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Oh, that absolutely will happen, not because the rules have changed, but because the corps you cite suck at design. They'll just be able to suck at design using a few more tools.

PEBUAK: Blame the user, not the tool.

Believe it or not, while I do have philosophical objections to electronics, what you state here is, for practical purposes, also basically my position on the subject.

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Because at bottom, there must be some definition to drum corps. There are things that are drum corps and things that aren't drum corps, and everyone on these forums would agree that some things aren't drum corps. This change by itself, no more than in DCI, will not push corps irrevocably past the point where everyone would feel they aren't really corps anymore. What I'm really after is just getting people to think about the effects these changes have. If it means the brass are playing less, is that a bad thing or not?

There were those that said the Bridgemen were not drum corps in 76...those that said the Cavies, Scouts and Cadets killed drum corps in 71.

Drum corps is what those who make the rules say it is...as always.

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Believe it or not, while I do have philosophical objections to electronics, what you state here is, for practical purposes, also basically my position on the subject.

I totally get your philosophical objections. There was a time where I was vehemently opposed to Bb/F (not enough to stop supporting my corps or going to shows), but had my mind changed by being involved with a corps up close and personal when they made the switch (Bucs 04 in G, Bucs 05 in Bb/F). I absolutely respect your position, and to be frank, you lay our your opposition in a pretty positive, fact-filled way. I don't agree, but that's cool.

Interesting fact based on your earlier post....woodwind *sounds* are now perfectly legal (as are strings). And having taught a corps that used both, you'll have far more success with electronic sampling than you'd ever have with the real thing (especially if you use and EWI),

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Tell me something I don't know. And plenty of folks in the Alumni type corps (at least the ones with eyes open) know it too.

Just want to point out you're missing my point in my response to Johns post which I misunderstood. And not sure of your point in this either unless you think I'm blind to the future of this genre of corps. Why do you think Hanover changed from parade style about a decade back.

As for "tradition" whose tradition? I suspect some people would NOT like some things Hanover does (singing how dare they????). And some "traditional way of playing" some corps do leave me cold so goes both ways.

sure. i get it. you're more opened minded than even you want to let on.

others aren't

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I totally get your philosophical objections. There was a time where I was vehemently opposed to Bb/F (not enough to stop supporting my corps or going to shows), but had my mind changed by being involved with a corps up close and personal when they made the switch (Bucs 04 in G, Bucs 05 in Bb/F). I absolutely respect your position, and to be frank, you lay our your opposition in a pretty positive, fact-filled way. I don't agree, but that's cool.

Interesting fact based on your earlier post... woodwind *sounds* are now perfectly legal (as are strings). And having taught a corps that used both, you'll have far more success with electronic sampling than you'd ever have with the real thing (especially if you use and EWI),

Well, here's where I am philosophically consistent *and* in opposition to most of the so-called dinosaurs: I would prefer actual woodwinds to synthesized woodwind sounds.

(Key of instruments doesn't matter much to me, although I do believe that G bugles were louder, and I do believe that louder is a good thing. But in DCI, they mostly took care of that issue by increasing corps size.)

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Of course not. That wasn't my point. My point was: who, besides synth players, is deciding for or against deciding a particular corps based on whether or not that corps uses synths? And if they are making such decisions, how would they express their reasons?

Now it's true that in a tuba player's case, given the amount of thunderous goo for 2009-2012 especially, that I have to imagine the thinking goes like this: "I'm not a very good player, so where will heavy use of synthesizer mean that I'll have less to play and my inadequacies will be less noticeable?"

Now sure, there is one corps who has both made generally effective use of electronics and featured the tubas as much or more than any other, but so far, they've been the exception not the rule.

then convince the directors to change it back, and as the DCA fan base continues to die off, you can get closer to the 50 every year

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John, slow down. The corps you list WILL handle the additions best. That's the point. Unfortunately, DCA has, maybe, 25 other groups that perform at its events. I'm thinking several of them will get carried away, do things poorly, etc. just because of some need to chase the 'big guys.' It will be similar to small, lower talented corps we ALREADY see presenting shows that are way beyond their reach. Say, corps with 40 members who write drills that use the entire 100 yards. Playing too difficult parts.

In other words, the 'margin of error' is greater in DCA than in DCI. Maybe I should have said smaller, rather than greater!

amps were legal last year. maybe half used them

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Then convince the directors to change it back, and as the DCA fan base continues to die off, you can get closer to the 50 every year

You're still begging the question. I asked why brass players prefer corps with synths, and your answer is, essentially, that they just do.

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Drum corps is what those who make the rules say it is... as always.

And those people are never wrong?

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Didn't say that corps would go broke.

As for scores,if a corps is faced with putting on entertaining show,one that will get them booked,they will strive to make that show the best they can. Think of Broadway there is no scoring by just six people and yet there are great shows.

Really you would not go to see MBI,CABS and others just because they aren't getting a score?

People will pay to see MBI,and the likes if the shows are entertaining. if the corps' get lazy and push less for excellence, people will not pay regardless of scoring or not.

Think of it as a rock concert with a bunch of great groups,there's no scoring but you are there to see a great show.

You don't need a score to tell you ,you re good the people in the seats jumping up and are telling you, you are good

would I? I dunno. Scores do play a part tho, because people want to see "their" corps do well. I know many "fans" weren't around as much during some of the Bucs leaner years in the early 90's like they are today. Members want to win.

and never forget, while Empire strived to make fans jump up and down, they sure as hell wanted to win too

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