Stu Posted April 7, 2019 Share Posted April 7, 2019 (edited) 22 minutes ago, BigW said: Stu... I'm exasperated. I've desperately tried to explain that even though you're more than possibly right, people don't act as rationally as you so, so, SOOOOOO... demand them to act. And because of that, DCI has to deal effectively with it and do the PR and damage control. Ok. You are in the camp that BD must pay; it might not be fair; but because the corps are DCI, and the perception that all corps are DCI, including BD, then BD must pay for the sins of a few. Edited April 7, 2019 by Stu Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stu Posted April 7, 2019 Share Posted April 7, 2019 (edited) 20 minutes ago, Weaklefthand4ever said: Both may be correct. A) is correct in regards to BD as far as we know. The same could be said for the majority of corps to the point of your previous replies. B) is also correct in the real world be it fair or not and we could again substitute many, many corps into BD's spot in the statement and it would still be relevant and STILL be not fair. But again, when did fair become the measuring stick or topic of the thread? I still don't disagree with you. I just don't see a way to change the perceptions of others when I have no direct or indirect control. That's two. You and BigW are in the same camp that BD must pay; it might not be fair; but because the corps are DCI, all corps including BD, and that is also the perception, then BD must pay for the sins of a few. Now what does JimF and Gar have to say? Edited April 7, 2019 by Stu Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garfield Posted April 7, 2019 Share Posted April 7, 2019 35 minutes ago, rpbobcat said: I may have missed it,but has anyone talked about the December "Failure to Protect" piece. To me,that article was,in a number of ways,more damaging then the story about GH going public. That article pointed out a number of systemic problems with the activity. DCI's failure to either have their CEO be interviewed or even answer written questions did not, based on comments made at the time,put DCI in a very good light. That article,and follow up posts on sites like Reddit,as unreliable as they can be sometimes, could give school boards cause to rethink housing corps. I know there are a number of people on DCP with "ties" to corps or DCi. Does anyone know what DCI has done since this article came out ? DCI.org/about I'll say it again because it appears you didn't read the answers earlier (you should): DCI's Chairman of the Board is a lawyer with no affiliation with any current drum corps. New Policies are detailed in the about page, and even drumcorpsworld has had updates and lets you search articles. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigW Posted April 7, 2019 Share Posted April 7, 2019 23 minutes ago, Stu said: Ok. You are in the camp that BD must pay; it might not be fair; but because the corps are DCI, and the perception that all corps are DCI, including BD, then BD must pay for the sins of a few. 1: Your reactions have been stubborn wild hyperbole and rather crass. 2: Naming particular corps at this point as you have and proclaiming certain ones innocent could well be very premature. You have an agenda? I firmly believe at least one more shoe will drop in the future. Some think more. 3: As stated on previous posts, in stress situations, groups and individuals will paint organizations with a broad brush. Whether you like it or not, the corps who haven't been guilty of anything have to do the PR and get the message out, over, and over, and over again until people begin to figure it out, much like I'm doing with you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garfield Posted April 7, 2019 Share Posted April 7, 2019 38 minutes ago, rpbobcat said: I may have missed it,but has anyone talked about the December "Failure to Protect" piece. To me,that article was,in a number of ways,more damaging then the story about GH going public. That article pointed out a number of systemic problems with the activity. DCI's failure to either have their CEO be interviewed or even answer written questions did not, based on comments made at the time,put DCI in a very good light. That article,and follow up posts on sites like Reddit,as unreliable as they can be sometimes, could give school boards cause to rethink housing corps. I know there are a number of people on DCP with "ties" to corps or DCi. Does anyone know what DCI has done since this article came out ? Please point to the "systemic" problems the article talked about. The choice to have a live interview or to respond to written questions lies entirely with DCI exec and BoD. The choice they make doesn't in any way hint or indicate anything about which they are accused. The circumstances regarding the request to interview and the ultimate selection of written questions are not quite as clear-cut and indicative as you suggest. Band directors in school districts that can, and want to, host drum corps shows can have a frank discussion with the school board when the request is made. There's little to suggest that school board members will be made aware otherwise of the accusations against the activity, let alone the background. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stu Posted April 7, 2019 Share Posted April 7, 2019 (edited) 19 minutes ago, BigW said: 1: Your reactions have been stubborn wild hyperbole and rather crass. 2: Naming particular corps at this point as you have and proclaiming certain ones innocent could well be very premature. You have an agenda? I firmly believe at least one more shoe will drop in the future. Some think more. 3: As stated on previous posts, in stress situations, groups and individuals will paint organizations with a broad brush. Whether you like it or not, the corps who haven't been guilty of anything have to do the PR and get the message out, over, and over, and over again until people begin to figure it out, much like I'm doing with you. Yes I have an agenda. It is that individuals and organizations are innocent until proven guilty. That until you show verifiable proof that BD is another shoe to drop then BD, and the pletheora of other corps for that matter, is/are 100% innocent. My agenda is also that the innocent should not be held responsible for the guilty. Your item #3 discusses other people's perception an public relations; well your item #2 indicates that your perception is that BD might very well be guilty; that they should not be presumed as innocent. If I am being stubborn and crass it is because I firmly believe innocence as a default until guilt is proven. Edited April 7, 2019 by Stu Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stu Posted April 7, 2019 Share Posted April 7, 2019 (edited) Try this on for size y'all. One year ago charges were brought against an individual. If there is a trial, and I would happen to be on the jury, I hold that the accused at the start of the trial is innocent, 100% innocent; irrespective of my opinion of the personality of the individual. And it is the responsibility of the prosicution to prove guilt. If that proof is sufficent I will vote guilty without reservation; if not sufficent, then innocence is maintained, also without reservation. I believe that strongly in the presumption of innocence. Again, this is irrespective of my opinion on the personality of the individual. Edited April 7, 2019 by Stu Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimF-LowBari Posted April 7, 2019 Share Posted April 7, 2019 (edited) 1 hour ago, Stu said: That's two. You and BigW are in the same camp that BD must pay; it might not be fair; but because the corps are DCI, all corps including BD, and that is also the perception, then BD must pay for the sins of a few. Now what does JimF and Gar have to say? A) this is real life b) life ain’t always fair so (my) a and b.... and never said BD has to pay. A and b again and continually saying it ain’t fair, which is ain’t, isn’t helping.... if you have any suggestions lets hear them Edited April 7, 2019 by JimF-LowBari 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stu Posted April 7, 2019 Share Posted April 7, 2019 8 minutes ago, JimF-LowBari said: A) this is real life b) life ain’t always fair so (my) a and b.... and never said BD has to pay. A and b again and continually saying it ain’t fair, which is ain’t, isn’t helping.... if you have any suggestions lets hear them I did make a suggestion. Start with looking up the truth as to how many known convicted sexual offenders have been directly involved with all DCI corps from 1972 to the present. But if memory serves, you said that you did not care. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimF-LowBari Posted April 7, 2019 Share Posted April 7, 2019 (edited) 9 minutes ago, Stu said: I did make a suggestion. Start with looking up the truth as to how many known convicted sexual offenders have been directly involved with all DCI corps from 1972 to the present. But if memory serves, you said that you did not care. I don’t care, because me knowing how many there were/are isn’t going to help the situation. Are you suggesting anything to DCI or the corps? Are you coming up with something to present to school districts to help convince them to accept corps? Or are you just doing social media posts for two days straight whining how this isn’t fair. And then blasting people who can see the schools side of the issue. Yes a very small percentage of corps people are predators. There are also a small percentage of the general population that are predators also. But the schools still do what they can to protect against the general population ones. Until DCI can be perceived as being totally clean then they will be treated like the general population. Edited April 7, 2019 by JimF-LowBari Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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