DCIFan44

Creativity at the Top

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Which of your 15 questions you posed for us here are rhetorical in nature ( and thus, in no need of a response reply), and which of the 15 questions here are you actually seeking a response reply from us ?

Well, since I already have answers of my very own, these questions are here for anyone to answer or ponder or ignore or whatever.

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After reading all these posts, some questions come to mind. Some of these are rhetorical.

How often is "too often" for any source material?

Can even "overused" source materia be utilizized in new ways?

Are Cadets and SCV merely rehashing old shows, or are they exploring new ideas?

Is it possible that Rimsky-Korsakov and Copland might be better "suppliers of source music" than some other composers represented? In this question, I don't refer to the arranger.

What is the most utilized piece of source music, and when was it last utilized?

Who is doing something unique this year? What elements make it unique? Are those elements new? Is anyone else using those elements albeit in some different way?

Even given changes in judge sheets over many years, is the relationship of design to execution that different over time? Does the Cadets placement in 1986 have any relation to the design team change that year? And the next?

I'm not offering opinions at ths point, but I'm interested as to if people can quantify their opinions or if most if us have subjective opinions based on external values, ie. I want my corps to win, therefore their show is better.

"Too often", in my opinion, is when the majority of the fans start to think "oh, this again? really?". I personally think the people you will find on DCP are the long-time superfans, so if a corps does something they did 25 years ago, you'll gear grumblings of it being unoriginal and doing it "again". I don't think the majority of fans in the stands are like that, however. I think you have parents, friends, members of HS bands being brought to shows, etc. In other words, a rotating fan base that I would give a 3-4 year lifespan to. I mentioned it in another thread - my daughter has been coming to shows with me for the past 2 years (Allentown). A week or two ago she saw West Side Story (the movie) for the first time ever, and she said to me how that would be cool music for a corps to do. She's never hear any corps do it, but if Cadets were doing WSS this year DCP would be filled with "oh my god, WSS AGAIN!? can't they come up with something original" posts.

I also think "too often" or "overused" should have ZERO meaning to a judge, and I hope it actually is that way.

As to your "can overused source material be utilized in new ways" question, personally, I've always felt that when corps do source material they've done in the past, the newer versions never seem to be as good, probably BECAUSE they're trying to be different or unique because of having done it in the past.

Edited by frachel

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For how long has the "Sunburst" been a staple ingredient of the Troopers? (Rhetorical)

There are certain elements which many, many Corps have used over the years as an identifying feature of that Corps. I find myself many times hoping to see (yet again, I know) that given identifying feature from the given Corps -- merely so that I can find enhanced joy whenever they've done the "old" thing in a "new" way. And even if it isn't always "new," there is a comfort level found -- a sense of completeness, if you will -- whenever that feature is seen. BAC has Waldo (all one needs to do is to see the forum response to the latest photos...case closed). For years, SCV had the bottle dance. Each Corps has its own.

Sometimes it's like seeing that old friend who you haven't seen since high school. Yes, they've changed (sometimes for the better, and sometimes for the worse). But there's always a "hug" of recognition there -- and in that recognition (and the accompanying "hug") comes the meaning. Do we "judge" that old friend if they haven't changed? No. But has a change in that person -- greater maturity, personal growth, etc. -- make them even more special in our eyes? Of course. We're only human. Thank God.

I agree with you, Frachel. "Too often" or "overused" should have NO meaning to a judge. And to be honest...I strongly doubt it does.

Edited by HornTeacher

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To give a short, simple answer to the OP: based on what I've seen and heard from others, there is an overall lack of creativity in the top 6-8 this year. Some exceptions, like BD and BC and perhaps Cavies, but a little too much rehash from others all in the same year.

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To give a short, simple answer to the OP: based on what I've seen and heard from others, there is an overall lack of creativity in the top 6-8 this year. Some exceptions, like BD and BC and perhaps Cavies, but a little too much rehash from others all in the same year.

Based on what I've seen and heard for myself, I have to wonder why people think this. Understanding that perception becomes reality, I'm wondering how people are quantifying this.

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The OP has a point, but I don't really mind. SCV has put on some of the most entertaining shows in the activity in the last few years. There are a lot of DCI fans that like the classics, and there is nothing wrong with that. Although BD is not my favorite corps, I am a big defender of what they put on the field. It is fresh and interesting. But I'll also defend SCV's shows every day of the week. The great thing is that both can coexist at the top of the activity, as can the way other corps like the Bluecoats and Crown. Just put a high quality, entertaining show on the field and I'll be happy. Appalachian Spring is a beautiful piece of music that has a long tradition in drum corps. I never get tired of it. If every corps did it every year, that would be one thing. But hearing it once a year isn't a burden to me.

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The OP has a point, but I don't really mind. SCV has put on some of the most entertaining shows in the activity in the last few years. There are a lot of DCI fans that like the classics, and there is nothing wrong with that. Although BD is not my favorite corps, I am a big defender of what they put on the field. It is fresh and interesting. But I'll also defend SCV's shows every day of the week. The great thing is that both can coexist at the top of the activity, as can the way other corps like the Bluecoats and Crown. Just put a high quality, entertaining show on the field and I'll be happy. Appalachian Spring is a beautiful piece of music that has a long tradition in drum corps. I never get tired of it. If every corps did it every year, that would be one thing. But hearing it once a year isn't a burden to me.

I dunno, after West Side Story, some Copland and the Planets are next on my list of wanting to ban for a while. I work with high school marching bands, so the repetition is magnified there, with so many more bands out there.

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Ok... but. " Pines of Rome " ( First Mov.) was done by Star of Indiana ( 1991). My guess, you unintentionally misspoke, and actually are hoping that some modern DCI Corps recreates their show " Roman Images " in that entirety( not just do the " Pines of Rome" ( First Mov. ) portion of Star's show.. Is this what you meant to say ?

I think the Star of Indiana actually played very little from "Pines"...(that amazing company front that came out of nowhere to the end of the opener).

Either way the way that Jim Prime put it all together was fresher than what any corps has done since.

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Ya' want to know what "Creative" is?

It's that which the OP threw out that so successfully spawned another design/execution "discussion" without implying in any way that that was his intention.

Great job, OP! And on your second post!

You sure figured out what button to push to make a good first impression!

(Not personal to you, OP. Just more of my dry, sardonic wit.)

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For how long has the "Sunburst" been a staple ingredient of the Troopers? (Rhetorical)

There are certain elements which many, many Corps have used over the years as an identifying feature of that Corps. I find myself many times hoping to see (yet again, I know) that given identifying feature from the given Corps -- merely so that I can find enhanced joy whenever they've done the "old" thing in a "new" way. And even if it isn't always "new," there is a comfort level found -- a sense of completeness, if you will -- whenever that feature is seen. BAC has Waldo (all one needs to do is to see the forum response to the latest photos...case closed). For years, SCV had the bottle dance. Each Corps has its own.

Sometimes it's like seeing that old friend who you haven't seen since high school. Yes, they've changed (sometimes for the better, and sometimes for the worse). But there's always a "hug" of recognition there -- and in that recognition (and the accompanying "hug") comes the meaning. Do we "judge" that old friend if they haven't changed? No. But has a change in that person -- greater maturity, personal growth, etc. -- make them even more special in our eyes? Of course. We're only human. Thank God.

I agree with you, Frachel. "Too often" or "overused" should have NO meaning to a judge. And to be honest...I strongly doubt it does.

the only time I could think of it affecting a judges call is if it's crammed in there for the sake of being crammed in there....i.e. not making any sense, just done to be done.

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