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A "Tradition Corps"? What do you think?


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LThis corps, called TRADITION, tours with it, competes (knowing they're not competitive) - however - they are a fan favorite in a big way (because it emotionally reaches, tributes history, alumni, tradition, etc;).

Alumniof... This is what you need to understand. Modern drum corps does EXACTLY all that and more. Do you even realize how many modern shows used music that has been done by OLD DRUMCORPS? I would venture to say that atleast half of the literature used in World Class has been done before.

Every corps has a unique style and we may look at their show rep and go "oh, that's so Crown" or "Oh, that's so Cadets, Madison etc." Why do you think that is?! That's because they have developed a tradition on what their corps "is" and they have held up that tradition over the decades! Cadets? Phantom? Madison? Boston? etc. Who can deny that their music and shows appease to the corps tradition, alumni, style etc.? Perhaps only those that choose to listen and watch modern corps with their eyes and ears shut and complain that its not the 1980's.

There is a very ACTIVE and very EVIDENT and OBVIOUS movement in modern corps to not only reference towards a corps' tradition and history but also to create emotional/intellectual connections to the audience. If you do not see this it is because you choose not to see this and therefore refuse to be affected by it. The resentment goes so far down with individuals such as yourself that you would probably regret the day you actually find yourself enjoying a modern drum corps show as if it would be sacrilegious to your passionate history with "old school" drum corps.

You will never bring back the past. Ever. And you need to understand that NOTHING put on the field, (even if you designed it, even with this imaginary corps called "TRADITION"), would EVER meet your expectations. You will never be satisfied. Your nostalgia has corrupted your ability to enjoy modern drum corps.

However, if you ever choose to stop the self pity that you display on a daily basis on these boards you may one day open your eyes and see modern corps for what it is to hundreds of thousands that enjoy it; A beautiful balance and blend of tradition, innovation, entertainment, and art. One that understands where it came from but does not dwell on it. After all, corps in the 1980's did not have it as there goal to be like the corps of the 1950's so why would you expect the same appeasement to history of the 2010's corps? That element was NEVER part of drum corps and it is still true today. Get your fingers out of your ears! Open your eyes! Step out of the sepia tinted film real in your mind! You have a whole new world to love in modern corps.

OR you can complain and moan on the internet and watch dusty DVD's. I mean, the choice is yours, but really doesn't enjoying modern corps sound more fun?

Edited by charlie1223
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I remember watching cartoons on TV and laughing when my parents didn't and sometimes they laughed and we didn't? Today parents take their kids to animated movies and the same happens. Tradition! Troopers were innovative in the 1960's, Bridgemen were innovative in the 1970's, the stories go on. Respect the past, embrace the future. We were on a wild ride then! Same as now.

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How much of the general crowd is made up of alumni? The tribute shows I'm thinking of are replica's - meaning it's the same music and the same drill, the same guard routine. Taking this further - how awesome and educational would it be to the kids? Let's say the show for 2014 is 1979 Spirit of Atlanta. They learn about the history of Spirit, bring in actual old performing members of Spirit to talk and work with the kids, learn the stories, about Jim Ott. Also, since this tribute corps isn't going to pull the best of the best kids - couldn't it almost be a training ground - I mean the drill is so easy and the music not as difficult - it's almost a perfect landing place for the kids who didn't make Crown, Cadets, Devils, etc; Paying homage and respect to the history and legacy I think would make alumni feel relevant, proud, not forgotten and if anything just a break from what is, what's current. The fact there is no electronics would be reason enough to give a standing ovation before they played a single note.

Do you understand that what you are asking a Corps to do is to take such a Corps completely out of the chances of making Finals by the time they finish their first show in June ? Or maybe you don't realize this ? Or you do realize this, but you still want the Corps to go ahead and commit Hari Kari in placements anyway ?( and the loss of revenues, marcher talent that comes with this by season's end.) Do you fully understand what is being rewarded under the current judging sheets ? or not ? Not a flame, I 'm just trying to understand why you are calling for the patient's ( Corps ) self inflicted suicide here, thats all.

Edited by BRASSO
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Which is why I ended with "Of course, that is just one anecdotal example.".

Thats right..I likwise provided my own anecdotal, personal account ( different than yours ). But I went one step further in the discussion of the audience reception to the Jersey Surf show from 2012 to add further observation and assessment that the people beside you were more the exception reaction, rather than the prevailing reaction, nationally with the Jersey Surf's show production of 2012. Your personal anecdotal observation notwithstanding, Jersey Surf's 2012 show production ( quite apart from their placements ) was a big hit with audiences from coast to coast in 2012.

Edited by BRASSO
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Thats right..I likwise provided my own anecdotal, personal account ( different than yours ). But I went one step further in the discussion of the audience reception to the Jersey Surf show from 2012 to add further observation and assessment that the people beside you were more the exception reaction, rather than the prevailing reaction, nationally with the Jersey Surf's show production of 2012. Your personal anecdotal observation notwithstanding, Jersey Surf's 2012 show production ( quite apart from their placements ) was a big hit with audiences from coast to coast in 2012.

My own observation was it was more of an east coast thing, actually north east, but it worked for sure gaining them attention, which many if not all try to do. Like anything there's always mixed reactions to most all shows, even this one. I heard great things as to fun, audience, easy to read, etc etc but also heard the opposite, ( no verbs needed ) x Bridgemen were also honored, and some not so much..all in perspective I guess.

No doubt though, they did create a stir and thats the 1st thing in performing, ......getting talked about.........so was it a success? baring scores or placements................for them it was for sure.imo....probably the 1st time being talked about so much

Edited by GUARDLING
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My own observation was it was more of an east coast thing, actually north east, but it worked for sure gaining them attention, which many if not all try to do. Like anything there's always mixed reactions to most all shows, even this one. I heard great things as to fun, audience, easy to read, etc etc but also heard the opposite, ( no verbs needed ) x Bridgemen were also honored, and some not so much..all in perspective I guess.

No doubt though, they did create a stir and thats the 1st thing in performing, ......getting talked about.........so was it a success? baring scores or placements................for them it was for sure.imo....probably the 1st time being talked about so much

No. I disagree that the Jersey Surf of 2012 were only a hit in the " northeast ". While naturally one would expect the reaction to the production to be better in the northeast than elsewhere( it was afterall a show tribute to an iconic former Corps from the notheast ), it was also a hit that year wherever it was performed. Its not speculation. We have the verifiable sources that I listed above for such an overall assessment of the show being a hit with audiences from coast to coast ( many of whom might also agree with the placements too of JS in 2012 too I might add, but this placement assessment as being a correct one with audiences is not so readily determined, imo ). But the show was a hit.. not a miss.

Edited by BRASSO
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No. I disagree that the Jersey Surf of 2012 were only a hit in the " northeast ". While naturally one would expect the reaction to the production to be better in the northeast than elsewhere( it was afterall a show tribute to an iconic former Corps from the notheast ), it was also a hit that year wherever it was performed. Its not speculation. We have the verifiable sources that I listed above for such an overall assessment of the show being a hit with audiences from coast to coast ( many of whom might also agree with the placements too I might add, but this assessment is not so readily verified, imo )

Only thing Im saying is what I personally observed.....it was fun to many, others not so much...tribute shows for many dont mean anything and some involved were flattered some not so much...this I know for sure.

Over the years I have also heard verifiable sources of other corps say one thing and easily can see sometimes even that is very bias and people see and hear what they want....I heard that alot about Madison a few years ago and even their staff which I was very friendly with said " I dont remember that reaction at all " but all that aside ..as for Surf.as I said it got them alot of attention for sure so it was a success for them and that's what counts

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This has nothing to do with my love for the past, though, it is my reference point. Also, some of the anger at me is really unbelievable. Why? Because I'm your Joe Public. This is a true story - I went to Allentown last year - 1st show in 10 years. Why? It sucked 10 years ago and didn't feel like seeing more of it. To try to get me to do research and study to appreciate something is stupid. It sucked 10 years ago and it sucked last year. What sucked? Basically, all of the complaints alumni ##### about. There is a consensus. So, THAT'S REALITY. Moving forward - here was my observations of the crowd. They were bored. Out of their skulls. They just sat there and other than SCV - courtesy applause and courtesy ovations (I guess because they are kids). This isn't perception, this was reality. As I walked down the stadium ALL I HEARD was #####ing (kind of like on Drum Corps Planet). And what were they #####ing about? The same crap alumni is #####ing about on drum corps planet and other forums. The general audience are not YOU. I am more reflective of the general audience than you BASED ON MY EXPERIENCE IN ALLENTOWN. I brought my significant - she NEVER saw a drum corps show, but, she was in HS Marching Band. (BTW, I just realized I was in Atlanta in 2010 - obviously it was so memorable I completely forgot). Here is a FACT: There is a significant portion of the DCI alumni that DESPISES what's going on. Hates it, thinks it's ridiculous, pathetic, insulting, annoying, AND NONE OF IT HAS TO DO WITH THE KIDS. I heard them. I talked with them. On big #####-fest. The kids are merely participating in what's available - that's it. There are NO ALTERNATIVES. My significant was falling asleep. BORED! Why? Well, why are we trying to try and learn some subjective 10 dimensional life lesson, esoterically presented that is so unclear, twisted, to try and get. Music is supposed to be communication. It supposed to connect. Not isolate the listener. The corps aren't accomplishing this. This is not Stravinski. The average person (my significant other) wants to be entertained. That's why we ###### away over a grand to fly, rent, lounge, eat to Allentown. DCI is not entertaining TO A LARGE MAJORITY OF PEOPLE. Throw in my reference (my history in DCI) there is nothing for me to appreciate and everything for me to criticize. What's funny to me is all of you who are defending it. What are you watching that's enjoyable? Are we watching the same thing? I have a music education degree and I taught music in the schools, have a drum corps background. I'm not connecting. The thing is, entertainment should not require someone to watch something 10 times to appreciate it. I watch Olympic Figure Skating and I can see it once and appreciate it, like it, or not. Everything wants to be a circle. I didn't come to listen to your designers view of the world. Do I really love you? Really? Blue Devils Rite of whatever? Just because it's hard doesn't make it enjoyable. It's like watching chess or someone doing a mathmatics equation. Music is completely failing. How so? Look in your communities. Music is being cancelled in schools throughout the nation. Programs are getting smaller. Fewer people are caring. Who's fault is it? The audience? No - it's the music programs. The more they keep doing what they're doing, the more it fails. Does DCI have more or less corps than the 70's and 80's? Let me simplify it - how long do you feel like listening to someone who isn't clear and/or you can't understand them? How would you like for them to tell you that YOU are the problem because you don't appreciate them? If I want to sell a widget in China, do you think I should learn to speak Chinese. If I want to sell anything to anybody - maybe I should make them want what I'm selling. I don't want what's being served. And, there are no alternatives - so I'll ##### like everyone else and maybe someone will listen. But, we're dealing with music educators, not business people so guess where it will get me. Nowhere. And guess what happens - continual death to music education because nobody is listening to the people that keep them alive. Honestly, I don't think DCI will be here in 10 years. No way. It won't be able to sustain. I wouldn't bet my house - but I'd bet yours (that's a joke).

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Let's say a corps forms. This hypothetical corps is called "Tradition". They field 128 members and their SOLE PURPOSE is to perform OLD SHOWS. I'm talking - exactly true to the original - same score, same drill moves. For modernization sake, they have their own uniform, updated equipment (meaning they have a pit versus marching timpanis), they perform on G Bugles. The show could either be "an entire show" (for example 1980 Bridgeman) - or they would do combination (First they perform T.O.; then Elks Parade; then In the Stone; then Ice Castles. (Their end set would be the first set of the new song). This corps, called TRADITION, tours with it, competes (knowing they're not competitive) - however - they are a fan favorite in a big way (because it emotionally reaches, tributes history, alumni, tradition, etc;). Would this work? Would you like to see an organization be a tribute corps and exist among the ranks of touring drum corps? (I have a lot of free time on my hands today so mind is spinning).

we have them. they're called alumni corps.

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