of the past team, or simply waiting in the wings to jump in and add their influence now that things were better? Have these "they" been around for a long time? If so, "they" didn't get it done before, how can they now? What is different? All the talent that lives within 200 miles of the Atlanta, who are on staff with top 6 corps, members of top 6 corps need a reason to NOT travel half way across the country and instead jump in their car and drive an hour to camp. I personally know quite a few staff members in top 6 corps who would like to be at SoA but for reasons inappropriate to discuss here decided to go to their respective corps. To me though, this is encouraging...fix a few things that need to be and I think SoA can start gaining a lot of momentum...will it be easy, no. But that's ok, and doesn't deter my optimism on what could be. They have great history, a great brand and they are in a freaking ideal location. No offense to other corps, but it is easy to get a direct flight to Atlanta and the location is a simple drive from there. Easy in, easy out. Other corps have the same thing I know, but what I'm saying in that regard is getting to Atlanta is not an obstacle. When you add up the positives it is encouraging. Well, i would say that the last three or four years was enough evidence of a better Spirit of Atlanta in place, but the corps was still young and probably still a few years from turning the corner of gaining those close to home talent pools for member and staff. This weak season has now put that off for five years or so. I will assume you wont agree. Without a lot of money to throw at the best staff, you will have to wait (this move, though possible, has gotten many corps into trouble. SOA being one of them). Any other view I feel is quite naive. Now regarding this year...and I do not have this as first hand info, but what I think is the new staff came in and had little time to design a show and did the best they could...what I do know as first hand info is there was concern at the on set regarding the design but those in favor of it, in the minority, said no just hold tight it will come around...when it became apparent it wasn't, they started making changes like crazy...now while other corps are fine tuning, SoA is learning new stuff, by the time they get around to cleaning things, other corps were already too far in front of them to be caught. After looking back through this fall's news, seems most of the design team, admin, and caption heads were gone in September. The point that they did not have time is inaccurate. Even if not hired until December, there is no excuse for this show. Though not wanting to be too catty, I see hundreds of high school band shows each fall that are better constructed. Regarding changes, if one watches a video of the first show, and then a most recent one, the changes are minimal compared to those made by most corps' changes. If anything, the changes were shallowly conceived and did nothing to change the quality, depth, or reward-ability of the production. The drum line is probably the strongest section in the corps...that staff has been together building the program for the past 4 years. Yes, Omar went from front ensemble to fill battery writing, but he is accustomed to this as he did it for BAC with no issues. I've seen the line up close and personal and they have some solid players and a good staff...they're scoring isn't reflecting their strength, and that's a whole other story. Yes, the drum line is a strength, and has recently surpassed the brass efforts. However, they started much behind and were incredibly rough early on. Also hurting them is their poor staging, 1987 drill treatment of drum lines, and the lack of overall music ensemble quality may be bleeding into the drum score. That said, their scoring has changed recently and are placing about where they should be. The pit and electronics are fine, but not standouts beyond 15th or so place. I also must point out that the best cymbal line of 2013 (yes, better than SCV) is no longer given their due, but buried in the drill, tacked onto the drumline, in what is again a 1980s approach to cymbal lines. And to tigger2's comments: I fear JKT90 that too many people who are alumni, old school area fans (not that these people are not important) will rally and try to solve the problem. However, they will be wholly unqualified and not know it. . . but not due to a lack of heart or great intention, but simply by the fact that they don't know the incredible complicated world that DCI has become the last 20, 10, 5 years. > Based on what I think I know, I don't see this being an issue at all. It seems that there are probably many alumni and area "supporters" that wish things were different, but they have probably been wishing for decades and have done little to nothing beyond that . . . wishing. Edited August 7, 2014 by cadetzoid Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JKT90 Posted August 7, 2014 Author Share Posted August 7, 2014 I agree with some of what you say. Other parts not so much. That's ok though... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
corps8294 Posted August 9, 2014 Share Posted August 9, 2014 Last nights broadcast answered a lot of questions and was on par with what some of you were saying. They pretty much started from scratch! Still, pretty heavy going from being a top 12 finalist to dropping that far out of finals and being beat by a Div II corps. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mirrormen Posted August 9, 2014 Share Posted August 9, 2014 Last nights broadcast answered a lot of questions and was on par with what some of you were saying. They pretty much started from scratch! Still, pretty heavy going from being a top 12 finalist to dropping that far out of finals and being beat by a Div II corps. Started "from scratch" means what? According to my sources, large return rate, especially horn line. Drum staff and visual staff had majority returning members. Board president is the same. Some design members stayed the same. Most of the same arrangers. Not in financial troubles. Had quality equipment. Had reputation on their side. Some one mentioned 90 rookies. While I imagine that number not accurate, such is most often the case when you get down around that 11- 23 mark. Additionally, would not surprise me if BD or Crown, etc. has had that many rookies at some given point. We can make excuses for performance that may "fly", but the show design has no excuses. I am sure if it wasn't the weakest design of all of world class and the top half of open. Not to slam Pioneer, but their show had more coordinated moments and programmatic considerations than Spirit. This may be the worst show ever handed to a talented finalist. I feel bad for the members and wish them all the best in their futures as age outs, or continuing marchers. If it were me and I had a chance to march again, I do not think there is any thing the administration could say to me to gain any of my trust. I would be auditioning elsewhere. Give me a great show to perform, great staff to teach me, and give me a chance to meet the challenge of maxing out my dot and knowing that doing so gains me and all of my fellow members an amazing opportunity to grow as performers, light up the audience, and compete as fairly as possible with my peers from other corps. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
corps8294 Posted August 9, 2014 Share Posted August 9, 2014 (edited) Whooooa, slow down. It was in reference to the "90 rookies" and such. 90 rookies, for any corps, is going to be a challenge. Edited August 9, 2014 by shortn'sour Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Will Posted August 9, 2014 Share Posted August 9, 2014 A former member of the guard told me that the 2014 guard was very young and the caption head was new as well (though he was on staff the past few years). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cadetzoid Posted August 9, 2014 Share Posted August 9, 2014 (edited) The main issue was not age nor talent level of the members, but decisions made by those in charge. Edited August 9, 2014 by cadetzoid Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cadetzoid Posted August 9, 2014 Share Posted August 9, 2014 Whooooa, slow down. It was in reference to the "90 rookies" and such. 90 rookies, for any corps, is going to be a challenge. Well, mirrormen did get a bit excited. I get it though. Just not fair to the members at all. I do agree that 80-90 rookies is not out of the ordinary in drum corps and I do not see it as a reason for their placement. Think you would be surprised if you new each corps' percentage of rookies, including the top 6. Granted, a 21 year old rookie at Cadets or BD is often not the same as a 17 year old rookie at Spirit. Best to SOA this off season. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tim K Posted August 9, 2014 Share Posted August 9, 2014 I feel bad for Spirit this year. I expected them to pull it together as the season progressed since there were some great moments in their show. What I found from seeing them in late June/early July and when I saw them in Atlanta and Charlotte was a polishing of the show's strengths while not cleaning the weaker spots which in the end make the show very uneven. I was surprised at the number of rookies, and while some have claimed 90 rookies is not out of the ordinary in drum corps today, though I would question that. While some of the corps that place near the top have a good number of "rookouts," most have marched with other corps, and in many cases WC corps, and while they might be rookies to that corps, they are not rookies to the activity. My guess would be most of the kids in Spirit are new to the activity. If Spirit wants to keep these rookies, which would be critical, they need a better show, which is obvious. They need to capture that spark they had in 2011, 2012, and 2013, as well as try and recreate the Spirit sound, which for those of us who remember it know it had not only volume but intensity and passion. They also need to create a bond, which I understand was missing this year. This will be a challenge. My guess is that next year, competition will be stronger, especially after this year. Oh, and regarding Spirit being beaten by a "Division II" corps, we could argue that BDB and SCVC should be competing in WC rather than OC, and I think that 17th yesterday was due more to a lackluster performance by Spirit since the previous day Spirit was two points ahead of BDB . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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