The Cadets and GH history of sexual abuse (news article)

[MisterA]

41 minutes ago, Jeff Ream said:

here's the problems with your post:

 

several of us on here know some of them. We know their character. In fact one I know probably never even met some of the others. When word spread underground asking for people to come forward several people that never knew each other had similar stories. 

 

Here;s the other part....if you haven't been paying attention for at least 20 years, YEA is George and George is YEA. he made it that way. Puppet board that caved to his demands and whims, a constantly rotating cast of employees at the office...credit only to go to him, failure always went to others.

 

so since 1979, well really 82, George was the organization. 

Jeff, you start by saying "here's the problems with your post" and then say that, several of us on here know some of them. So how is that a problem with my post? I do not personally know them, or their stories. I don't know you personally to know that you know them. I do take into consideration the people, including you, that have mentioned on this board, that some of these women mentioned these things to other people decades ago. I only know an article that I read that looks bad. Very bad. But there were parts of the article that didn't add up. Nothing against the alleged victims, just things that were written that seemed to have an agenda. Again most of the questions I have regard more of the way the article was written than what these women had to say. I agree it seems highly suspicious that 9 different women all had similar experiences. But if I were on a jury, and the evidence provided was just the Inquirer article, and then the weird YEA post stating their side of it, I couldn't say 100% without a doubt is George guilty of everything. Even though I strongly dislike him, disagree with SO many decisions he has made over the last 10-12 years, and personally think he is an egocentric  horses caboose.

On the other part, I don't disagree that George has pretty much made himself the face of YEA. He is a dictator, and wanted total control. I agree and get that. Same thing with Cadets, he was definitely the face of Cadets. And I completely agree if something went wrong, he blamed others, and took credit for every success Cadets had. That being said, I do not agree that he WAS the Cadets, or WAS  YEA. To state that would completely discredit the thousands of young men and women that performed their butts off every year in all the organizations under that umbrella. George didn't win 10 championships, the kids on the field did. He may have tried to take the credit, and some of it he deserves for leading them, but like any good leader(which he clearly was not), he wanted the fame and glory for himself, instead of raving about the thousands of AMAZINGLY talented performers(and staff) he worked with over the years.

[GUARDLING]

9 minutes ago, N.E. Brigand said:

pAs I said earlier today, the dislike for Hopkins is so widespread and well-known that it will protect him in some people's eyes. Thank you for proving my point.

Here's the thing. As in most such cases, this matter is very unlikely to ever see a courtroom. You're probably going to have to make up your mind about Hopkins's culpability based on not much more than one or two articles, which like all writing anywhere is not going to answer all your questions.

Hopkins is not on trial. You don't have to decide "beyond a reasonable doubt".

Just ask yourself: if you had a kid in Cadets or Cadets2, and this article came out, and Hopkins was still there, would you let your kid stay in the corps?

 

 

People do and have. If people think this is the 1st they would be naive. Just because things don't hit the gossip pages of social media does not mean it didn't hit a newspaper, police dept. etc etc..maybe not with actual rape allegations but things have happened even way before DCI. It all depends what people believe ,or want to believe

 

Edited April 8, 2018 by GUARDLING

[theonlyfizzle]

Edited and remove

Edited April 8, 2018 by theonlyfizzle

[theonlyfizzle]

Oops wrong thread! My apologies

[Liahona]

Just now, theonlyfizzle said:

Oops wrong thread! My apologies

I was going to ask too..delete what...

[N.E. Brigand]

12 minutes ago, MisterA said:

But there were parts of the article that didn't add up. Nothing against the alleged victims, just things that were written that seemed to have an agenda. Again most of the questions I have regard more of the way the article was written than what these women had to say. I agree it seems highly suspicious that 9 different women all had similar experiences.

What are your specific concerns with the article? What questions do you think should be answered. You can write to the reporter. (I know some people here have done so.) Maybe she'll follow up. You can write to the board or the new staff leadership. (I'm sure some people here have done so.) Maybe they'll follow up.

The vast majority of accusations like this are true. The FBI says false reports happen only 3% of the time. To most of us, the fact that nine different people report similar experiences makes it more likely not less that they're telling the truth. You're almost certainly taking a healthy skepticism much too far.

Edited April 8, 2018 by N.E. Brigand
Edit: fixed another typo.

[furious-winter]

1 minute ago, N.E. Brigand said:

What are your specific concerns with the article? What questions do you think should be answered. You can write to the reporter. (I know some people here have done so.) Maybe she'll follow up. You can write to the board or the new staff leadership. (I'm sure some people here have done so.) Maybe she'll follow up.

The vast majority of accusations like this are true. The FBI says false reports happen only 3% of the time. To most of us, the fact that nine different people report similar experiences makes it more likely not less that they're telling the truth. You're almost certainly taking a healthy skepticism much too far.

Agreed. It boggles my mind when I read comments along the lines of "people may have had an ulterior motive in bringing these nine women together."

So what? Things like this need to be brought to light regardless of ulterior motives. 

[N.E. Brigand]

9 minutes ago, GUARDLING said:

Quote

Just ask yourself: if you had a kid in Cadets or Cadets2, and this article came out, and Hopkins was still there, would you let your kid stay in the corps?

People do and have. If people think this is the first, they would be naive. Just because things don't hit the gossip pages of social media does not mean it didn't hit a newspaper, police dept. etc., etc.--maybe not with actual rape allegations but things have happened even way before DCI. It all depends what people believe or want to believe.

Well, "people" do all sorts of foolish things, but I was specifically asking Mister A what he would do or what he would advise someone with kids in Cadets or Cadets2 to do if this story broke and the board at YEA decided to leave Hopkins in place. What would you do?

Edited April 8, 2018 by N.E. Brigand

[GUARDLING]

7 minutes ago, MisterA said:

Jeff, you start by saying "here's the problems with your post" and then say that, several of us on here know some of them. So how is that a problem with my post? I do not personally know them, or their stories. I don't know you personally to know that you know them. I do take into consideration the people, including you, that have mentioned on this board, that some of these women mentioned these things to other people decades ago. I only know an article that I read that looks bad. Very bad. But there were parts of the article that didn't add up. Nothing against the alleged victims, just things that were written that seemed to have an agenda. Again most of the questions I have regard more of the way the article was written than what these women had to say. I agree it seems highly suspicious that 9 different women all had similar experiences. But if I were on a jury, and the evidence provided was just the Inquirer article, and then the weird YEA post stating their side of it, I couldn't say 100% without a doubt is George guilty of everything. Even though I strongly dislike him, disagree with SO many decisions he has made over the last 10-12 years, and personally think he is an egocentric  horses caboose.

On the other part, I don't disagree that George has pretty much made himself the face of YEA. He is a dictator, and wanted total control. I agree and get that. Same thing with Cadets, he was definitely the face of Cadets. And I completely agree if something went wrong, he blamed others, and took credit for every success Cadets had. That being said, I do not agree that he WAS the Cadets, or WAS  YEA. To state that would completely discredit the thousands of young men and women that performed their butts off every year in all the organizations under that umbrella. George didn't win 10 championships, the kids on the field did. He may have tried to take the credit, and some of it he deserves for leading them, but like any good leader(which he clearly was not), he wanted the fame and glory for himself, instead of raving about the thousands of AMAZINGLY talented performers(and staff) he worked with over the years.

6

However one wants to look at it, the court of public opinion can litigate, defend, convict, commence with a trial, always be on the side of right. It can and has been more damning than actual law sometimes

[GUARDLING]

1 minute ago, N.E. Brigand said:

Well, "people" do all sorts of foolish things, but I was specifically asking Mister A what he would do or what he would advise someone with kids in Cadets or Cadets2 to do if this story broke and the board at YEA decided to leave Hopkins in place. What would you do?

what I meant to convey is that often people have been put in those positions and have stayed...for numerous reasons. There even have been a few on this site in these circumstances who had no intentions of leaving.