“Failure to Protect”

[MikeD]

7 hours ago, Bluzes said:

 

Right apples and oranges but now the apples are polluting the oranges we must address the apples can't fix the oranges otherwise. DCP is a testament to the dedication to dci. That we have threads like this with folks doing their best to right the ship for dci. The apples don't seem to care. At most BOA has fans for a few years and then their kids move on.

There needs to be a grassroots effort to wake up the high schools to this issue. Life just goes on for them, business as normal no repercussions when these issues crop up in the schools. Look at recent events like Pittston Pa, the Skyliners got more of a black eye than administrators at the school. Hoschton, GA  heck dci is even going back this year no repercussions. There are many other examples that BOA and other Band Associations treat sexual misconduct as business as normal. The failure to protect article supposedly a hit piece on dci makes me fear for the kids taking extracurricular activities in high school, not being on a well supervised dci tour. That's a real apples and oranges comparison, how was any of it a dci issue the tours have been safe regardless of who was on the staff or who played a solo for the DCA Kilties or the Jim Ott Ensemble.

 

This fight (failure to protect) needs to be taken up at the Parent Teachers Association level Nationwide, not pushing off it to a third party (dci) like this article suggests. We can fire all the Dan's in the world and dci may still fade away. Lets say Not Fade Away and be the ones that pushes this issue up to the National PTA level where it belongs and can do the most good for kids in general not just the 3500 or so involved in dci. These sexual issues affects all kids / all parents and anyone else that cares for the safety of our youth..

School systems are responsible for anybody they hire. Marching band is but one relatively tiny area. Band circuits are not run by member bands, like DCI is run by the member corps. Bands pay fees to compete at BOA/TOB/USBands/etc sponsored around the country. That is the sum total of the circuits involvement with individual bands. To somehow drag them into this discussion is just not valid, which is Jeff's point.  

I just had my fingerprints taken and background check done in order to substitute teach in two districts. Newly implemented in NJ this year is a law called "Don't pass the trash". I had to identify any district I worked at going back 20 years, and provide contact info, so the districts where I sub can contact them to see if I was let go for poor behavior. Districts used to just state that teachers resigned....now they must disclose the issues. 

[MikeD]

1 hour ago, Bluzes said:

This is more than a #### storm for dci. The Failure To Protect article paints a picture where millions of kids are at risk just going to school and being around these individuals. Has nothing to do with who played a solo decades ago or mentioning names that were not cited in the failure to protect misplaced hit piece. We all heard the rumors of folks mentioned above but none of that is making it unsafe to be on tour in 2019. All dci needs to do is clean up their act going forward. The past is the past and none of us really know what went on if things are tied up in NDA's and we may never know or even need to know.

I am not sure why you are mixing up drum corps with scholastic programs. School systems are responsible for each and every person they hire in any capacity, at every level. They have nothing at all to do with drum corps, nor should they. In some of the drum corps cases, the school systems did what they were supposed to do, and individuals lost their teaching licenses. If a drum corps hires them, how is that even relevant to a school system?

[MikeD]

1 hour ago, JimF-LowBari said:

Wrong, it doesn’t matter where the suspected abuse occurs. If a mandated reporter hears about or thinks they see evidence of suspected abuse they must report it period.

Have family members in teaching. If they thinking abuse is going on in the students house they must report. Not just in the school. In one case kid came to class with a bruise the shape of a hand on the face. Authorities were called immediately.

Just wondering, what makes Dan a "mandated reporter" at all?

 

 

 

[Jeff Ream]

7 hours ago, Bluzes said:

Guess I am just trying to make the apples to apples comparison. I am not saying it is the right thing to do but calling for Dan's head and not the heads of the other band association CEO's in similar scenarios is hypocritical. The focus is in the wrong place, where is the public BOA Forum where we can really discuss the failure to protect? Dan is in a tough spot being the head of an origination that folks love and show great dedication to versus originations that don't experience such loyalty and it enables them to fly under the radar and perpetrate the issue.    

In my opinion the drum corps community is placing too much of the onus on dci and to a lessor extent the Corps themselves for these issues (which seems upside-down). GH is being handled in the courts and most of the other allegations have their roots outside of misdeeds while the corps were on tour. Granted certain individuals should not have been involved with the Corps in any capacity. I have faith that the up coming Directors Meetings will come up with appropriate solutions such as zero tolerance, no second chances. However no matter what dci does or does not do, it is not going to affect the failure to protect our youth since it's the Administrators, Lawmakers, Principals and Teachers that are failing to protect. dci is just doing the mop-up.

in the band circuit world. in most cases, the band directors are not on the board and are not the director of the circuit. That's why. Scholastic is a totally different beast with way more involved than you want to give credit to it. 

 

and as for DCI, as we have been told time and time again: DCI IS THE CORPS. They set the rules, they write the bylaws, they tell Dan what to do and what not do. So when we say DCI, we're not just saying Dan. We are talking the DCI Board, the boards of these corps.

 

To me accepting accountability for decades of inaction means more than just saying " here's what we are doing now". DCi's statements show no contrition, no remorse for the fact they ignored it. It's all CYA for going forward. 

[Jeff Ream]

3 hours ago, garfield said:

Once you have his head on a pike, then what?

What about Morrison's board of directors?  When they don't fire him, will you go after them with the same vigor and vitriol?

 

no cause his wife would ignore doing the right thing too. Moody was only gone because of the Hopkins story

[Jeff Ream]

3 hours ago, garfield said:

And, once again, you made up a whole bunch of crap and lay it forward like it's fact.

That's what is shameful on this issue, IMO.

You have no idea what "directive" was given, or if there was even a specific directive given in this case that can be identified.

"...knew about Larson, knew about Hopkins, knew about Fiedler..."   One person claims that are not corroborated is not "documented", it's a single claim.

You hit it on the head: All those "good ole boys" did, in fact, marginalize and minimize Dan's role but, for some reason, you can't seem to accept that as fact.

"If he resigns now...", that's all just crap.  Your opinion is valid, but it's just an opinion.

Keeping Dan and his staff in place until and unless he's proven culpable in the heinous acts by his ACTUAL inaction (not his purported inaction, and not the action that would be demanded if the acts happened today) is the best way to assure that the remaining drum corps have a tour on which to perform and attract members.

It's a hard business decision, but it is just a business decision and the right answer is to attack the guilty and the enablers that hired them.

let's be honest here....Larson had a record you could look up online...and the people that reported it were ignored by some, threatened by others. While I won't dive into the other names mentioned, Larson had had that record for a decade plus when he was reported. I know you got all ###### at me last time when Larson came up, but that's not defensible in any way shape or form. one good google search would lead to you the fact he was on the sex offenders registry, and he was participating in DCI events with the Kilties.

[Jeff Ream]

2 hours ago, cixelsyd said:

No.  Hold people accountable... when you actually KNOW they were bad actors.

Larson was reported in 2012, and was easily researched to be found on the sex offenders registry. 

 

so we KNOW

[Jeff Ream]

8 hours ago, Bluzes said:

 

Right apples and oranges but now the apples are polluting the oranges we must address the apples can't fix the oranges otherwise. DCP is a testament to the dedication to dci. That we have threads like this with folks doing their best to right the ship for dci. The apples don't seem to care. At most BOA has fans for a few years and then their kids move on.

There needs to be a grassroots effort to wake up the high schools to this issue. Life just goes on for them, business as normal no repercussions when these issues crop up in the schools. Look at recent events like Pittston Pa, the Skyliners got more of a black eye than administrators at the school. Hoschton, GA  heck dci is even going back this year no repercussions. There are many other examples that BOA and other Band Associations treat sexual misconduct as business as normal. The failure to protect article supposedly a hit piece on dci makes me fear for the kids taking extracurricular activities in high school, not being on a well supervised dci tour. That's a real apples and oranges comparison, how was any of it a dci issue the tours have been safe regardless of who was on the staff or who played a solo for the DCA Kilties or the Jim Ott Ensemble.

 

This fight (failure to protect) needs to be taken up at the Parent Teachers Association level Nationwide, not pushing off it to a third party (dci) like this article suggests. We can fire all the Dan's in the world and dci may still fade away. Lets say Not Fade Away and be the ones that pushes this issue up to the National PTA level where it belongs and can do the most good for kids in general not just the 3500 or so involved in dci. These sexual issues affects all kids / all parents and anyone else that cares for the safety of our youth..

first off, nothing happened at Skyliners that has been reported. So it really did nothing for them. And living within a drive of Pittston, you have no idea whats actually going on up there. However I have friends there, and they know whats going on, and trust me, there's all kinds of things hapening you dont hear about. 

 

while yes you have bad actors in drum corps that were also bad actors in band, the problem in band is that states often just suspend a license and dont follow up with criminal action, and they also dont share that information nationwide. So while i do believe DCi needs to be held accountable, if the information from various states isnt available to the general public, I can't fault DCi for that. I fault DCi for the things they knew about, and the rules they ignored putting on place until they had to because of bad press.

 

DCI's issues are their own in the making since 1972.

[Bluzes]

53 minutes ago, MikeD said:

School systems are responsible for anybody they hire. Marching band is but one relatively tiny area. Band circuits are not run by member bands, like DCI is run by the member corps. Bands pay fees to compete at BOA/TOB/USBands/etc sponsored around the country. That is the sum total of the circuits involvement with individual bands. To somehow drag them into this discussion is just not valid, which is Jeff's point.  

I just had my fingerprints taken and background check done in order to substitute teach in two districts. Newly implemented in NJ this year is a law called "Don't pass the trash". I had to identify any district I worked at going back 20 years, and provide contact info, so the districts where I sub can contact them to see if I was let go for poor behavior. Districts used to just state that teachers resigned....now they must disclose the issues. 

This is where I go wrong posting here, I am not a teacher or use dci as a livelihood. I realize bringing negative light on teachers is not a place to go here. I mean no harm I know 99 % of our teachers are great people. The Failure To Protect has worked me up by taking aim at dci when the problems emanated  from the school districts. That rings clear, why didn't the author site the Texas & Oregon School Districts or where ever instead of drum corps. Folks in Philly and the general public would be more enlightened by sexual misconduct in the school district than unknown drum corps, their kids go to school may not be in drum corps. Why is the author limiting her reach and missing the point so much, is her uncle up next to take over for Dan or something?

It's a new day it does not matter how different Band Originations are run they shouldn't  escape scrutiny. Fly under the radar when their schools are breading sexual predators? Dci has an issue that it can only put a band aid on at best. The problem is an influx of these individual who already ruined students lives in a school environment and the answer is dci needs to be run better fire everyone who got us to this point but don't go anywhere else here? What about the kids that were already affected, it's OK for that to go on just don't bring it to DCP? Or should I just duck my head in the sand and believe dci has a chance of fixing this on their own?

[BigW]

2 hours ago, JimF-LowBari said:

Wrong, it doesn’t matter where the suspected abuse occurs. If a mandated reporter hears about or thinks they see evidence of suspected abuse they must report it period.

Have family members in teaching. If they thinking abuse is going on in the students house they must report. Not just in the school. In one case kid came to class with a bruise the shape of a hand on the face. Authorities were called immediately.

You bet, Jim. It's been that way for years, not just in PA. Went through a harrowing NY teacher's in service circa 1990 on child abuse and reporting. What was said in that presentation about stuff that happens to kids in graphic ways left me pretty messed up at the end of it. If they wanted to make their point... they made it.