Pete Freedman Posted March 19, 2014 Share Posted March 19, 2014 But, we not only live the culture of the world, we live in the culture of countries, smaller provinces or states, cities, and sub-culture groups. And a person who actually subscribes to the 'reality perception', relative truth', ‘no moral projection' philosophy cannot, without being grossly hypocritical, make a sub-culture group honor the reality, truth, and morals of the the larger culture. But nobody has those views in any pure way except sociopaths. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fsubone Posted March 19, 2014 Share Posted March 19, 2014 But nobody has those views in any pure way except sociopaths. Which everyone apparently is that's ever listened to a Lady Gaga song. Same way everyone who attended the Cabaret Voltaire threw bodily fluids around as art. No way any of those people could actually be great, contributing members of society outside of those venues. They must be terrible people who promote the degradation of society and are leading us all in a hand-basket to hell, and DCI designers are politicking for seats in that hand-basket. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GUARDLING Posted March 19, 2014 Share Posted March 19, 2014 (edited) I never state that they 'can't' hold those beliefs; that they 'can't' hold those opinions; that they 'can't' engage in debate. I just state that I disagree with them and I think they are wrong; just like they state that they disagree with me and think that I am wrong. That is called free debate. And while we (thankfully) do live in the most free society in the world, our freedoms are (again thankfully) tempered via a Constitution, Laws, Rules, Regulations, ... ie free speech does not apply to falsely yelling Fire in a crowded movie house, nor does complete free speech apply to DCP. And as for drawing the legal and moral lines, and wait to jump on me here; I do draw the lines... and so do you if you are legally allowed to vote in the United States. Sometimes I am on the side which draws them, sometimes you are on the side that draws them. But we, you, me, every citizen, actually do draw the lines. But here is the rub: a person who actually believes in ‘perception is reality’ ‘truth is relative’, ‘we cannot project our beliefs onto others’ cannot live in such a society and live by their own philosophy. The only way they can live correctly in their own philosophy would be if there were no laws, no rules, no regulations, and we never projected any of our own beliefs onto anyone else. YOU SEE again ..you do exactly what you say others do. YOU are falsely yelling fire with this entire thread...several have asked you what it has to do with the activity and give some examples..which you dont answer....you also live in the perception is reality..because what you dont see is that YOUR reality, you believe completely and weill only use extreme examples to back what YOU believe ...dismissing others..so you actually do what you claim you dont..I also dont think you debate..what you do is try to convince or justify which theres no need to convince anyone if those are your beliefs. Edited March 19, 2014 by GUARDLING 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fsubone Posted March 19, 2014 Share Posted March 19, 2014 Here's a hypothetical situation---- I'm driving down the freeway in my car, when a Lady Gaga song comes across on my radio. If I don't instantly turn my radio off, pull it out of my dashboard, and throw it out the window at 70 miles an hour; am I now someone who supports and approves of Lady Gaga's stage performances, or someone who just doesn't care enough to turn it off? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
charlie1223 Posted March 19, 2014 Share Posted March 19, 2014 (edited) I never state that they 'can't' hold those beliefs; that they 'can't' hold those opinions; that they 'can't' engage in debate. I just state that I disagree with them and I think they are wrong; just like they state that they disagree with me and think that I am wrong. That is called free debate. And while we (thankfully) do live in the most free society in the world, are freedoms are (again thankfully) tempered via a Constitution, Laws, Rules, Regulations, ... ie free speech does not apply to falsely yelling Fire in a crowded movie house, nor does complete free speech apply to DCP. And as for drawing the legal and moral lines, and wait to jump on me here; I do draw the lines... and so do you if you are legally allowed to vote in the United States. Sometimes I am on the side which draws them, sometimes you are on the side that draws them. But we, you, me, every citizen, actually do draw the lines. But here is the rub: a person who actually believes in ‘perception is reality’ ‘truth is relative’, ‘we cannot project our beliefs onto others’ cannot live in such a society and live by their own philosophy. The only way they can live correctly in their own philosophy would be if there were no laws, no rules, no regulations, and we never projected any of our own beliefs onto anyone else. So... Can someone who believes in an ""absolute truth"/"i can project my beliefs onto others", live in such a society and correctly live by their own philosophy? And here's a fun little video for you. Start at 5:53. Edited March 19, 2014 by charlie1223 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete Freedman Posted March 19, 2014 Share Posted March 19, 2014 Which everyone apparently is that's ever listened to a Lady Gaga song. Same way everyone who attended the Cabaret Voltaire threw bodily fluids around as art. No way any of those people could actually be great, contributing members of society outside of those venues. They must be terrible people who promote the degradation of society and are leading us all in a hand-basket to hell, and DCI designers are politicking for seats in that hand-basket. Voted worst AC/DC song of all time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stu Posted March 19, 2014 Author Share Posted March 19, 2014 Which everyone apparently is that's ever listened to a Lady Gaga song. Same way everyone who attended the Cabaret Voltaire threw bodily fluids around as art. No way any of those people could actually be great, contributing members of society outside of those venues. They must be terrible people who promote the degradation of society and are leading us all in a hand-basket to hell, and DCI designers are politicking for seats in that hand-basket. Nice try; but if people actually read my postings concerning Gaga, Dada, Art, Artists, Fans, they will discover that I never made any of those grossly over-generalization type of claims, and that you are now engaging in hyperbole spin. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
charlie1223 Posted March 19, 2014 Share Posted March 19, 2014 Nice try; but if people actually read my postings concerning Gaga, Dada, Art, Artists, Fans, they will discover that I never made any of those grossly over-generalization type of claims, and that you are now engaging in hyperbole spin. So are these statements, in response to someone asking if your post about the Lady Gaga Vomit Story was serious, not hyperbole? Yes; this is seriously the direction progression performance art is going within our modern culture. And yes, many have posted on DCP that they see DCI as performance art; and have the desire to progress with the rest of our performance art culture. You seem to be hyperbolic about the direction of performance art in modern culture, the link between DCI performance art and Lady Gaga's performance art, and the "postings" of people on DCP that want DCI performing art to be like Lady Gaga's performing art. Is that a misrepresentation of your comments? 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stu Posted March 19, 2014 Author Share Posted March 19, 2014 YOU SEE again ..you do exactly what you say others do. YOU are falsely yelling fire with this entire thread...several have asked you what it has to do with the activity and give some examples..which you dont answer....you also live in the perception is reality..because what you dont see is that YOUR reality, you believe completely and weill only use extreme examples to back what YOU believe ...dismissing others..so you actually do what you claim you dont..I also dont think you debate..what you do is try to convince or justify which theres no need to convince anyone if those are your beliefs. I have given examples of why I have pause for concern for DCI; but they have been conveniently ignored. While BD did not engage in debauchery, they did lift up a venue which not only allowed it but celebrated it; while adultery and sexual acts were not performed, Boston did give a wink, wink to giving in to sexual temptation as being acceptable behavior; while no one has performed any of the Gaga depravity on the field, many have posted that they not only consume her art and defend her antics, they would one day like to see a Gaga type show concept done by a DCI corps. What was immediately thrown back at me, even though I have given examples of my concerns for DCI, was how I dare call this current cultural artistic trend depraved, how dare I make judgements, that my concerns are rather prudish, that I am closed minded and need to just become more accepting, that while Cabaret Voltaire allowed some of the most vile things to be performed it did have some non-depraved art performed and BD only presented the non-depraved side so that makes it ok, ad infinitum. And I am more than willing to throw it back for debate. So, it is up to you to accept or reject the examples I have provided, but to say that I have not provided them is an inaccurate statement. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stu Posted March 19, 2014 Author Share Posted March 19, 2014 Here's a hypothetical situation---- I'm driving down the freeway in my car, when a Lady Gaga song comes across on my radio. If I don't instantly turn my radio off, pull it out of my dashboard, and throw it out the window at 70 miles an hour; am I now someone who supports and approves of Lady Gaga's stage performances, or someone who just doesn't care enough to turn it off? If you have not purchased her materials or purposely download her performances on Youtube or Pandora for your own interest, you would be an indifferent person who just does not care to shut it off. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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