HockeyDad Posted March 27, 2015 Share Posted March 27, 2015 (edited) Amen Brasso. This thread is a big rush to claim the coveted victimhood status. A bit over the top. I don't care about anybody's lifestyle choices. I have enough of my own flaws and problems to work on to care about other people's lifestyle choices. It's the getting all in my face about it that bugs the crap out of me. Edited March 27, 2015 by HockeyDad 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
N.E. Brigand Posted March 27, 2015 Share Posted March 27, 2015 Amen Brasso. This thread is a big rush to claim the coveted victimhood status. A bit over the top. I don't care about anybody's lifestyle choices. I have enough of my own flaws and problems to work on to care about other people's lifestyle choices. It's the getting all in my face about it that bugs the crap out of me. I believe most commenters in this thread who are dismayed by the law also approve of DCI's response. What do you think of it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BRASSO Posted March 27, 2015 Share Posted March 27, 2015 (edited) I have found it quite easy to be tolerant of the " incandescntly gay " that poster 84BDsop above just referred to. Perhaps its principally because I wouldn't have any idea what that is... but it seems to work for me quite well anyway when I'm in their apparent midst without realizing it. I guess one could say in this respect that for me.. ignorance is bliss. Edited March 27, 2015 by BRASSO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HockeyDad Posted March 27, 2015 Share Posted March 27, 2015 I believe most commenters in this thread who are dismayed by the law also approve of DCI's response. What do you think of it? Honest answer: I didn't read DCI's response. I only read posters' comments about the response, so I'm assuming it goes something like this: We hear our customers, we're not pleased, and we're going to continue to work on LGBT issues, and we're not leaving Indy and we look forward to seeing you all in August! If I've accurately characterized the response, I think that it's about the only thing DCI could reasonably be expected to do as a response. My guess is they would rather this whole thing would go away. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
perc2100 Posted March 27, 2015 Share Posted March 27, 2015 I do know I am now considering selling my finals tickets and canceling my hotel. Why should I visit and spend money in a state that will discriminate myself and my friends. I hope more will follow. The LGBT community has a huge fan base within DCI. Not to mention members and staff of the CORPS. That type of behavior is likely the ONLY thing that would enact any sort of change. When AZ was on the cusp of passing a similar law the NFL threatened to move the Super Bowl if that law was enacted, prompting AZ to quickly table the law. If Indy & its businesses lose money over this things will change. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
corpsband Posted March 27, 2015 Share Posted March 27, 2015 I suspect that Indiana's passing of this law will end up being a net positive for the LGBT community. Not only has it focused attention on Indiana (whose own Chamber of Commerce came down hard on this issue) , it's focusing attention on all the other states that mostly flew under the radar in passing similar legislation. The net effect is some very bright sunshine on this whole issue. This might be a case of one step back, 20 steps forward. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
N.E. Brigand Posted March 27, 2015 Share Posted March 27, 2015 This notion that DCI should pull out of a city and stadium that has been reportedly financially beneficial ( and its people hospitable ) to DCI for several years now is just plain silly. In 1993, DCI selected Jackson, Mississippi as its Championships venue. Mississippi in 1993 was not all that hospitable to publically acknowleged homosexuals, and yet by 1993, DCI participation rates for homosexuals in the activity was pretty high then too. But one would be hard pressed to find a lot of overreacting homosexual activists people in 1993 expresssing this silly notion of boycotting DCI's chosen Championships site of Jackson, Mississippi based upon the election of state officials there, and the policies and social,political positions embraced by the majority of Mississippi citizens and their elected officials there. The USA (and other Western countries) has sent its amateur athletes to Olympic sites lots of times where homosexuals are routinely picked up and imprisoned.. and in many cases, tortured and even murdered. No homosexual Drum Corps fan or current homosexual DCI marcher has anything to fear by contrast in Indianapolis, Indiana (as others before them did in Jackson, Miss.) This thread is interesting (lots of pages, lots of views) but like Shakespeare once wrote for us... "lots of sound and fury, but in the end, signifying nothing ". Well, society's views at large are in the process of changing on this subject. Gay marriage was almost unimaginable in 1993, for instance, and not just in Mississippi--and the possibility of the Supreme Court legalizing gay marriage nationally is a big impetus behind the passage of this law. It is something of a last-ditch effort to arrest the change, and in the next decade or so, the Indiana legislature will write a new law that either overturns this one completely or prohibits it from applying to instances of discrimination based on sexual orientation. So I think a better thought experiment would be imagining DCI holding its finals Instead in Jackson, MS in 1963 (yes, I know DCI didn't exist then) and to consider race rather than sexual orientation. Or take this simple question: if not for federal law, this state law would allow an Indiana business to deny service to a mixed-race couple on religious grounds, as for example the Exodus passage that JimF-LowBari has mentioned. Would you be OK with that? And if not, what's the difference between that example and the one which DCI faces? That Shakespeare passage you cite, by the way, from the Scottish play, reads more fully: "To-morrow, and to-morrow, and to-morrow, Creeps in this petty pace from day to day, To the last syllable of recorded time; And all our yesterdays have lighted fools The way to dusty death. Out, out, brief candle! Life's but a walking shadow, a poor player, That struts and frets his hour upon the stage, And then is heard no more. It is a tale Told by an idiot, full of sound and fury, Signifying nothing." So what he's saying is that a person's life is the tale which signifies nothing. Your life, my life, his life: everything that we do or say, in the really long term, is meaningless. And yet here you are posting along with the rest of us. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
perc2100 Posted March 27, 2015 Share Posted March 27, 2015 It would seem to me that thishttp://www.foxnews.com/us/2015/03/26/proposed-ballot-measure-that-advocates-killing-gays-puts-california-attorney/ is a much more serious concern than a law that says the government can not do harm to someone's religious beliefs. But for consistent thinking and action with those proposing to move and boycott Indy championships as well as boycott the other 19 states and the Federal Government who has had the same law for the past five years.......... and who propose the ending of DCI touring because there can not be any travelling avoiding these 19 States and the US and paying the highway and gas tolls for the same, does DCI then boycott California??? I tried to note this to Seen it all by a PM, but he has blocked me even though we have never had any discussion previously. I guess if someone disagrees, they are just not worth listening to according to the snipers.. 1. You are clearly misrepresenting the Indiana law. If not, please explain to me explicitly what religion condones bigotry and exclusion (hint: not Christianity, which is why many Christian organizations in Indiana OPPOSED this law) 2. This proposed ballot measure in CA is more an exercise on how easy it is to get a ballot measure than it is a serious risk of this actually becoming law. The law giving free reign to discriminate against anyone for broad "religious reasons" excuse is signed into law: the CA law obviously has zero chance of passing and will likely never see a ballot 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skevinp Posted March 27, 2015 Share Posted March 27, 2015 I would be very interested to hear from the people who say they are so concerned about the potential of a possibility of some discrimination that could result from this law affecting DCI members or fans, that they want to pressure DCI to make disruptive changes, as to why they are not making an issue of the continued 100% chance of actual gender discrimination by actual corps. I'm not saying I necessarily have a problem with the way things are with the Scouts and the Cavaliers, just that I don't understand the inconsistency. Adding a little icing to this cake, what if a girl identifes as a boy and wants to join the Cavaliers? How can denying them that opportunity be OK if denying them a drink should be a crime? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BRASSO Posted March 27, 2015 Share Posted March 27, 2015 (edited) DCI 's response summation ( reducing the verbiage ): " DCI believes in inclusion" ( with the exception of 2 Corps who we allow to continue to practice their decades long gender discrimination policies ) and " we will continue to monitor the situation in Indiana to make sure our homosexual marchers and staffers continue to be safe and secure as they have been since we chose Indianapolis for the site of DCI Championships " Basically, IndianiaGate will have as much effect on DCI's chosen site for Championships as will the ESPN/ NFL's contrived DeflateGate. This story fades away faster than a new Sean Penn movie. But... only time will tell, I suppose. Edited March 27, 2015 by BRASSO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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