GUARDLING Posted July 11, 2014 Share Posted July 11, 2014 I can put together the prettiest lattice-crusted Strawberry-Rhubarb pie you've ever seen. (Even better than anyone's Dear Ol' Mom). However -- if I leave it in the oven twice as long as I should (poor baking execution)...well....anyone want to try a piece? yup there are a few shows this year that the design intent was pretty cool BUT will not go anywhere ( except maybe down ) due to the fact it's a mess. ( and they arent listening) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
corpsband Posted July 11, 2014 Share Posted July 11, 2014 (edited) well my friend no matter how much you think and how many times you say it was different it wasnt..more now maybe ok .....lol..If you dont think 27s guard drove that corps you are mighty mistaken, same with PR and there were plenty of theme shows..cavies circus goes back to the beginning of DCI..Bridgemen threw the war theme, several WWS. Cadets no more war.Sure execution was maybe more a part of things , maybe because people didnt understand what to do with the new process,BUT the design process and the evolution was in its infancy. Does any of this really matter though? what difference does it make . The point is ,,hell , who knows what the point is anymore...Ok desgin now, as corpsband said good design needs good execution to be a winner. CAnt pull off a good show if it isnt done well. One or two this year will prove that theory. i'm not even sure that is true. sure if you look at the sheets it appears as if the captions were all about execution. BUT if the arranger didn't write well, no amount of execution was going to save a show. and if the drill writer wrote drill that didn't highlight the musical book properly (or was not achievable or just plain didn't make sense) no amount of execution would save the performers. that's EXACTLY the situation we're in today. IMO design has ALWAYS been a pre-condition to success. the design has become far more sophisiticated -- yes. the activity has evolved. but the idea the it's all about design today and was all about the perfomers in the past is just naive and mis-informed. it still takes design, instruction and performance. just as it always has. Edited July 11, 2014 by corpsband 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GUARDLING Posted July 11, 2014 Share Posted July 11, 2014 i'm not even sure that is true. sure if you look at the sheets it appears as if the captions were all about execution. BUT if the arranger didn't write well, no amount of execution was going to save a show. and if the drill writer wrote drill that didn't highlight the musical book properly (or was not achievable or just plain didn't make sense) no amount of execution would save the performers. that's EXACTLY the situation we're in today. IMO design has ALWAYS been a pre-condition to success. the design has become far more sophisiticated -- yes. the activity has evolved. but the idea the it's all about design today and was all about the perfomers in the past is just naive and mis-informed. it still takes design, instruction and performance. just as it always has. I agree, what I'm saying is sure execution may have been talked about more bitd only because it's all most knew BUT the design of things were there. If it werent most corps would have just stood there for a good score. It may have been alot more simple than today..and it was BUT was still a factor. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
corpsband Posted July 11, 2014 Share Posted July 11, 2014 (edited) I agree, what I'm saying is sure execution may have been talked about more bitd only because it's all most knew BUT the design of things were there. If it werent most corps would have just stood there for a good score. It may have been alot more simple than today..and it was BUT was still a factor. agree. design was simpler -- but no less important. bad design would break show just as easily 40 years ago as it would today. and the people responsible for design were adults. just like today :-) Edited July 11, 2014 by corpsband Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BRASSO Posted July 11, 2014 Share Posted July 11, 2014 (edited) ". BK's wonderful 2012 show 'Avian' as compared to the Cadets Christmas show...who placed higher? . Well, lets look at this to find out, since you brought this up. I know that as a former Dino judge BITD, you loved this BK 2012 show design, but its clear that, insofar as this is concerned, you and the current DCI judges are worlds apart. This is because in the all important Show Design captions, ts pretty clear that the judges in 2012 loved the Cadets Christmas Show Design WAY better than BK's " Avian " Show Design . For example, regarding the all important Show Design captions for 2012 at Finals between The Cadets and BK we find the following : G E Visual........ Cadets, 5th....... BK, 9th Music Ana. Cadets 4th.........BK 10th Vis. Ana...........Cadets 4th..........BK 7th Music Ana........Cadets 4th BK 11th So what we conclude from this is that BK's 2012 Show Design was a dud compared to The Cadets Show Design, and as such, no amount of marcher " performance and execution " ( if they had it in, Brass, Percussion, Guard..... which they didn't ), was going to allow them to compete favorably with the Cadets that season, as that Show Design, by itself, prevented them from ever having a fighting chance in 2012.... no matter even IF the BK's MM's had performed and executed their show as well as the Cadets did in the Brass, Percussion, Guard and the other performance execution captions.. Edited July 11, 2014 by BRASSO Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GUARDLING Posted July 11, 2014 Share Posted July 11, 2014 agree. design was simpler -- but no less important. bad design would break show just as easily 40 years ago as it would today. agree, and it did with many. I remember as a very young instructor , and even before as a MM making design changes over and over. WELL, I assume it was for a reason and were being told something wasnt working Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HornTeacher Posted July 11, 2014 Share Posted July 11, 2014 It seems that it's rather fruitless to compare "Design vs. Execution" BITD to "Design vs. Execution" as it applies to the present day, simply because we're judging the BITD components based on our contemporary standard(s). Of course BITD "design" had less apparent weight -- because such design standards as we know them now didn't exist then. And when a component hasn't yet been created, it ceases to have any application at that time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GUARDLING Posted July 11, 2014 Share Posted July 11, 2014 Well, lets look at this to find out, since you brought this up. I know that as a former judge BITD, you loved this BK 2012 show design, but its clear that, insofar as this is concerned, you and the current DCI judges are worlds apart. This is because in the all important Show Design captions, ts pretty clear that the judges in 2012 loved the Cadets Christmas Show Design WAY better than BK's " Avian " Show Design . For example, regarding the all important Show Design captions for 2012 at Finals between The Cadets and BK we find the following : G E Visual........ Cadets, 5th....... BK, 9th Music Ana. Cadets 4th.........BK 10th Vis. Ana...........Cadets 4th..........BK 7th Music Ana........Cadets 4th BK 11th So what we conclude from this is that BK's 2012 Show Design was a dud compared to The Cadets Show Design, and as such, no amount of marcher " performance and execution " ( if thewy had it in, Brass, Percussion, Guard.. which they didn't ), was going to allow them to compete with the Cadets that season, as that Show Design, by itself, prevented them from having a fighting chance. are you saying BK from an execution standpoint was on par with Cadets? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Suviduvi Posted July 11, 2014 Share Posted July 11, 2014 I have NO respect for any corps that performs music that my kids played in band during the football games.... NOT the half time show...but stand tunes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
THEdevilYOUknow Posted July 11, 2014 Share Posted July 11, 2014 I have NO respect for any corps that performs music that my kids played in band during the football games.... NOT the half time show...but stand tunes. Are you trolling right now? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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