denverjohn Posted February 12, 2019 Share Posted February 12, 2019 18 hours ago, MikeD said: Regarding Dennis, they also followed him to Bayonne from the Muchachos before that. A good piece of the Garfield drumline went to the Cabs after the 71 season, because Garfield let George Tuthill go, and he was at Hawthorne already. I mean, who would want to play for the new guy at Garfield in 72, Fred Sanford. 🙄 I did! Dubinsky and I with Bergenfield rookies managed 6th in percussion in Whitewater with no percussion staff on tour. (Fred was with SCV all summer). '73 looked like chaos so I aged-out with a Racine Kilties experience. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeD Posted February 12, 2019 Share Posted February 12, 2019 5 minutes ago, denverjohn said: I did! Dubinsky and I with Bergenfield rookies managed 6th in percussion in Whitewater with no percussion staff on tour. (Fred was with SCV all summer). '73 looked like chaos so I aged-out with a Racine Kilties experience. I left with the rest but I came back and picked up baritone for 72, since I had brass class coming up in the fall of 72. Being taught by Don Angelica and Frank Levy was also a great experience.Tour was indeed crazy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stu Posted February 13, 2019 Share Posted February 13, 2019 (edited) 10 hours ago, Weaklefthand4ever said: It would be interesting to me to hear from a tour director (past or present,) on the specifics of how housing is secured and what the requirements currently are for both the corps and the housing / practice site. I simply don't have the background in anything resembling that type of thing to see beyond the problem to, in turn, thing through possible solutions. 6 hours ago, BRASSO said: Ya, I don't really have much experience of this whole " school housing issue". I'm guessing however that the schools don't just give their gym, dorm rooms, fieldhouse, football field, practice fields, parking lots, etc gratis to Corps. Schools don't ordinarily have every facility on campus being utilized in the summers. I'd imagine in many cases, they just sit there.. vacant in some cases. Schools don't make money when the only thing in the school facility is air. Many schools are strapped for cash. I'd imagine if a hugh traveling Drum Corps wants to rent their facilities during the low season of the summers, such schools are willing to make a buck in the process. As for scandals, unless there are more shoes to drop, at the moment, I'm not reading that a whole lot of schools are withholding their facilities ( and forgoing the rental income monies that presumably come with that ) over " scandals ". I have read some schools that have done so ( primarily in the PA/ NJ/ NY corridor ), but not a lot of schools so far that have nixed their facility rentals with Corps in DCI in any wholesale fashion. Maybe this becomes problematic for DCI in the future, who knows. But I'm not seeing such abandonment of DCI Corps by the schools so far in any large degree. And even the individual Corps beset by scandals in their own Corps have seemingly found suitable school, housing, practice fields, and Show stadiums, etc replacements without much trouble as well... as near as I can tell, anyway. I have helped the directors of two corps find housing; one an Open Class and the other a World Class. I can only relay my own experiences. I found that many schools now have scholastic activities year round, and they take precident; including bumping scheduled corps stays. Also many athletic directors will schedule things when they discover an outside organization wants to use their sports facilities. Other schools shut down the entire school and only have elec/ac to the main office in the name of saving money. Moreover insurance is becoming more of an issue, as well as leasing costs for the use of the sites is increasing exponentially. As for how hard it is to secure a site.... It was far easier to book schools for the OC corps. The corps was always happy with just what was offered, which by the way would be the envy of any major corps from the late 1980's or earlier. Sometimes housing was free, but most times payment was in order. The main problem with finding housing for the WC corps was their demanding expectations placed on the hosting schools. Do not get me wrong, the corps staff was always extreamly greatful and polite to the hosts. But when a demand goes out for the main rehearsal site being a high stadium turf field, along with three or four seperate rehersal fields for sectionals, use of the full parking lot, access to three to four gyms, band room, stage access, not just for sleeping but in case of rain, access to classrooms for driver/food staff sleeping, ad infinitum, with no distractions from other functions going on at the school, finding housing for them throughout the season was a major pain in the keester. Edited February 13, 2019 by Stu Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeD Posted February 13, 2019 Share Posted February 13, 2019 1 hour ago, Stu said: I have helped the directors of two corps find housing; one an Open Class and the other a World Class. I can only relay my own experiences. I found that many schools now have scholastic activities year round, and they take precident; including bumping scheduled corps stays. Also many athletic directors will schedule things when they discover an outside organization wants to use their sports facilities. Other schools shut down the entire school and only have elec/ac to the main office in the name of saving money. Moreover insurance is becoming more of an issue, as well as leasing costs for the use of the sites is increasing exponentially. As for how hard it is to secure a site.... It was far easier to book schools for the OC corps. The corps was always happy with just what was offered, which by the way would be the envy of any major corps from the late 1980's or earlier. Sometimes housing was free, but most times payment was in order. The main problem with finding housing for the WC corps was their demanding expectations placed on the hosting schools. Do not get me wrong, the corps staff was always extreamly greatful and polite to the hosts. But when a demand goes out for the main rehearsal site being a high stadium turf field, along with three or four seperate rehersal fields for sectionals, use of the full parking lot, access to three to four gyms, band room, stage access, not just for sleeping but in case of rain, access to classrooms for driver/food staff sleeping, ad infinitum, with no distractions from other functions going on at the school, finding housing for them throughout the season was a major pain in the keester. The band I taught tried under two different band directors over time to host a corps, and the admin always had an excuse reason why that year was not good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stu Posted February 13, 2019 Share Posted February 13, 2019 (edited) 18 minutes ago, MikeD said: The band I taught tried under two different band directors over time to host a corps, and the admin always had an excuse reason why that year was not good. Sounds about right. I remember one of the high schools we contacted that had an indoor football practice facility with turf. The admin emphatically told us they did not allow any outside organization whatsoever to use 'any' of their sports fields or gyms. So we were not welcome to stay at the school nor allowed to use any of their fields. Later on we found out that they did indeed lease that indoor facility out to an arena football franchise. Edited February 13, 2019 by Stu Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Ream Posted February 13, 2019 Share Posted February 13, 2019 On 2/11/2019 at 6:55 PM, HockeyDad said: For marching in a drum corps? Or for marching in the school’s marching band? for drum corps. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Ream Posted February 13, 2019 Share Posted February 13, 2019 On 2/11/2019 at 9:02 PM, HockeyDad said: I think Jeff hit the nail on the head concerning the biggest issue in front of the corps when it comes to housing: fallout from the abuse scandal. Do YOU want to be the superintendent who allowed “that group” to stay at your school? Things could spiral out of control at the speed of social media, which is fast. We saw it happen last summer, especially in the PA/NJ/MD area. Plus due to liability, fewer schools are allowing overnight guests of any sorts. Plus then you have added costs for staff/maintenance/AC...several schools around here turn the AC off on Thursday during the summer and don't turn it back on til Monday Morning Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Ream Posted February 13, 2019 Share Posted February 13, 2019 13 hours ago, xandandl said: In short, LowBari, the allowance is the immediate issue, closing schools limits it further and is a problem rapidly looming on the horizon. Those who shut their eyes are doomed by the blindness. The lessening of schools available for housing in areas where corps shows are held is one end of the spectrum; whether the available schools will allow the facilities to be used, particularly due to the awareness of the scandals is the other. Both pivot on costs: to the corps and relative to the scandals, to the school (liability costs, legalities, etc.) It is not always a binary choice. Shows in Greater Boston/R.I., N.J./N.Y./CT. and especially Allentown, PA are representative moments where options are fewer, availability even less. But by no means is the matter merely restricted to the North East, Mid-Atlantic, and New England. Florida, Colorado, and Wisconsin-Illinois are other areas where corps tours have already been touched by the trends, and DCI corps have had to adjust. Where corps are able to hold Pre-Tour Preparations (PTP)/"Spring Training"/"Everydays" is getting harder to come by due to these factors; this is seen especially in what financial costs the corps must spend for the housing and use of campus facilities (whatever the high school/college/university/etc.) Designers have become more demanding (cf. matters about props, height and type of stadium and its field, etc.) BD and Pioneer have had their own properties, but BD doesn't provide either housing nor all meals so cost outlays by mms need be adjusted. Crown and a few other corps have investigated obtaining property for winter camps and PTP; obviously real estate costs (purchase, maintenance; insurance for example) have their own onus. Closing schools and cost shifts by colleges is already effecting many engineering majors in drum corps as required courses and required internships become more restricted in rotation of courses offered. No longer are universities offering every course every semester for the student to choose based on the student's convenience. And the announcement of these shifts aren't often made to the students before they sign up and are contracted for a corps. This is one reason why you'll hear as late as April that so and so top corps has a hole in the battery or lead line. Of course, who follows through with timely paying for camps and tours eliminates some, but making the choice between giving up a semester or marching this corps this season has been heaped upon many well-intentioned, diligent mms. Hockey Dad will be glad to learn that the engineering majors particularly do drum corps for the personal challenge and the love of the activity. Their loss is felt worse it would seem as aging-out is not delayed. and by the way, especially in the areas you mentioned, the biggest issue for lost housing? Corps that left the schools looking like #### 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Ream Posted February 13, 2019 Share Posted February 13, 2019 3 hours ago, Stu said: I have helped the directors of two corps find housing; one an Open Class and the other a World Class. I can only relay my own experiences. I found that many schools now have scholastic activities year round, and they take precident; including bumping scheduled corps stays. Also many athletic directors will schedule things when they discover an outside organization wants to use their sports facilities. Other schools shut down the entire school and only have elec/ac to the main office in the name of saving money. Moreover insurance is becoming more of an issue, as well as leasing costs for the use of the sites is increasing exponentially. As for how hard it is to secure a site.... It was far easier to book schools for the OC corps. The corps was always happy with just what was offered, which by the way would be the envy of any major corps from the late 1980's or earlier. Sometimes housing was free, but most times payment was in order. The main problem with finding housing for the WC corps was their demanding expectations placed on the hosting schools. Do not get me wrong, the corps staff was always extreamly greatful and polite to the hosts. But when a demand goes out for the main rehearsal site being a high stadium turf field, along with three or four seperate rehersal fields for sectionals, use of the full parking lot, access to three to four gyms, band room, stage access, not just for sleeping but in case of rain, access to classrooms for driver/food staff sleeping, ad infinitum, with no distractions from other functions going on at the school, finding housing for them throughout the season was a major pain in the keester. the last paragraph especially! I have heard this on multiple occasions. It's why you see several of them renting major college stadiums Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeD Posted February 13, 2019 Share Posted February 13, 2019 17 minutes ago, Jeff Ream said: We saw it happen last summer, especially in the PA/NJ/MD area. Plus due to liability, fewer schools are allowing overnight guests of any sorts. Plus then you have added costs for staff/maintenance/AC...several schools around here turn the AC off on Thursday during the summer and don't turn it back on til Monday Morning I know here in NJ, any time people are in the building a black seal custodian must be present. Black Seal refers to being certified to operate the heating system, i.e. the furnace. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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