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I think George Hopkins is innocent


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2 hours ago, GlassmenBtone said:

 "he said she said"

We could discuss why the delay, but let's stick to the he said she said. Please address the folowing without naming anyone:

In some cases the he/she said concering the sexual encounter can be in agreement. For example Party A, the accused, and Party B, the accuser, both admit that sexual relations occured just after Party B had consumed intoxicating substances. On that they are in agreement. However, Party A claims the sex right after that consumption was consensual; and Party B says there is no way consent was given. While there are legal definitions of full intoxication, it is a known fact that any consumption of an intoxicating substance at all impares judgement while it is in the blood system.

Please, GlassmenBtone, answer this simple question: (In your opinion) can Party B actually give sexual consent to Party A just after consuming intoxicating substances? And if so, please also explain the ethics of your response.

Edited by Stu
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8 minutes ago, GlassmenBtone said:

 You would feel the same way too if one of the drum corps that motivated you to march became tainted with these sexual assault allegations.

Please explain how you know what I would feel or believe.

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2 minutes ago, Stu said:

We could discuss why the delay, but let's stick to the he said she said. Please address the folowing without naming anyone:

In some cases the he/she said concering the sexual encounter are in agreement. For example Party A, the accused, and Party B, the accuser, both admit that sexual relations occured just after Party B had consumed intoxicating substances. On that they are in agreement. However, Party A claims the sex right after that consumption was consensual; and Party B says there is no way consent was given. While there are legal definitions of full intoxication, it is a known fact that any consumption of an intoxicating substances at all impares judgement while it is in the blood system. Please, GlassmenBtone, answer this simple question: (In your opinion) can Party B actually give sexual consent to Party A just after consuming intoxicating substances? And if so, please also explain the ethics of your response.

I don't know the specifics of the allegations, all I've read is the Yea announcement from a year ago and some of the 100 pages of the last george hopkins thread that was locked about a month ago. I don't follow drum corps as much as I used to. As for your hypothetical I of course don't think an intoxicated person can consent to sex. Personally I wouldn't allow my female loved ones to be alone with men that would take advantage of them but that's another story I guess.

 

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10 minutes ago, GlassmenBtone said:

I don't know the specifics of the allegations, all I've read is the Yea announcement from a year ago and some of the 100 pages of the last george hopkins thread that was locked about a month ago. I don't follow drum corps as much as I used to. As for your hypothetical I of course don't think an intoxicated person can consent to sex. Personally I wouldn't allow my female loved ones to be alone with men that would take advantage of them but that's another story I guess.

 

Please read up on what has already been publically admitted to, by the accused, as it applies to defense of consent; and then get back with us concerning what I just placed in bold font within your post.

Edited by Stu
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14 minutes ago, GlassmenBtone said:

Its just my opinion that he is innocent. You would feel the same way too if one of the drum corps that motivated you to march became tainted with these sexual assault allegations. 

How does the first sentence connect with the second? This is the same thing my area heard about Penn State for years.... oh they have done so much that is good, something this horrible could never have happened...

imo wait for the trial...

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20 minutes ago, Stu said:

Please read up on what has already been publically admitted to, by the accused, as it applies to defense of consent; and then get back with us concerning what I just placed in bold font within your post.

So I found this article from a month ago

 

https://www.mcall.com/news/police/mc-nws-allentown-cadets-george-hopkins-online-deny-accusations-20190111-story.html

 

George is still vehemently denying these allegations and as long the verdict hasn't come down I will continue to be on his side. It sounds like both parties may have been intoxicated therefore neither side could consent technically. Keep in mind I'm not a lawyer just trying to make sense of what to me is an unbelievable turn of events that sounds like a couple women may just be trying to cash in on the "metoo" movement. Many people around here don't like george hopkins because he has been so successful and has an unorthodox style, but lets not crucify the man before we see the results of the trial. That is all I'm saying

Edited by GlassmenBtone
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59 minutes ago, GlassmenBtone said:

Its just my opinion that he is innocent. You would feel the same way too if one of the drum corps that motivated you to march became tainted with these sexual assault allegations. I don't want to believe that young girls were taken advantage of while on tour. I never saw any of this when I toured, only the occasional night when I would accidentally sleep too close to a gay color guard couple and wake up to some of the most horrifying noises I've ever heard. Hopefully these allegations aren't true and the whole ordeal can be swept under the rug so George Hopkins can go back to churning out championship caliber drum corps 

And of course you realize his recent programming interferences because of his runaway ego was inhibiting his championships right?  Please read all the material that has been submitted to the courts (who wouldn’t be proceeding without something substantial to move forward with).  You may want to modify your opinion.  The Cadets (in my opinion) are far far better off with him removed from the org.  If it is the Cadets you like, continue being a fan and supporter with the team they’ve assembled and you will enjoy them for years to come,

Edited by LabMaster
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2 minutes ago, GlassmenBtone said:

So I found this article from a month ago

 

https://www.mcall.com/news/police/mc-nws-allentown-cadets-george-hopkins-online-deny-accusations-20190111-story.html

 

George is still vehemently denying these allegations and as long the verdict hasn't come down I will continue to be on his side. It sounds like both parties may have been intoxicated therefore neither side could consent technically. Keep in mind I'm not a lawyer just trying to make sense of what to me is an unbelievable turn of events that sounds like a couple women may just be trying to cash in on the "metoo" movement. Many people around here don't like george hopkins because he has been so successful and an unorthodox style, but lets not crucify the man before we see the results of the trial. That is all I'm saying

Nope, sorry hoss; that is not all you are saying. You claim you believe he is innocent (see title of thread) along with your initial postings. You also just posted, and I quote, "I of course don't think an intoxicated person can consent to sex. Personally I wouldn't allow my female loved ones to be alone with men that would take advantage of them." And now you are spinning and wiggling after a discovery that the sex occured after intoxication. So, now I ask, not a guilt of rape question, but I ask: could the women accusers here have given their consent now that you know intoxicating substance was in fact consumed?

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12 minutes ago, GlassmenBtone said:

So I found this article from a month ago

 

https://www.mcall.com/news/police/mc-nws-allentown-cadets-george-hopkins-online-deny-accusations-20190111-story.html

 

George is still vehemently denying these allegations and as long the verdict hasn't come down I will continue to be on his side. It sounds like both parties may have been intoxicated therefore neither side could consent technically. Keep in mind I'm not a lawyer just trying to make sense of what to me is an unbelievable turn of events that sounds like a couple women may just be trying to cash in on the "metoo" movement. Many people around here don't like george hopkins because he has been so successful and has an unorthodox style, but lets not crucify the man before we see the results of the trial. That is all I'm saying

I'm not sure what planet you are living on.  It is NOT going to matter what is decided in the court of law.  GH is done in this activity for good.  There is no coming back from this one. So I can honestly give a rats (bleep) whether he is denying these accusations or not.  I also could care less how many championships he brought home to The Cadets.  I am really perplexed as to how you can conflate these two separate issues.  There were over a dozen women with sexual complaints of a various nature...not just a "couple" of women...Reading comprehension maybe is not your forte.

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