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It's time for original music


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Glad someone finally mentioned Cavs 2000-2002 and Saucedo. He may or may not own the rights to that music depending on the contract they had. But my.point is that it's great music!! Whoever said original music is mostly crap, I beg to differ. Especially with Saucedo those years. 

As for Florida Suite, the only Florida Suite I know of was written by Frederick Delius, a British composer 1862-1934. I'm not sure if that's now considered public domain.

 

Good composers are hard to find. I agree. But I would rather listen to original compositions than crappy arrangements of classical music that we've heard over and over again. 

There is plenty of music in the public domain that would be great to hear a corps play. Not sure if Messiaen is PD yet but I'd almost kill to see Turangalila put on a field. 

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Cavs in 2000 wasn't original music - Niagara Falls by Daugherty and Soundings by Cindy McTee (uncredited).  In 2001 each movement was based on an already existing piece, so it was more of a good-natured ripoff than completely original.  2002 and 2003 I think were in fact completely original though.

(and I agree, there's a ton of public domain music out there too...)

Mike

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23 minutes ago, MikeN said:

Cavs in 2000 wasn't original music - Niagara Falls by Daugherty and Soundings by Cindy McTee (uncredited).  In 2001 each movement was based on an already existing piece, so it was more of a good-natured ripoff than completely original.  2002 and 2003 I think were in fact completely original though.

(and I agree, there's a ton of public domain music out there too...)

Mike

For the sake of this discussion, how does a good natured rip off get away with it? Would it today? I'd argue that's mostly the end goal for most corps these days anyways.

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In the case of Cavaliers 2001, I'd say that was the perfect example of original music that was "inspired by" existing material.  Most folks wouldn't know (or care) what inspired it.  (And by "good natured" ripoff, I mean "inspired by" as opposed to "parody."  Sorry for all of the quotation marks.)

Mike

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3 minutes ago, MikeN said:

In the case of Cavaliers 2001, I'd say that was the perfect example of original music that was "inspired by" existing material.  Most folks wouldn't know (or care) what inspired it.  (And by "good natured" ripoff, I mean "inspired by" as opposed to "parody."  Sorry for all of the quotation marks.)

Mike

Similarly, Cadets '05, where the opener (Liquid) was "inspired" by Eric Whitacre's Equus, and the closer was "inspired" by Medea.

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On 7/11/2018 at 1:58 PM, ouooga said:

I guess that's my point then. The agreement should be for full rights, just like how drill works. I get it, the costs are different and the effort is different, but we're talking about an activity where most staff members make less than $2k for their 90-day commitment. Everyone volunteers their talents in this art to a point.

Also drill is definitely resellable. Aren't there tons of Band in a Box programs out there, with pre-programmed scalable drill? How is a line that contorts into a box in 16 counts performed by 64 horns (no copyright problems) so different from a 16 count 8th note run performed by the same 64 horns? The argument I'm making is obviously for drill to be protected under IP law better, but for the purpose of the activity I'd rather see arrangers going the open source drill route.

I have no experience with Band in a Box drill. I don't know what "scalable drill" would be. Who does the scaling? You can easily have either 64 or 16 horns play the same 16 count 8th note run. You can't have the same drill performed by 16 members and/or 64 members. The laws of time/space/movement wont allow it.

With regard to IP protection, there are limitations to what is feasibly protectable. The work has to be in some way unique or distinctive enough from other similar works to make it worth protecting.  You also need to be able to prove who first created the piece. We all borrow so much from each other in the activity that most things wouldn't qualify. e.g. Who created the first rotating box? Who creatd the first step-2 drill? Now, if you want to talk about diamond cutters or Z-pulls, that's a different story, but you won't find anything remotely that original in a Band in a Box show.

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7 hours ago, jpaul said:

 I have no experience with Band in a Box drill. I don't know what "scalable drill" would be. Who does the scaling? You can easily have either 64 or 16 horns play the same 16 count 8th note run. You can't have the same drill performed by 16 members and/or 64 members. The laws of time/space/movement wont allow it.

With regard to IP protection, there are limitations to what is feasibly protectable. The work has to be in some way unique or distinctive enough from other similar works to make it worth protecting.  You also need to be able to prove who first created the piece. We all borrow so much from each other in the activity that most things wouldn't qualify. e.g. Who created the first rotating box? Who creatd the first step-2 drill? Now, if you want to talk about diamond cutters or Z-pulls, that's a different story, but you won't find anything remotely that original in a Band in a Box show.

Scalable drill is a line with "clarinets" written above it, rather than dots for each clarinet. So, time/space/movement are all accounted for with spacing. It's not 16 to 64 though, it's written for band size (ie. 25-50 members, 50-100 members, etc.). Buy the program that fits your band size, adjust spacing, march and play. 

To your point, agreed, protecting music and drill (if the latter is possible) are completely different. I'm just trying to come up with a solution to music that doesn't result in 'the best we can do is mute the shows when they're on demand' and wholly-owned music is the best I can come up with. I'm definitely open to suggestions if you have them.

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7 hours ago, ouooga said:

Scalable drill is a line with "clarinets" written above it, rather than dots for each clarinet. So, time/space/movement are all accounted for with spacing. It's not 16 to 64 though, it's written for band size (ie. 25-50 members, 50-100 members, etc.). Buy the program that fits your band size, adjust spacing, march and play. 

To your point, agreed, protecting music and drill (if the latter is possible) are completely different. I'm just trying to come up with a solution to music that doesn't result in 'the best we can do is mute the shows when they're on demand' and wholly-owned music is the best I can come up with. I'm definitely open to suggestions if you have them.

Interesting. I never knew such a thing existed.

Rights management is a crazy beast. I don't know what the answer is, but there's gotta be a better way.

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