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Why do People Feel the Blue Devils are so Innovative?


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There is no variety in drum corps today. A typical DC show BITD would feature corps who played jazz, spanish, british, scottish, broadway, & more. Today everyone plays the same generic symphonic music. Businesses fail because consumers no longer want their product. DCI has been failing for 20+ years now. It would behoove DCI & the drum corps themselves to actually listen to fans & what they they like & what they dont like.

drum corps has been failing way before the 20 years you mention. look back to the loss from the 70s. Seems like you are not seeing beyond your own years. Do you realize that many by the time you march already felt the decline?

Ok lets talk variety. You really believe that BD, PR, Madison, Boston, Cavies, Cadets, Spirit all look alike? I took some pretty obvious corps that to me look nothing alike in style. Lets assume all the rest are alike ( which they aren't ) there's 7 out of 12 different...not enough? You want DCI to listen to fans? which ones are those the ones leaving or the ones liking whats presented.

My marching glory days were around the same as yours and YES it was special and yes there are many things I wish could return BUT I feel the same about alot of things in life that have changed ,but to say it isn't as good or doesn't have variety or that these kids are doing way more than we could have dreamed of is just silly and wrong IMO.

We always look at decline of something and blame change on it but never think about if not for change would we even be around anymore. Personally being very directly involved till today I say the latter.

Edited by GUARDLING
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drum corps has been failing way before the 20 years you mention. look back to the loss from the 70s. Seems like you are not seeing beyond your own years. Do you realize that many by the time you march already felt the decline?

Ok lets talk variety. You really believe that BD, PR, Madison, Boston, Cavies, Cadets, Spirit all look alike? I took some pretty obvious corps that to me look nothing alike in style. Lets assume all the rest are alike ( which they aren't ) there's 7 out of 12 different...not enough? You want DCI to listen to fans? which ones are those the ones leaving or the ones liking whats presented.

My marching glory days were around the same as yours and YES it was special and yes there are many things I wish could return BUT I feel the same about alot of things in life that have changed ,but to say it isn't as good or doesn't have variety or that these kids are doing way more than we could have dreamed of is just silly and wrong IMO.

We always look at decline of something and blame change on it but never think about if not for change would we even be around anymore. Personally being very directly involved till today I say the latter.

Remove the visual from the equation...and yea...alot of corps do sound alike due to music choice or music arrangement (at least to me)....If you played all of the corps mentioned above...without knowing ahead of time who they were...it might be a challenge to assign music to corps correctly..I think...in alot of cases, it's the visual that creates the difference, not the music...not that that has anything to do with the topic of this thread...

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Remove the visual from the equation...and yea...alot of corps do sound alike due to music choice or music arrangement (at least to me)....If you played all of the corps mentioned above...without knowing ahead of time who they were...it might be a challenge to assign music to corps correctly..I think...in alot of cases, it's the visual that creates the difference, not the music...not that that has anything to do with the topic of this thread...

ya know i was going to edit what I said to include sound. I certainly would know PR from BD to Madison I don't think any of these corps are alike at all. Youre right also about this thread. I mentioned earlier that i thought it also had nothing to do with it and wasn't sure to go down this path that has actually been beatin to death almost every year. ( since 1972...lol )

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Remove the visual from the equation...and yea...alot of corps do sound alike due to music choice or music arrangement (at least to me)....If you played all of the corps mentioned above...without knowing ahead of time who they were...it might be a challenge to assign music to corps correctly..I think...in alot of cases, it's the visual that creates the difference, not the music...not that that has anything to do with the topic of this thread...

You might be right about music, though I think arrangement styles amongst the top-achieving corps vary at the very least (I'm admittedly not over-analytical with the lower-achieving corps, who might be looking to climb the ranks via imitating the top corps' designs). That being said, DCI is an audio/visual medium were we are far past the point of one aspect being able to stand on its own without the other. I'm not saying that's good or bad, but that does seem to be where the activity is at (I personally love it; I don't listen to drum corps arrangements on my iPhone or CDs anymore, and prefer to watch videos of the full presentations - as designers intend now-a-days)

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There is no variety in drum corps today. A typical DC show BITD would feature corps who played jazz, spanish, british, scottish, broadway, & more. Today everyone plays the same generic symphonic music. Businesses fail because consumers no longer want their product. DCI has been failing for 20+ years now. It would behoove DCI & the drum corps themselves to actually listen to fans & what they they like & what they dont like.

there is variety in music chosen. however arranging trends do make things seem very by the numbers.

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I absolutely know what you're saying and I agree somewhat with what you're saying. I have a very difficult time differentiating between the different styles today too because the activity is just so homogenized. I don't want to get too off track of the intent of the thread, but I think it's not what corps are playing, it's how they're arranged. It's how they're scored. But you have to concede that there are different styles being played the last few years too.

You want British and Scottish music? Blue Knights did that in 2011. ...and I'll tell you that I heard Jim Prime Jr's old school arranging style in the first part of the show, and I heard Bocook's style too. You want broadway? SCV did that last year. You want Jazz? Spirit did that a bit, and they even had Boerma arrange the music. Some of the older Scout's sound was present there. Other corps are doing jazz a bit, but they're not as many corps doing it. Certainly BD isn't doing the same kind of jazz, but they still do compose some very complex shows with jazz-esque chords. You want Spanish? Well so do I, but it's not popular anymore. I think that ship sailed by the mid 90s. Madison had a bit in their 2012 show with Malaga and Malaguena. Crown's interpretation of Puck was a bit Spanish sounding in 2009. Maybe I should say, Latin(o) sounding... They even played a Rock show. No, it wasn't the rock "opera" Tommy ala Blue Devils, but it was a rock show ( and they did borrow Piano Concerto No. 2 from BD)... So while I hear what you're saying, corps are trying to play more than symphonic music. I really feel it's the popular arranging style which gets in the way from our enjoyment.

Honestly, people are jumping all over themselves over BD's rep announcement. I'm not sold on everything, but they're playing something that was freakin' composed for them by Gordan Goodman. Go check him out. Jazz.....

Like, legit jazz............

Madison's playing freaking Stan Kenton and Don Ellis. Yea, the trombones are a bummer. They could be playing on some tromboniums, but it's freakin' big band jazz, cat.

Bluecoats are playing some freaky stuff that's certainly not "symphonic" music.

Boston's doing something with Animal Farm in the show title...

Crossmen are playing some Eastern Europe Gypsy music... No, it's not Spanish, or even Latin, but it's a different style.

Troopers are playing "Trooper music"

SCV is playing Scheherazade

Cavies are playing something that will probably be classical and dark.

Colts are playing Pink Floyd, Radio Head, and The Wizard of Oz.

Phantom is playing "Swan Lake".

I could go on.... Point is there is variety in the repertoire, but now the arrangers need to step up and make sure it doesn't all sound the same and I have hope that many of these arrangers will be successful.

No, BD is going to sound like BD. SCV is going to sound like Phan, er SCV. Phantom is going to sound like Glass... er Phantom... et cetera.... But there certainly is a chance for variety this year that wasn't there some years in the past.

People are going to eat up Radio Head. They're going to love what the Bluecoats do, and apparently BD has a winning thing going this year with the posters here on DCP. My only worry is not the "what" (variety) it's the how (homogenized arrangements, and chop-n-bop, too much synth and pit).

:withstupid:

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You might be right about music, though I think arrangement styles amongst the top-achieving corps vary at the very least (I'm admittedly not over-analytical with the lower-achieving corps, who might be looking to climb the ranks via imitating the top corps' designs). That being said, DCI is an audio/visual medium were we are far past the point of one aspect being able to stand on its own without the other. I'm not saying that's good or bad, but that does seem to be where the activity is at (I personally love it; I don't listen to drum corps arrangements on my iPhone or CDs anymore, and prefer to watch videos of the full presentations - as designers intend now-a-days)

i think to many, it's tipped too far towards visual and has been building this way for 14 years

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i think to many, it's tipped too far towards visual and has been building this way for 14 years

psssssssst: it's tipped this way from the 70s with 27th lancers, PR, Bridgemen, Star,, they all had great music programs but knew visually what had to be done. I remember wayyyyyy back when as a horn player , I was told by a very wise visual icon in the activity, " visual is where it's going" get the experience now and run with it. I dropped my horn after several years and never looked back. Not, saying that was for everyone but ceratinly worked for me.

Thank You George Zingali

Edited by GUARDLING
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there is variety in music chosen. however arranging trends do make things seem very by the numbers.

Hmm.. 2014's 1st place , 2nd, and 3rd place couldn't have been more different in their approaches to arranging. Yep -- everyone sounds the same. :doh:

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Hmm.. 2014's 1st place , 2nd, and 3rd place couldn't have been more different in their approaches to arranging. Yep -- everyone sounds the same. :doh:

You pointed out the exceptions, not the rule. Used to be the other way around. ..and maybe that's why they were 1st, 2nd, and 3rd.

See my previous post about BD and their masterful arranging, which also praises Klesch and Shaw as some of the best around.

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