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2019 Bloooooooooooooocoats

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13 hours ago, cfirwin3 said:

I just have to say, I love hearing about this standing and playing stuff (which usually focuses on the blistering runs that nobody has ever played on the move, in any era) or it focuses on the ballad impacts (that appropriately don't get covered in drill movement... because... ballad impact, and stuff).

Anyway, I love hearing about this and then going back to the old, old school stuff where they stood around and played while the judges ticked off points for foot placement at a standstill, or inconsistent highstep on the mark time.  It's a riot to make the comparison.

I just can't go to any time period and make comparisons where corps were handling the music and movement differently.  Likewise, when you get the focus off of the impact moments and complex passages, you find that these kids are moving a ton while playing (Vanguard included).

A show like Vanguard '89, where I think many would reguard as one of the very best presentations... For as good as the music is, there's nothing really in there that can't easily be played on the move.  And when the soloists or small ensemble features come up, those kids are planted firm.  When the drum features come up, they park it while the horns do visual stuff.  That's how it's done.

Soloists are the best examples on this issue.  If playing on the move is a lost art, then why do soloist presentations look the same now as they did in the 70's?

These multi camera productions that we see much more frequently these days (there used to be only one, and it was on PBS once a year) are deceptive.  They always frame in the easy target and avoid the broad picture.  And that bolsters the argument.  I've seen some wide angle SCV stuff this year (and Bloo)... They are playing and hoofing it plenty and parking when any other corps before them would do the same.

Thanks for your reply, but I'm not talking about soloists. I'm talking about the hornline as a whole. Again, I am the biggest Vanguard homer and their hornline literally never plays while moving at a pace faster than a moderate walk. NO corps, except Crown and Stars, play difficult passages on the move. We're not talking a few soloists or a small ensemble parked. We're talking an entire section or an entire hornline parked. Again, watch Flo from the high camera view, focus solely on the hornline, what's being played, and who's moving. 

You can absolutely go to different time periods and see how corps are handling music and movement differently. Watch '91 Star vs '19 Vanguard and you can absolutely see the difference. Not only was '91 Star playing more difficult music, they were playing that music while marching extremely difficult and fast moving drill. They were also staying true to the original compositions and not arranging music for the sake of adding difficulty (which all corps today do). There are dozens of examples of this from the late 80s through mid-2000s. Now, I know fast doesn't always equate to difficulty, but it's certainly more difficult to do what Crown is doing than what Vanguard is doing. 

I'm honestly so bored with this season. The formula is the same across most corps. Move, stop playing runs, move, stop play runs, repeat, repeat, repeat. It's boring. The only shows I like, and will likely watch going forward, are Bluecoats and Crown.

Edited by queenanne_1536

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30 minutes ago, queenanne_1536 said:

Thanks for your reply, but I'm not talking about soloists. I'm talking about the hornline as a whole. Again, I am the biggest Vanguard homer and their hornline literally never plays while moving at a pace faster than a moderate walk. NO corps, except Crown and Stars, play difficult passages on the move. We're not talking a few soloists or a small ensemble parked. We're talking an entire section or an entire hornline parked. Again, watch Flo from the high camera view, focus solely on the hornline, what's being played, and who's moving. 

You can absolutely go to different time periods and see how corps are handling music and movement differently. Watch '91 Star vs '19 Vanguard and you can absolutely see the difference. Not only was '91 Star playing more difficult music, they were playing that music while marching extremely difficult and fast moving drill. They were also staying true to the original compositions and not arranging music for the sake of adding difficulty (which all corps today do). There are dozens of examples of this from the late 80s through mid-2000s. Now, I know fast doesn't always equate to difficulty, but it's certainly more difficult to do what Crown is doing than what Vanguard is doing. 

I'm honestly so bored with this season. The formula is the same across most corps. Move, stop playing runs, move, stop play runs, repeat, repeat, repeat. It's boring. The only shows I like, and will likely watch going forward, are Bluecoats and Crown.

I kinda agree with you.

I have been quite critical of corps parking their brass to play their most challenging passages. But after years of seeing Blue Devils rack up high 90s scores, you do what works, and that’s what works. 

Ultimately, for me, the quality of the music is why I am drawn to drum corps. That’s not to say I don’t love marching, guard and drill. But the most powerful moments for me are fundamentally music moments. I’ve gotten to the point in which I am okay with corps staging key soloists or solo groups, in non-marching formations, for the most challenging musical passages. For me it’s a trade off I am willing to make.

Crown and to some extent, perhaps, Knights, seem willing to combine super challenging music with super challenging marching. But until the judges decide to reward this over park and bark, I can’t blame designers for staging shows as they now are doing.

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52 minutes ago, queenanne_1536 said:

Thanks for your reply, but I'm not talking about soloists. I'm talking about the hornline as a whole. Again, I am the biggest Vanguard homer and their hornline literally never plays while moving at a pace faster than a moderate walk. NO corps, except Crown and Stars, play difficult passages on the move. We're not talking a few soloists or a small ensemble parked. We're talking an entire section or an entire hornline parked. Again, watch Flo from the high camera view, focus solely on the hornline, what's being played, and who's moving. 

You can absolutely go to different time periods and see how corps are handling music and movement differently. Watch '91 Star vs '19 Vanguard and you can absolutely see the difference. Not only was '91 Star playing more difficult music, they were playing that music while marching extremely difficult and fast moving drill. They were also staying true to the original compositions and not arranging music for the sake of adding difficulty (which all corps today do). There are dozens of examples of this from the late 80s through mid-2000s. Now, I know fast doesn't always equate to difficulty, but it's certainly more difficult to do what Crown is doing than what Vanguard is doing. 

I'm honestly so bored with this season. The formula is the same across most corps. Move, stop playing runs, move, stop play runs, repeat, repeat, repeat. It's boring. The only shows I like, and will likely watch going forward, are Bluecoats and Crown.

Star 91... Single valve arpeggiated ostinatos.  It sounds cool, but it isn't difficult. That show had half the number of sets and twice the standstill as today.

It was a great show.

It's a bogus claim.

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Most of the music these kids are playing I couldn’t play on my best day, sitting in a chair in an air conditioned studio. Humans can only do so much, given how bodies work. It’s astounding what all these corps put on the field, truly amazing. If the best corps play the most compelling music while standing on a stage then so be it. 

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At the risk of being cliche, I just saw the movie Rocketman, and literally all I could think about was if Bluecoats did an Elton John themed show. It would be epic!

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8 hours ago, cfirwin3 said:

Star 91... Single valve arpeggiated ostinatos.  It sounds cool, but it isn't difficult. That show had half the number of sets and twice the standstill as today.

It was a great show.

It's a bogus claim.

Number of sets is a pretty bogus benchmark.  Writers today subset the crap out of everything.  You may have had only 120 sets but they were 32 count sets and broken down in subsets at the field level -- not on paper.   

I won't even touch "sounds cool vs difficult" because that's likely to set off an unlicensed fireworks display!

giphy.webp

Edited by karuna
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Tomorrow night's the big test, Coats vs Vanguard head to head.

 

Best of luck y'all!!

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10 minutes ago, Super Don-O said:

Tomorrow night's the big test, Coats vs Vanguard head to head.

 

Best of luck y'all!!

I just watched the local weather. I think we’ll probably dodge the rain. 🤞

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rJPpJHh.jpg

Bloo Abbey Road (Part 2)

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13 hours ago, MikeRapp said:

At the risk of being cliche, I just saw the movie Rocketman, and literally all I could think about was if Bluecoats did an Elton John themed show. It would be epic!

Horror. The costumes!

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