karuna

Field judges restricted to front sideline in 2019

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54 minutes ago, MikeD said:

A judge on the track should not be evaluating balance

 

40 minutes ago, Jeff Ream said:

anyone trying to call out balance from field level is wrong. that's an upstairs thing

In my typing haste I misused a definition; I meant it in the sense of front to battery timing/phasing not in a sense of musical balance. Sorry.

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53 minutes ago, gbass598 said:

They are also high school kids in a competition with no dedicated percussion judge. Apples and oranges. Having taught groups who have been adjudicated at BOA regionals, the field judges there pick up and point out a great deal of stuff and provide great commentary to the group on a musical level appropriate to their skill level.

 

WGI doesn’t have judges on the floor and their writing doesn’t suffer. I don’t see a group like Chino Hills, Avon, or Ayala suffering because someone isn’t on the floor picking ticks from 10 feet away. It almost sounds like you would advocate a return to the tick system.

And having been associated with arranging, instructing, and adjudicating hs ensembles since the MBA days I can assure you that the battery books for BOA Grand National Finals today are extremely watered down compared to the wonderfully complex, and wonderfully executed, battery books back when a perc judge at MBA Grand Nats awarded a best percussion trophy.  Also, since you brought up apples/oranges, WGI is a completely different fruit unto itself and has no real connective association to full band stadium percussion adjudication.

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3 hours ago, FTNK said:

I think eventually there will be 5 or so  judges in the box, giving “overall” scores out of 100. Best average wins.

Similar to OMEA, where I do think they also threw out the top and bottom number or did at one time. 

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1 hour ago, Stu said:

And having been associated with arranging, instructing, and adjudicating hs ensembles since the MBA days I can assure you that the battery books for BOA Grand National Finals today are extremely watered down compared to the wonderfully complex, and wonderfully executed, battery books back when a perc judge at MBA Grand Nats awarded a best percussion trophy.  Also, since you brought up apples/oranges, WGI is a completely different fruit unto itself and has no real connective association to full band stadium percussion adjudication.

Add different acoustics... different distances and sight lines.

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On 1/13/2019 at 12:15 AM, jeffmolnar said:

Honestly, if you can't tell the difference from the front row of the stands, what is the point?

If it has to be explained to you, then to you it's just band.

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8 hours ago, Stu said:

And having been associated with arranging, instructing, and adjudicating hs ensembles since the MBA days I can assure you that the battery books for BOA Grand National Finals today are extremely watered down compared to the wonderfully complex, and wonderfully executed, battery books back when a perc judge at MBA Grand Nats awarded a best percussion trophy.  Also, since you brought up apples/oranges, WGI is a completely different fruit unto itself and has no real connective association to full band stadium percussion adjudication.

The only way those equate to each other is if DCI decides to stop judging percussion all together. I’d be willing to bet the much larger reason in the BOA example you cited is due to changes in the judging structure and the sheets as a whole from that time until now.

Its not a valid comparison because the sheets and scoring aren’t changing. Only where they stand. You would have a valid point if they eliminated percussion judging all together but they are not. The sky is not falling and nobody will be claiming their group got screwed on finals night because Jeff Prosperie wasn’t standing 5 feet in front of their split snare 32nd notes.

in regards to WGI, I’m willing to bet their sheets are pretty similar to DCI in how they judge content and execution.

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IMO, with the exception of SCV, the execution of the battery has declined since all of the body work and scripted, contrived over emoting has become the norm.  The kids are performing drum books that have little to do with the actual overall musical package much of the time and with the drum judge now farther away, the attention to detail and focus on rhythmic clarity with even further diminish.  

I don't want to go back to a time where the drumline mowed the 50, but getting back to a time where the focus was on playing the drum and creating music rather than creating a body move with a funny face while simply playing noise that someone wrote for no musical purpose would be a step in the right direction.

I love the fact that the one group who is unapologetically "music first" has been dominating this ridiculous era of acting over drumming. Watching a drumline groove to 8's?  EIGHT ON A HAND? Really?  Not to mention, most of the parts that are intended to "groove" really don't actually groove. Bridgemen grooved. Hard.  The Thurston XMen lines grooved.  They grooved hard.  I haven't heard a drumline play a phrase that threw down and grooved since SCV RamRod IMO. The current SCV is a clean, musical machine but the music, appropriately so, doesn't groove because the music doesn't call for it.

Sure, the kids these days are indeed playing harder and harder books than ever before.  Are the executing these books as clean as ever?  No, not even close.  Are the books they are being asked to perform contributing positively to the overall musical picture?  IMO, no.  I always ask myself, would Stevie Wonder dig it?  Would Stevie Wonder be able to sit and listen to this stuff and be musically intrigued without the dancing around and scripted, contrived facial emoting?  I seriously doubt it.

 

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9 hours ago, Stu said:

 

In my typing haste I misused a definition; I meant it in the sense of front to battery timing/phasing not in a sense of musical balance. Sorry.

even then from field level that's a very slippery slope.

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36 minutes ago, gbass598 said:

The only way those equate to each other is if DCI decides to stop judging percussion all together. I’d be willing to bet the much larger reason in the BOA example you cited is due to changes in the judging structure and the sheets as a whole from that time until now.

Its not a valid comparison because the sheets and scoring aren’t changing. Only where they stand. You would have a valid point if they eliminated percussion judging all together but they are not. The sky is not falling and nobody will be claiming their group got screwed on finals night because Jeff Prosperie wasn’t standing 5 feet in front of their split snare 32nd notes.

in regards to WGI, I’m willing to bet their sheets are pretty similar to DCI in how they judge content and execution.

Did ya not notice that I said by removing the field judge that DCI has 'started going in the direction of' BOA, not that they have already arrived.

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