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What do you think the champions of yesteryear would score today?


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No way star 91 would be competitive today. Are you kidding? Have you read the sheets?? I love that show. But seriously. It would be bottom 6 tops. Star 93 would fare far better.

I don't think much of anything from the 90s would place in the top 6, maybe not even the top 12.

I think cavaliers 2000-2004 would do okay, probably 2006 as well. Don't know if any would win but top 6 or medals wouldn't be out of the question depending on the year. Strangely enough, I feel like spin cycle would have the best chance. In some ways, I feel like today's show design is still in large part a reaction to the designs of those shows, mostly because other corps had to figure out how to combat them. How do you beat a corps that is completely crushing the game in terms of effect with drill design and musical integration (not to mention the consistency of their performance captions back then... brass was almost always top 2 or 3, cavaliers won VP every finals NIGHT from 2000 to 2008), guard and drums always good, drill notoriously clean...?

You fight back with a different formula, one that the Cadets unveiled IMHO in 2005, a counter to that style of show design that could win.

Obviously recent Devs shows are competitive. Honestly not sure about phantom 08, maybe I need to watch it again but I feel like the rest of the top 4 from that year have aged more gracefully. Probably just biased though, I can admit that. Never been a regiment fan.

I think the "Cavaliers millenium" shows, culminating in 2006 (maybe throw 08 in there too, I don't know. Not 05 or 07) represent the pinnacle of what show design was before the sheets changed and storyline became more complex. Seamless integration, very pure effect from honest drill and musical moments, executed at some of the highest levels seen.

Cadets imo set the template and the standard for the counterattack to that in 2005, blue devils and crown have been crushing it lately.

Discuss.

Edited by jake_the_hydra
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Also something I've noticed - let me know if I'm off base- is the higher quality of the top 12 as a whole. I used to pretty much ignore the bottom 6 (sorry, I was kind of a jerk) but now I find the quality of show design and performance to be much higher when I marched. I feel there are recent bottom 6 shows that would be very competitive 5+ years ago

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Ditka with two valve bugles, no electronics, no narration and 128 members would beat all champion corps from from 1996 - 2013 combined, except 1999 SCV, which would still lose to Ditka but only by the very respectable margin of 1 million points.

Full sized Ditka or tiny Ditka?

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Ditka with two valve bugles, no electronics, no narration and 128 members would beat all champion corps from from 1996 - 2013 combined, except 1999 SCV, which would still lose to Ditka but only by the very respectable margin of 1 million points.

bwaaaahhhh!! as a Bears fan, thanks for giving me a chuckle this morning! hahahaha

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No way star 91 would be competitive today. Are you kidding? Have you read the sheets?? I love that show. But seriously. It would be bottom 6 tops. Star 93 would fare far better.

For real. Guard wasn't scored, and looking back Star's guard was how should we say, lacking? Esp. 91. 93 had some cool things with the poles and sticks, but nothing that would really stand out today.

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1973 Vanguard wouldn't make Finals today.

Actually I have no basis for the statement and no idea if they would or wouldn't make Finals. How could you possibly compare??

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With no disrespect to the beasts of the past, there is absolutely no way any drum and bugle corps until the 90's could compete anywhere near the level of top tier World Class corps of today. Percussion is LIGHT YEARS ahead of anything ever conceived of back in the day. Those old horn lines in the past honked out noises that wouldn't be tolerated today. Today's color guard performance, brass, percussion, electronics, design, equipment advances, phyisical conditioning, time commitment, practice, diet, instruction, quality of members... ALL overall SUPERIOR to yesteryear.

I'll attempt to hazzard a guess to your question, which is, what the champion's score would be of yesteryear compared to today. That's a tough one because of many of the factors mentioned above - not to mention a different scoring system. But, what the heck, it's just a guess:

Best score of any 1960's Champion - 30 points lower compared to today

1970's - 20 to 25 points lower

1980's to early 90's - 10 to 15 points lower

Mid 90s - 5 to 10 points lower

2000-2004 - 5 points lower

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1973 Vanguard wouldn't make Finals today.

Actually I have no basis for the statement and no idea if they would or wouldn't make Finals. How could you possibly compare??

Eh, I just find it fun to think about is all. This is not really a serious topic--was just trying to see the opinions of the more experienced.

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With no disrespect to the beasts of the past, there is absolutely no way any drum and bugle corps until the 90's could compete anywhere near the level of top tier World Class corps of today. Percussion is LIGHT YEARS ahead of anything ever conceived of back in the day. Those old horn lines in the past honked out noises that wouldn't be tolerated today. Today's color guard performance, brass, percussion, electronics, design, equipment advances, phyisical conditioning, time commitment, practice, diet, instruction, quality of members... ALL overall SUPERIOR to yesteryear.

I'll attempt to hazzard a guess to your question, which is, what the champion's score would be of yesteryear compared to today. That's a tough one because of many of the factors mentioned above - not to mention a different scoring system. But, what the heck, it's just a guess:

Best score of any 1960's Champion - 30 points lower compared to today

1970's - 20 to 25 points lower

1980's to early 90's - 10 to 15 points lower

Mid 90s - 5 to 10 points lower

2000-2004 - 5 points lower

I would probably have to agree with you about the mid to late 90s being the most comparable to today's shows, at least with the past shows not being modified. If I can ask, how do you think 90's/early 2000s shows would compete if certain modifications were made so that, let's say... instruments were of a quality at today's standards, adding electronics, etc. Basically, how would a modernized/updated Cadets 93 score against Crown 2013?

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