karuna Posted August 11, 2018 Share Posted August 11, 2018 2 minutes ago, MikeRapp said: He isn’t a Crown hater. He helps run this site. I disagree with him plenty regarding BD, he has his typical BD blind spots, but he isn’t a hater. I said traitor not hater. And I don't think Cappy is on the DCP staff. But who knows? Maybe he secretly owns the whole thing! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cappybara Posted August 11, 2018 Share Posted August 11, 2018 35 minutes ago, karuna said: But Klesch's arranging style is (perhaps more than any other in DCI) completely transparent. He literally takes the composers work and just orchestrates for marching brass. No chop and bop. He's probably more respectful of the original composer's intent than anyone in drum corps. I completely agree that Klesch is one of the most true-to-original arrangers in DCI (though I wouldn't say completely transparent, take their 2016 arrangement of Hallelujah as an example). Compare and contrast this. Two highly technical pieces. But I think the level of emotion and implementation of the technicality to create some that is musical is night and day. The brass band piece just sounds cold to me. Music is personal preference, always will be. I totally respect if you disagree, I just ask that you do the same. And no, I'm not a Crown hater. Crown and Phantom Regiment were the corps that brought me into the DCI world. 2007 and 2012 Crown are one of my favorite shows of all time. I absolutely loved the message that their 2016 show sent. I don't see this as a black and white thing. Every year, I start with a clean slate. BD happens to arrange (atleast in the past decade) to a style that I enjoy every year. If I don't enjoy their show next year, my opinions on it will reflect that. I've greatly disliked the arranging style of the Cavies since the early 2000's and many Cavalier homers on DCP know that about me. Their super layered arrangements led to a thin sound that just wasn't attractive to my ears. Recently that arranging style has changed, and all of a sudden their show is one of my favorites this year Crown has started to arrange to a style that I find... annoying for the lack of a better term. Their brass sound is amazing, but I can't get past the technical passages in their shows that sound like they're inserted in at random (even if they're a part of the source music, which I guess furthers my point about my feelings about brass band music). If Crown puts out a show that moves away from that, I'll probably love it! Anyways, I'll stop spamming the Crown thread now, good discussion! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cappybara Posted August 11, 2018 Share Posted August 11, 2018 42 minutes ago, MikeRapp said: You are aware he is the site’s biggest Blue Devils honk, right? BD has been the king of difficult for the sake of being difficult. Drum corps is no longer an activity dominated by technical achievement. It is quickly becoming more of a staged show that includes technical achievements, which include challenging musical scores. Where that line is will be determined in part by what fans pay tickets to see, and what the dci members want to perform. Corps that have succeeded mostly on technical achievement are going to struggle to medal in this new era. Like it or not, just being difficult for the sake of being difficult isn’t going to cut it anymore. What that means is, there is tremendous pressure on show design and concept. You have to have an idea that truly holds up for 11minutes. That means your music has to match the concept. It has to help tell the story. If you just go out there and play Flight of the Bumblebees for 11 minutes, you may win the Ott but you aren’t gonna medal. No corps has mastered the art and science of brass sound and execution as Crown has. When they put a show on the field that matches their proficiency in brass, they are almost impossible to beat. Inferno and E=MC2 are perfect examples. But when the concept stumbles, as it has the last two years, all those notes tend to stick out as show-off moments that don’t really work to help the show. And before you jump on me, as you have with anyone who dares to criticize Crown, Cappybara will tell you that I have levied these exact crticicsms of BD over the years. They have been the masters of musical show offs. When their show concepts actually take center stage, as they did with Tempest and Dreams, they are literally unbeatable. Music has to support the concept. It can’t just be as many notes as you can possibly play. Oh yes, BD are technical show offs as well! It so happens that I find their show offyness to be more organic. I think you're very on point with everything you've said, though I definitely don't help run this site I just so happen to be a student who has enough free time in the summer to follow an activity I love closely, and busy enough during the school year to disappear off of DCP in the offseason completely Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Incognito365 Posted August 11, 2018 Share Posted August 11, 2018 2 hours ago, Cappybara said: My favorites on the field are jazz and classical, though I know you're not much of a jazz fan I like jazz. I don't like Bluecoats or Blue Devil's jazz. I prefer smooth jazz. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Incognito365 Posted August 11, 2018 Share Posted August 11, 2018 Can we just get an entire Crown show to the style of Puck One from 2009? Please? I need some crazy, campy, fun Crown next year... 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wilme861 Posted August 11, 2018 Share Posted August 11, 2018 I personally love when Michael has to take two completely different scores and blend them together to sound as one piece. He is one of the best at doing this. The entire show of 2008 made up of I believe it was 10 different closers was incredible. I remember breaking it to a friend of mine that the opener wasn't one piece like he thought but 3 or 4 pieces woven into one. It blew his mind that he didn't notice it. The 2009 ballad with Somewhere from West Side and Somewhere over the Rainbow from Wizard of Oz. The 2011 show blending rock music with Rachmaninov. And 2016 with Li Triello and Hallelujah in the ballad. He is a GREAT arranger but he is human so we can't expect perfection every single year. 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Incognito365 Posted August 11, 2018 Share Posted August 11, 2018 3 minutes ago, wilme861 said: I personally love when Michael has to take two completely different scores and blend them together to sound as one piece. He is one of the best at doing this. The entire show of 2008 made up of I believe it was 10 different closers was incredible. I remember breaking it to a friend of mine that the opener wasn't one piece like he thought but 3 or 4 pieces woven into one. It blew his mind that he didn't notice it. The 2009 ballad with Somewhere from West Side and Somewhere over the Rainbow from Wizard of Oz. The 2011 show blending rock music with Rachmaninov. And 2016 with Li Triello and Hallelujah in the ballad. He is a GREAT arranger but he is human so we can't expect perfection every single year. He's just given us perfection every year, so have come to expect it. Lol. I honestly think it's the drill for me this year. It just doesn't suit the music... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
karuna Posted August 11, 2018 Share Posted August 11, 2018 22 minutes ago, wilme861 said: I personally love when Michael has to take two completely different scores and blend them together to sound as one piece. He is one of the best at doing this. The entire show of 2008 made up of I believe it was 10 different closers was incredible. I remember breaking it to a friend of mine that the opener wasn't one piece like he thought but 3 or 4 pieces woven into one. It blew his mind that he didn't notice it. The 2009 ballad with Somewhere from West Side and Somewhere over the Rainbow from Wizard of Oz. The 2011 show blending rock music with Rachmaninov. And 2016 with Li Triello and Hallelujah in the ballad. He is a GREAT arranger but he is human so we can't expect perfection every single year. I don't think this year is a failure of arranging so much as the choice of source material. In fact "If I Fell" is a masterpiece of arranging. I still cannot believe that dumb little pop tune turned into such a masterpiece. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Incognito365 Posted August 11, 2018 Share Posted August 11, 2018 8 minutes ago, karuna said: I don't think this year is a failure of arranging so much as the choice of source material. In fact "If I Fell" is a masterpiece of arranging. I still cannot believe that dumb little pop tune turned into such a masterpiece. Dumb? Woah woah, The Beatles are my absolute favorite. Don't dis the genius of Paul and John. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeRapp Posted August 11, 2018 Share Posted August 11, 2018 10 minutes ago, karuna said: I don't think this year is a failure of arranging so much as the choice of source material. In fact "If I Fell" is a masterpiece of arranging. I still cannot believe that dumb little pop tune turned into such a masterpiece. The concept isn’t strong enough, it’s that simple. Same with that stupid Statues show. Some things sound crazy great in a board room and then just don’t pan out in reality. I’m a Designer by trade, I know what that’s like. I’ve had more than my share of ideas that I convince myself were genius that fell flat on presentation. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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