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Madison Scouts 2018


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53 minutes ago, HockeyDad said:

Ahh the social justice warriers don't let a moment go to waste.  Madison Scouts can include or exclude whomever they wish for whatever reason they wish.  

 (Although this not pertain to the Scouts)... The irony here is that its apparently much easier for a male with a sexual criminal conviction with.an underage female who served jail time can find their way onto DCI Corps these days now than it is for a transgender marcher that has apparently broken no laws of any kind.

Edited by BRASSO
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 The Madison Scouts... and by extension the Cavaliers... may not be able to address this issue quite as easily long term as it might appear on the surface.  For example, the historical standard for the Madison Scouts to allow for consideration an applicant for a spot in line was their gender. They must be " male ". The determination for who is " male " was previously determined by one's Birth Certificate designation. However, the transgender issue complicated that historical standard. The new policy of the determination of " Male " is now mostly  " self identification ", not the birth certificate.  Makes sense, and the Madison Scouts seem willing to do the right thing here from reports, and reportedly will do what is humanely possible to allow transgenders to be chosen for a spot in line  based upon qualifications, and as for gender, " self indentifcation " as  male will suffice. Sounds like a good, short term solution. But it might not be, long term... especially for those that would like to see the Madison Scouts and the Cavaliers remain All Male Corps. This is because the " self identification " new standard may likely open up a Pandora's Box now down the line in the future. It would mean that ANY female, that " self identifies " as a " male " on a Madison Scouts application form would more than likely be required... legally... if qualified otherwise, to march either of these 2 Corps, as the " self indentification " policy now about to be adopted permits such. Both Corps would have a very difficult time legally disallowing such marchers from marching these 2 Corps, as a precedent has already been established as to how one's gender is determined in their new by laws, ie.... by the new " self indentification " standard.  It probably won't happen over night, but a successful challenge has apparently already been made by an applicant to the Madison Scouts that has ended the  birth certificate as the standard for the determination as to who is male or female. So this will be interesting to see how this all plays out... as this gender issue for these 2 current All Male Corps is by no means about to become settled matter...... just the opposite, imo.

Edited by BRASSO
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I read the Medium article on this.

Does anyone know how co-ed corps deal with this.

For example did he shower with the male or female corps members.

  

 

 

 

 

 

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8 minutes ago, rpbobcat said:

I read the Medium article on this.

Does anyone know how co-ed corps deal with this.

For example did he shower with the male or female corps members.

  

 

 

 

 

 

I was wondering the same thing!!! If he identifies as a male I'd say will the males right?

 

 

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5 hours ago, BRASSO said:

 (Although this not pertain to the Scouts)... The irony here is that its apparently much easier for a male with a sexual criminal conviction with.an underage female who served jail time can find their way onto DCI Corps these days now than it is for a transgender marcher that has apparently broken no laws of any kind.

Rather than using the struggle of the mm in question for your constant efforts to cast shade again on The Cadets, Brasso, you should address the public question also floating about why the auditionee perhaps for Madison and Blue Stars didn't want to return to the Crusaders where the marcher previously was a member.

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49 minutes ago, xandandl said:

Rather than using the struggle of the mm in question for your constant efforts to cast shade again on The Cadets, Brasso, you should address the public question also floating about why the auditionee perhaps for Madison and Blue Stars didn't want to return to the Crusaders where the marcher previously was a member.

 I have no idea on why marchers decide to leave their current Corps and transfer from one Corps to another. If you have followed my posts on DCP even remotely over the past few years, you must know how I feel about Corps marchers leaving Corps and transferring to another. So you are probably asking the single worst poster in me on DCP  to explain to you why ANY marcher(s) leave and go from one DCI Corps to another. As you must know, for one example,  former Boston Crusaders marchers have, by the hundreds, left the Boston Crusaders to then go march the Cadets over the years. I could only guess why each of them left, same as this former marcher. I never really found out the precise reasons they all left either . They left and went to another Corps for any number of reasons, I would imagine. It seems this young fellow left the Boston Crusaders on good terms from all reports though, (most do ), so I wish him well with whatever Corps he ultimately winds up with.... even if it was the Cadets he went to after he left Boston. Same as its ever been. Boston has never been a Corps with a rep for getting all bent out of shape when it loses marchers ( or former staffers ) to another Corps. it didn't with this young fellow either. So once again, I wish him well.

Edited by BRASSO
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1 hour ago, churchboy said:

I was wondering the same thing!!! If he identifies as a male I'd say will the males right?

 

 

I'm not sure.

You're talking about someone with female genitalia so you get into all kinds of potential predicaments,especially if you have have corps members who are minors.

 

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4 hours ago, kdaddy said:

"I don't care about the grievances of others." Who's the one being selfish exactly?

"I'm disgusted that others feel marginalized." Who's the one who is whining exactly?

Your lack of perspective is both disappointing and not surprising.

Russ Gavin said it impeccably: “If the Scouts are going to be all male, and they make the choice to label the transgender male as not fitting into that, I guess that is their right… but I would — in an organization that has been such a friend to the LGBT community historically — I would say you are at risk of being on the wrong side of history.”

Good one. I forgot that.  "I feel marginalized."  Look at me. 

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4 hours ago, quietcity said:

HockeyDad, if you could put aside your rage for a moment, you might see that there is an interesting and relevant question at hand here. While you may be uncomfortable with trans/non-birnary/fluid gender people, they are becoming more visible and outspoken, especially among the current teen/young adult generation. This is the same generation that is getting interested in drum corps. It behooves every corps, not just the Scouts, to give some thought to how best to accommodate such people, or be ready to justify rejecting them based solely on their gender identity. 

This is not an easy topic, in no small part because it stirs up such emotion. I know it did in me when I first began to deal with it.

Where did I say I felt uncomfortable?  I believe I said disgusted. Two very different things.  And before someone twists my words again, my disgust is with the self indulgent behavior. Not with the people 

Edited by HockeyDad
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58 minutes ago, rpbobcat said:

I'm not sure.

You're talking about someone with female genitalia so you get into all kinds of potential predicaments,especially if you have have corps members who are minors.

 

I don’t care what anyone does but this is going to bring on a few logistical problems.  It will be interesting to see how this plays out.  

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