Creativity at the Top

[Rifuarian]

I prefer it when corps try out new repertoire, but there's more to being creative than just playing new stuff. Vanguard 2009 and 2010, for example, played music that had been featured in legendary drum corps shows, but put their own twist and interpration on it and made it their own. That, to me, is more creative than blasting a new piece of music beyond all recognition with the generic-drum-corps-arranging beam (GDCAB) and throwing it out on the field.

[GUARDLING]

Great post BRASSO.

I agree to an extent. I think it's become all about what that GE caption and the secondary caption that ensures the design judged more than performance is Analysis.... Now with the Analysis caption you can be judged on overall content and design elements present within the program. But... That said what ever creation is made, still relies on execution by the performers.... Is it equal? Not likely

The reason it is so heavy to design or visual is IMO it is a visual medium other wise it could just be a concert BUT more than that NOW compared to BITD what you do visually runs through all captions. It used to be you could squad turn, the rear march and now and then make a company front and that was effect. Didn't matter if it made sense or not, just play loud and make a company front and BAM! effect was turning a horn line to the back to create a softer sound , turn and BAM! well that doesnt work today, it is through every move, every phrase of music, every transition. SO yes, there is MUCH MORE demand put on those who create. MUCH MORE!

[GUARDLING]

design should be the tie breaker when performance is even. too often design gets way too much latitude for performance issues

it runs through all captions and thats why it carries so much weight. but I agree IF , and thats a big if,..if all things are equal design becomes the tie breaker

[BRASSO]

Under the current sheets, a solitary Guard member is more valued on the current sheets than a solitary brass player is. Guards number 28-43 in performance competition, brass number 64-80. Brass players are judged on both their brass playing and their Visuals. But Guards play no instuments. They utilize dance moves, and instruments that are scored entirely on the Visual ( non musical ) captions. Logically then, we can see that it is the Guards and the Visuals that the Adults that create the Shows look to to effectively convey the theme and to drive the points that can be had in these shows. Crown has an outstanding brass line, but they don't feature brass soloists to secure their build up points... they look to the Visual side.( these top Corps let Madison Scouts trot out the brass soloist, duos, trios, sextets, etc and so forth, knowing full well that this is no longer how you get the points on the current sheets no matter how high they can scream, or play. ) BD figured this all out years ago, when they beefed up their Guard, Visual. Today, arguably the single biggest "wow " moment of the year is from the Bluecoats. And it is both illustrative as well as symbolic that is is a non instrument playing ( neither Brass, nor Percussion ), but a Visual move ( coupled with synthetic sound ) that generates the GE, and thus the most points there to be had on the current judging sheets.... and lest we forget, it was a VISUAL change ( gimmicky, sure, but highly effective ) late in the season of 2008 that catapulted Phantom to their title. We can cite another 100 exanples of where it was a Visual move that got the Corps the most points, not the Brass solo, Drum solo, etc. The effects over the years of WGI, ( and to some degree the visuals found in BOA ) can not be overemphasized, imo.

Edited July 11, 2014 by BRASSO

[1956OPR]

on GE for indoor in some cases I agree, but the paint drying aspect to me happens for more often on the guard side then on the percussion side.

Many names that have judged effect for DCI have done WGI, or in local circuits that follow WGi's philosophy. While wording on the sheets is there for a reason, it seems this year in DCI, it's actually being applied

Jeff, I agree with you on the guard comment.

For clarity, my question is with respect to WGI's philosophy : what differentiates WGI's judging "philosophy" from DCIs, and is the difference "corrupting" DCI judging? E.G., what current DCI judges seem to have adopted this WGI philosophy and is there an adverse impact on DCI results.

I may be totally off base but Marie C. comes to mind as an example.

Visual, as I understand it, is the "modern" term for M&M ( marching and maneuvering for younger drum corps fans ) . Has exotic body movement, props, et al surpressed or surpassed marching technique and design accomplishment in today's drum corps environment?

Is it time to upgrade the value of brass and percussion on the judging sheets to outweigh the value of such nebulous concepts as visual?

Edited July 11, 2014 by 1956OPR

[GUARDLING]

people do forget that even BITD visuals drove scores. even when #s seemed to be in the favor of other things. George Z. told me way back when to jump on the visuals , thats where it is and going ( I was a horn at the time ) with all due respect to some drill moves, some drum solos, etc etc. often what the guard did NO I DIDN"T SAY these other sections weren't a part of it all ( 27th for 1 )( PR another ) blew people away at the time with the color, excitement, the visual. For me it was the reason I throw my horn aside before it was to late and ran to the guard my last 2 years.

it was more a part of the past than most realize I think or willing to believe.JMO

Edited July 11, 2014 by GUARDLING

[caliswift]

Maybe I'm the odd man out, but I like it when someone takes an "old show" and redoes it in an innovative way. I understand frustration when it's "safe" or not innovative enough to really see the reason in doing the "old show" again. I've longed to see certain shows redone with today's skill level and show design ability. I'd love to see Pines of Rome done by one of today's corps.

[GUARDLING]

Maybe I'm the odd man out, but I like it when someone takes an "old show" and redoes it in an innovative way. I understand frustration when it's "safe" or not innovative enough to really see the reason in doing the "old show" again. I've longed to see certain shows redone with today's skill level and show design ability. I'd love to see Pines of Rome done by one of today's corps.

I agree,sometimes , i repeat , sometimes it is very interesting to see a corps take an old theme and make it more current to today.

Edited July 11, 2014 by GUARDLING

[BRASSO]

I've longed to see certain shows redone with today's skill level and show design ability. I'd love to see Pines of Rome done by one of today's corps.

As recently as 2 years ago, ( 2012 ) Boston played" Pines of Rome " as their opener.

[corpsband]

DCI now is essentially about Adults judging Adults. Show Design is valued significantly higher.....'its the Show Design, Stupid !! "

As usual Brasso has it upside backwards and sideways.

Of COURSE design matters. But -- it matters in both music and visual.

Do the performers write the music? No -- they execute it.

Do the performers write the guard work? No (well mostly -- guard is a little different and performers can and do contribute).

Design is definitely important. But great design is nothing without performers bringing it to life.

Music depends on great musicians bringing it alive.

The design provides the vehicle/framework. The performers bring it to life. BOTH MATTER.