Sideways Posted July 15, 2014 Share Posted July 15, 2014 (edited) quick thoughts: Cavies....show is growing on me weekly. Percussion is ###### good and the marimba stuff is a great gimmick that's also performed well. visual seems improved, it's up to the brass now BD.....musically I love it. visually at times I like it, at other times it's the BD stuff that's driven me crazy the last few years. guard costuming not flattering and for the guys it looks like they belong in a German strip club playing Hasselhoff music Bloo.....I love the show, but the more I see it, after the opening punch you in the face moment, it's a lot of the same at the upper tempos, with more dynamic shaping and micro phrasing needed. Then...the Bend is cool yes, but the ending is a mood killer. Phantom......still not enthused by it yet. it makes sense, but just leaves me meh Crown....after the "ground control to major Einstein on the beach" opening, it's cool with Interstellar Suite. The muffler thing IMo, still too long, and way too often visually its brass running without playing for the sake of running without playing. Percussion much improved in a truly stacked year for drums. I get that visually secondary and tertiary focuses help get you design points, but too much of the stuff happening out on the edges are distracting, and limit the stage the corps can utilize. SCV...trying so hard not be 2004, at times it loses what made 2004 so special. Still good, though a few drum breaks feel crammed in for the sake of being crammed in Cadets...performed well. I've yet to hear a recording where I can truly either come to appreciate the vocals and clips or grow to hate them. At times corps still seems like an afterthought, but they play and move well. Never been a fan of Lincoln Portrait, this hasn't changed my mind I have a lot of the same thoughts as you. Bluecoats appear to be in a holding pattern compared to the groups around them...I could look back to earlier videos and the performance level/cleanliness would be much the same...whereas everyone else is changing, polishing, and cleaning! After the Bend section...the push to the end...need something to sustain the energy with no gaps all the way to the end, think SCV '99 with Blue Shades. Something along those lines would be worth 1.5 points alone, last impressions are the most important. The have the outline for it and the horses to pull it off...time to seize the moment BC!!! Little more beef to the guard book would not hurt either. Out of everyone I have seen the videos of...SCV might just have the best chance to catch BD, but I have the same feeling that are trying too hard to avoid 2004. Let it a happen for a moment here and there and it could be enough to push them into contention....that and continue to clean the feet! Crown certainly has the rep and the strength across all captions, but can they clarify the show enough for the GE to come through? If they do that they will be in contention based on rep and performance alone. Cadets - Vintage Copland show for them and for the most part it works. This is the least offensive narration from them ever! Strong across all captions and solid GE...but what the show is really lacking in is "Cadet like moments." Get back to what you do best, tag ending please??, and continue to refine the use of the stage, you should be good! BTW, that concert set at the end cost you an easy .3-.4 last night...total train wreck for mid July and to stand in that at the end, yikes! Every other contender's biggest issue is the Blue Devils. Already in the driver's seat and winning GE already with plenty to add and clean! Classy, well constructed, vintage BD performance level in all captions. This is going to be a dynamo come August. Still to look past the guard uniforms on the guys though...guess we can't have everything. Edit...on the Hasselhoff comment...thinking a disco remix of Hooked on a Feeling...nothing good can come from that image!! Edited July 15, 2014 by Sideways Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chaos001 Posted July 15, 2014 Share Posted July 15, 2014 Yeah. As soon as BD was added into the mix, these forums.. er I mean scores descended into chaos. I had nothing to do with that!!! (or did I?) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sideways Posted July 15, 2014 Share Posted July 15, 2014 Agree with your explanation... absolutely find the practice unethical. It's this type of behavior that causes the fan claims of preconceived placement. I ranted on this a few pages ago. Surprised nobody jumped down my throat for it. These full point spreads are frankly unhelpful and implausible if not impossible. If corps are competitive then the judges should demonstrate this in the score via close point values and groupings. This ranking with full point intervals is lazy. It seems all the more obvious with SCV, the new addition to the crowd tonight being the only corps to fall out of the pattern. I can hear the judging mental processes "shoot... I have to fit these guys in... I didn't leave room!" My other post is more articulate. Ask anyone that has been around and knows the judging game at regionals or other focus shows...it's the classic "rich get richer, and the poor get poorer." I would argue that the absolute score are larger shows are less important than the actual caption placement. What screws up the entire dynamic and infuriates everyone to no end is when the 8 out of 10 judges are measuring spreads by .1-.2 and the other 2 judges are handing out spreads of .3-.5 or more between the corps. Essentially the entire show then becomes decided by those two judges. More often than not the judging works and things are sorted out "correctly" by finals...my opinion. That being said it is these shifting dynamics between the smaller local shows and regionals that are the real issue. That plus conflict in number management between judges who are afraid to offend the corps and the ones that are not afraid to call a spade a spade... No wonder I do not have any hair left...oh wait, that is if for aerodynamics on the bike! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
theCHEZman Posted July 15, 2014 Share Posted July 15, 2014 I have a lot of the same thoughts as you. Bluecoats appear to be in a holding pattern compared to the groups around them...I could look back to earlier videos and the performance level/cleanliness would be much the same...whereas everyone else is changing, polishing, and cleaning! After the Bend section...the push to the end...need something to sustain the energy with no gaps all the way to the end, think SCV '99 with Blue Shades. Something along those lines would be worth 1.5 points alone, last impressions are the most important. The have the outline for it and the horses to pull it off...time to seize the moment BC!!! Little more beef to the guard book would not hurt either. Out of everyone I have seen the videos of...SCV might just have the best chance to catch BD, but I have the same feeling that are trying too hard to avoid 2004. Let it a happen for a moment here and there and it could be enough to push them into contention....that and continue to clean the feet! Crown certainly has the rep and the strength across all captions, but can they clarify the show enough for the GE to come through? If they do that they will be in contention based on rep and performance alone. Cadets - Vintage Copland show for them and for the most part it works. This is the least offensive narration from them ever! Strong across all captions and solid GE...but what the show is really lacking in is "Cadet like moments." Get back to what you do best, tag ending please??, and continue to refine the use of the stage, you should be good! BTW, that concert set at the end cost you an easy .3-.4 last night...total train wreck for mid July and to stand in that at the end, yikes! Every other contender's biggest issue is the Blue Devils. Already in the driver's seat and winning GE already with plenty to add and clean! Classy, well constructed, vintage BD performance level in all captions. This is going to be a dynamo come August. Still to look past the guard uniforms on the guys though...guess we can't have everything. Edit...on the Hasselhoff comment...thinking a disco remix of Hooked on a Feeling...nothing good can come from that image!! I agree on your Cadets review. They need to get that new ending in pronto or at least clean that arc. What a train wreck last night. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sideways Posted July 15, 2014 Share Posted July 15, 2014 Haven't read every page of this thread, but doesn't order of appearance (like last night)play into the judges placements for all corps in their caption? BD went on fairly early and the judges handed out some big numbers, but they still left plenty of room for others to step up to the plate and take BD down. BD set the standard and everyone else sorted themselves out underneath. Appears that's the way nearly all the judges saw it last night. Interesting thing is, limited audio via recording I know, is that Crown won brass despite a couple of edgy releases and feet coming through the trumpet section sound in the later third of the show. No idea where the brass judge was at on the field though...they clean that stuff up and that rep number may get perfect! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Ream Posted July 15, 2014 Share Posted July 15, 2014 this spread says that... 2 is competitive with 1... but 3 is not. 3 is competitive with 2... but 4 is not. 4 is competitive with 3... but 5 is not.. Etc... on down the line. This is lazy judging. Rank first, score wide... wash your hands and go home. It's uninformative, and stops short of presenting true competitive relationships. 1-3 tenths in any sub box is considered within the same neighborhood. everyone gets so hung up on the bottom line number...go sub box by sub box. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2000Cadet Posted July 15, 2014 Share Posted July 15, 2014 I have a lot of the same thoughts as you. Bluecoats appear to be in a holding pattern compared to the groups around them...I could look back to earlier videos and the performance level/cleanliness would be much the same...whereas everyone else is changing, polishing, and cleaning! After the Bend section...the push to the end...need something to sustain the energy with no gaps all the way to the end, think SCV '99 with Blue Shades. Something along those lines would be worth 1.5 points alone, last impressions are the most important. The have the outline for it and the horses to pull it off...time to seize the moment BC!!! Little more beef to the guard book would not hurt either. Out of everyone I have seen the videos of...SCV might just have the best chance to catch BD, but I have the same feeling that are trying too hard to avoid 2004. Let it a happen for a moment here and there and it could be enough to push them into contention....that and continue to clean the feet! Crown certainly has the rep and the strength across all captions, but can they clarify the show enough for the GE to come through? If they do that they will be in contention based on rep and performance alone. Cadets - Vintage Copland show for them and for the most part it works. This is the least offensive narration from them ever! Strong across all captions and solid GE...but what the show is really lacking in is "Cadet like moments." Get back to what you do best, tag ending please??, and continue to refine the use of the stage, you should be good! BTW, that concert set at the end cost you an easy .3-.4 last night...total train wreck for mid July and to stand in that at the end, yikes! Every other contender's biggest issue is the Blue Devils. Already in the driver's seat and winning GE already with plenty to add and clean! Classy, well constructed, vintage BD performance level in all captions. This is going to be a dynamo come August. Still to look past the guard uniforms on the guys though...guess we can't have everything. Edit...on the Hasselhoff comment...thinking a disco remix of Hooked on a Feeling...nothing good can come from that image!! Hit the nail right on the head. The end of the show (the 208bpm (i think?) part of it) definitely could generate some excitement if it had the drill to match the music. I'm hoping they change that concert set REALLY soon. I absolutely HATE IT. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
quietcity Posted July 15, 2014 Share Posted July 15, 2014 Hit the nail right on the head. The end of the show (the 208bpm (i think?) part of it) definitely could generate some excitement if it had the drill to match the music. I'm hoping they change that concert set REALLY soon. I absolutely HATE IT. The end of the show as it currently stands (so to speak) is not musically satisfying or visually exciting. The problem is, a frantic tag ending at the conclusion of "Simple Gifts" would undermine the majesty and stateliness that the whole show works to create. This is exactly the problem with the Bluecoats' panic-attack drill following the pitch-bend musical ending. Lot of fun, sure, but it detracts from the dramatic musical conclusion. I am curious to see how the Cadets resolve this. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Ream Posted July 15, 2014 Share Posted July 15, 2014 The end of the show as it currently stands (so to speak) is not musically satisfying or visually exciting. The problem is, a frantic tag ending at the conclusion of "Simple Gifts" would undermine the majesty and stateliness that the whole show works to create. This is exactly the problem with the Bluecoats' panic-attack drill following the pitch-bend musical ending. Lot of fun, sure, but it detracts from the dramatic musical conclusion. I am curious to see how the Cadets resolve this. my hunch is they channel their inner 1987 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George Dixon Posted July 15, 2014 Share Posted July 15, 2014 The end of the show as it currently stands (so to speak) is not musically satisfying or visually exciting. The problem is, a frantic tag ending at the conclusion of "Simple Gifts" would undermine the majesty and stateliness that the whole show works to create. This is exactly the problem with the Bluecoats' panic-attack drill following the pitch-bend musical ending. Lot of fun, sure, but it detracts from the dramatic musical conclusion. I am curious to see how the Cadets resolve this. Agree. I think with several of the corps currently chasing BD the next 2 weeks of changes will tell the tale of the season. With the right changes Cadets could easily challenge - a point out is nothing. But just adding some guard uniform changes isn't going to get it done. They need to rewrite the last portion of the show and add a few other wow moments Coats ending is not satisfying at all - and they should revisit that decision too. Crown is another one needing a few key changes It's going to be interesting to see where this all goes. Really enjoyed all the corps last night - a great season that could be really tremendous with some smart choices over the next couple weeks. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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