soccerguy315 Posted June 14, 2015 Share Posted June 14, 2015 Sufficient numbers of DCI customers are apparently still willing to pay good money to DCI for this, despite poor and late communication from DCI, missed deadline dates for announced roll outs, confusion on the part of many customers on what the services will actually entail, and so forth. So yes, it does appear that sufficient numbers of DCI customers are apparently satisfied with being treated shabbily and will apparently tolerate mediocrity in customer service from DCI. Hasn't everything in your post been resolved as of right now? And the season has not started yet... Not saying the answers are what people wanted, but we have the answers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
superOOk Posted June 14, 2015 Share Posted June 14, 2015 Signed up for the $99 package -- can someone PM me the instructions on how to record the live stream so I can DVR it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
superOOk Posted June 14, 2015 Share Posted June 14, 2015 Can someone make a Google Calendar with all of the show times on it? If I can't get DVR then I certainly don't want to miss the show times :( Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2muchcoffeeman Posted June 14, 2015 Share Posted June 14, 2015 Yes, I have read this. Some indeed are seemingly coming around to what some of us have been saying for awhile on this. Absent/ and or silent on this over the last week however have been the usual small cadre of DCI apologists that blamed " the lawyers".... the Corporatists in the Copyrights Field ".... " cranky, old DCP'ers "... and the like for this ongoing incoherence with this segment of the DCI customer offerings for DCI fans. This small cadre of think alike DCI syncopants have simply disappeared on this issue now. Which is predictable, and telling in of itself,. N.E. Brigand. Whoa. Look folks, it's as simple as this: The copyright holders, represented by their lawyers, have finally called foul on 40+ years of DCI's less-than-airtight adherence to copyright (and DCI is not alone in this; other arts organizations are similarly over a barrel after years of lax enforcement). The simple fact is, if the lawyers wanted to march into court tomorrow to demand payment, they would quickly and effectively shut down DCI for good. And don't think WGI is out of the woods, either -- there's nothing fundamentally different in WGI's track record regarding copyright. Has DCI's customer service during this time been less than brilliant? Yes. But that doesn't mean the legal matters are not real. They are very real. Will they get sorted out? Probably, yes, for a price -- a price you and I will pay when all the negotiations have been concluded and DCI resumes offering replay and archives. No one's being a sycophant around here. Only realistic. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BRASSO Posted June 14, 2015 Share Posted June 14, 2015 Not saying the answers are what people wanted, but we have the answers. True. DCI did give its fans answers.... but the answers given only has led to head scratching, and more questions. BUT.. it is what it is, so thats that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BRASSO Posted June 14, 2015 Share Posted June 14, 2015 (edited) The simple fact is, if the lawyers wanted to march into court tomorrow to demand payment, they would quickly and effectively shut down DCI for good. No one's being a sycophant around here. Only realistic. No... it is just your opinion and speculation ( not " a fact " at all ) that lawyers could shut down DCI for good if they wanted to. The notion that DCI could not legally prevail with adequate legal respresentaion is not something I share ( nor others ) at all. And don't take my word for it. Take the word of a DCP poster who is actually an attorney by profession, and posted as such on this very thread above. ( jaspre2000, poster ) Are you an attorney by profession, 2 muchcoffeee ? We have had posters on here asking us if we are "an Attorney". So are you an attorney ? Just askin' mind you, as you do seem to speak with unambiguous legal authority on what the " facts " are on this issue. So... some of us would like to know... are you an Attorney by profession, 2muchcoffee ? Edited June 14, 2015 by BRASSO Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BRASSO Posted June 14, 2015 Share Posted June 14, 2015 As a lawyer who has some experience in Copyright law (although not an expert by any means), I find the explanations as to why we can't have On Demand streaming this season to be bizarre. It really is not that difficult, at all, to get a license that covers both live broadcast and replays ... and for the type of content we're talking about here, it shouldn't be that expensive to get the additional rights (in fact, I would be shocked if they had to pay anything more for them at all). Without knowing anything about what is actually going on behind the scenes, it seems to me that DCI's real problem is that they are not getting very good legal advice on copyright issues. The copyright issues can get a bit complicated, but they shouldn't pose the major problem that the DCI feedback suggests. The back catalog is a different issue ... it can be solved very easily, but it will take some time and work. But with respect to this year's shows, there really is no excuse for not having all necessary rights cleared before the season starts. When I was in high school band, it was the responsibility of every school to make sure the necessary rights for the music they were performing were obtained. The state organization promulgated form license agreements that schools could use to get the clearances they needed. If DCI isn't requiring the individual corps to get the necessary clearances for their respective shows ahead of time, they have no one to blame but themselves. It should be a requirement that if you can't get the copyright clearance, you can't use the music. If they don't get a handle on this stuff, this whole organization is likely to go down in flames pretty quickly. Online content has to be a key part of DCI going forward if it is going to survive and thrive. I just don't see how I can justify paying for only live streaming. I am not available for half the shows. I was really looking forward to seeing a preview of many of the shows this next week, but since they won't be available on demand, it doesn't look that is going to be a possibility. Add the fact that my local DCI show has been all but abandoned by the top corps and it is becoming very difficult to see myself staying invested in drum corps for very much longer. I never marched in the corps, and therefore my personal ties are not as deep as others. I find it very entertaining though, which is why I have been a fan network subscriber for several years. DCI's negligence in taking care of these issues (which have been around for years) is going to make it difficult for fans like me to stay involved. There has not been any significant changes in the copyright laws in the last few years. The law regarding on demand streaming is exactly the same as it was last year and the year before. If I had to guess, DCI has received a few cease and desist letters from some copyright trolls. A good lawyer would take care of those pests pretty quickly, but I can see how they would freak out an organization without the appropriate legal support. I realize that DCI does not have a ton of resources, but they need to make this copyright issue a priority by hiring an experienced, competent copyright attorney to advise them and help them draft some form license agreements that will allow them to offer the services to fans that they need to offer. This isn't a new issue ... they've been trying to deal with it for years. It's also not a hard issue, though, with the right legal advice. There really is no excuse that they don't have it solved by now. Sounds rational, reasonable, & logical to me, jasgre2000. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SCVsopAaron Posted June 14, 2015 Share Posted June 14, 2015 (edited) I've been a fan network subscriber most seasons since it got started, but it's incredibly difficult to justify the cost when I know for sure I'll miss most of these streams... It's really time for the corps to embrace what most of the entertainment/performing arts orgs are realizing - that to build audience loyalty you have to deliver content and lots of it, most of the time for free and in a spontaneous way... I hope to get my fill on YouTube and Periscope, but the corps need to be ok putting that content out there and stop trying to be "secret" or hide it from the public... That tactic doesn't work, and it has been proven over and over that the more content you put out, the more interest is drummed up and people will actually show up or at least consume the content online... There are definite ways to make money off of this. Edited June 14, 2015 by SCVsopAaron 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
N.E. Brigand Posted June 14, 2015 Share Posted June 14, 2015 Whoa. Look folks, it's as simple as this: The copyright holders, represented by their lawyers, have finally called foul on 40+ years of DCI's less-than-airtight adherence to copyright (and DCI is not alone in this; other arts organizations are similarly over a barrel after years of lax enforcement). I'm not sure about the forty-plus years. It seems to have been prompted by internet streaming (since it's still possible to purchase videos either as physical media or downloads), and that's something that wasn't available even twenty years ago. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
N.E. Brigand Posted June 14, 2015 Share Posted June 14, 2015 It's really time for the corps to embrace what most of the entertainment/performing arts orgs are realizing - that to build audience loyalty you have to deliver content and lots of it, most of the time for free and in a spontaneous way. I hope to get my fill on YouTube and Periscope, but the corps need to be ok putting that content out there and stop trying to be "secret" or hide it from the public. That tactic doesn't work, and it has been proven over and over that the more content you put out, the more interest is drummed up and people will actually show up or at least consume the content online. There are definite ways to make money off of this. Does anybody really think DCI had not been "embracing" the idea of delivering content electronically? Maybe, as jsagre has written, DCI just has terrible lawyers who don't know how to make ASCAP (or whoever it is) back off, but in any case, it seems obvious that DCI is facing what they perceive as a serious threat that arose because they'd been embracing streaming too much, not too little. It's the copyright holders who are demanding a much larger share of DCI's pie. Now perhaps it would benefit the corps to acquiesce to these demands. Perhaps all of them need to understand that, for a hypothetical example, if they cut the cost of one staff person now in order to pay the increased license fee, that in a few years that will lead to them--by having increased audience interest through more easily accessible online videos--having more income. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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