Random Draw  

82 members have voted

  1. 1. As a drum corps fan would you like to see a random draw for events across the country

    • YES
      36
    • NO
      38
    • Indifferent
      8
  2. 2. As a drum corps fan would you like to see a random draw for preliminary championship performances?

    • YES
      34
    • NO
      46
    • Indifferent
      2


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I typically avoid these boards but I do have a question. Would you as a drum corps fan be interested in seeing a blind draw for shows throughout the country? or even for preliminary performances for world championships? Why or why not?

With this year especially being a most competitive year for a couple of drum corps trying to make history, I do think that being in a random draw would be awesome. Why? A judges responsibility is to judge and rate and rank correctly. In looking at some scores and ordinals, I can't but get upset at seeing the same old thing occurring again. 10, 9, 8, 7, blah blah blah going on. I have yet to attend a show yet this year so more will come to fruition later in the week as I attend three shows albeit, in a reverse order of their ranking. Please note, I am not bashing, it just seems constant year after year after year the same thing happens.

In open class, the corps go on early in the day on Thursday and the first corps to take the field typically does so to an empty house. Now if, oh let's say, mix things around have a blind draw, and say if Blue Devils B or Vanguard Cadets went on first there would be more of a crowd. This should be a growing, learning, and selling experience for the kids. Seeing 75,000 empty seats to me, would be depressing.

The idea would basically be to have the Open Class be a blind draw, the corps in the bottom 11 in a blind draw, the top 10 in a blind draw. This would require true management of numbers and thought process instead of just popping a higher number on the given sheet. And there should not be a big deal since all the corps are judged on the same sheet through out the season as well. Then proceed in semi finals and finals in the seeding process. Just allow some corps who perform literally in front of 200 people be able to see a nice crowd to perform in front of for a bit of inspiration and hope. Just my thoughts.

Edited by mojo67

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I typically avoid these boards but I do have a question. Would you as a drum corps fan be interested in seeing a blind draw for shows throughout the country? or even for preliminary performances for world championships? Why or why not?

With this year especially being a most competitive year for a couple of drum corps trying to make history, I do think that being in a random draw would be awesome. Why? A judges responsibility is to judge and rate and rank correctly. In looking at some scores and ordinals, I can't but get upset at seeing the same old thing occurring again. 10, 9, 8, 7, blah blah blah going on. I have yet to attend a show yet this year so more will come to fruition later in the week as I attend three shows albeit, in a reverse order of their ranking. Please note, I am not bashing, it just seems constant year after year after year the same thing happens.

In open class, the corps go on early in the day on Thursday and the first corps to take the field typically does so to an empty house. Now if, oh let's say, mix things around have a blind draw, and say if Blue Devils B or Vanguard Cadets went on first there would be more of a crowd. This should be a growing, learning, and selling experience for the kids. Seeing 75,000 empty seats to me, would be depressing.

The idea would basically be to have the Open Class be a blind draw, the corps in the bottom 11 in a blind draw, the top 10 in a blind draw. This would require true management of numbers and thought process instead of just popping a higher number on the given sheet. And there should not be a big deal since all the corps are judged on the same sheet through out the season as well. Then proceed in semi finals and finals in the seeding process. Just allow some corps who perform literally in front of 200 people be able to see a nice crowd to perform in front of for a bit of inspiration and hope. Just my thoughts.

I feel like this something that should ALWAYS be done.

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But if the Blue Devils get the bad draw at Prelims, I have to be there at 9AM and don't have half a day to waste not watching open class corps! Especially if all the shows that I want to see (read: top 12-15 only) are all scattered everywhere throughout the day! What a waste of my time and money!

/end sarcasm

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I like the idea of random draws, but with groupings of 4 based on rankings for region shows and prelims at Indy. I would not like it if everyone was put into a bag and drawn for position. Groupings of 4 are pretty consistent with the placement. For example, take BD, Coats, Cadets and Crown (all top 4 right now I think) Any order of these would be fine. Maybe 5, but not 6.

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With all due respect to the hard work of Open Class corps and lower-performing World Class corps, I would not want to attend a show where a corps competing for 18th place goes on right after a corps competing for the title. I agree with the random draw within a range of performance (1-4, 5-8, 9-12, etc.) which I believe is how it's done for the big regionals now, right?

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1988 had random draw I believe? It may have not been for prelims but I think it was for finals

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Am I the only one old enough to remember that this was done at semis in '88 and nobody seemed to like it?

As much as I'd love to see random performances to get people to the stadium at the beginning of the show, I don't remember hearing any positive comments about its contribution to the judging format.

Have times changed?

(sorry Wes, just saw your post)

Edited by garfield

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With all due respect to the hard work of Open Class corps and lower-performing World Class corps, I would not want to attend a show where a corps competing for 18th place goes on right after a corps competing for the title. I agree with the random draw within a range of performance (1-4, 5-8, 9-12, etc.) which I believe is how it's done for the big regionals now, right?

For San Antonio, they are done in groups of three.

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Am I the only one old enough to remember that this was done at semis in '88 and nobody seemed to like it?

As much as I'd love to see random performances to get people to the stadium at the beginning of the show, I don't remember hearing any positive comments about its contribution to the judging format.

Have times changed?

(sorry Wes, just saw your post)

Who are you referring to when you say "nobody seemed to like it?" Fans? Corps? Directors? Judges?...

I think the random draw thing sounds like a pretty fair way to go. I can see why certain people or groups of people wouldn't like it, but I think in the end it should come down to the most fair way to judge instead of what people "like"...after all, this is a competition.

However, I also understand that in addition to being a competition, it is entertainment...and the audience does deserve to have an experience that gets progressively better as the show goes on instead of being sporadic in quality.

It just seems like with the current method in place the Corps at the bottom of the bunch never really get to move up in ranking because they're always being placed at the beginning of shows. In addition to the preconceived notion that those at the beginning are already not as good as those at the end, theres also the fact that the OP brought up: less audience. The smaller audiences do nothing to help these corps get GE points.

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Who are you referring to when you say "nobody seemed to like it?" Fans? Corps? Directors? Judges?...

I think the random draw thing sounds like a pretty fair way to go. I can see why certain people or groups of people wouldn't like it, but I think in the end it should come down to the most fair way to judge instead of what people "like"...after all, this is a competition.

However, I also understand that in addition to being a competition, it is entertainment...and the audience does deserve to have an experience that gets progressively better as the show goes on instead of being sporadic in quality.

It just seems like with the current method in place the Corps at the bottom of the bunch never really get to move up in ranking because they're always being placed at the beginning of shows. In addition to the preconceived notion that those at the beginning are already not as good as those at the end, theres also the fact that the OP brought up: less audience. The smaller audiences do nothing to help these corps get GE points.

How does size of audience boost a corps GE score? I don't remember seeing audience size in the GE captions.

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