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drumcorpsfever

You May Take The Field in Exhibition

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30 minutes ago, DCIat14 said:

I think the underlying frustration I read in to the original post is that the same 4 corps stay at the top.  I don't think many would argue that the top 3 have been near impossible to break in to regardless of what is brought to the table by other corps.

Is it true that the same four corps stay at the top? I would say there is one corps that does, and others who move in and out. I've been posting to DCP since the fall of 2009. In the nine years since, seven corps have medaled: the infamous G7, as it happens. And for the first two years since the abortive G7 putsch, those seven corps were the top seven. But then things started to change a little. Here's how each of them placed in each year 2010-2018 (in alphabetical order):

Blue Devils: 1,2,1,2,1,1,2,1,2

Bluecoats: 3,7,6,5,2,3,1,5,3

Cadets: 5,1,4,3,3,4,6,7,7

Carolina Crown: 4,4,2,1,5,2,3,3,4

Cavaliers: 2,3,8,7,6,9,5,4,6

Phantom Regiment: 6,5,3,6,7,7,8,9,11

Santa Clara Vanguard: 7,6,5,4,4,5,4,2,1

 

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34 minutes ago, LyricalCoder said:

Participation ribbons for everybody! :dancin:

That's one way to put it, sure. Another would be what Charles Ives said when he was awarded the Pulitzer and gave away the award money:

"Prizes are for boys, and I'm all grown up."

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7 hours ago, drumcorpsfever said:

Yes. Exactly. This is where the competition resides. It’s not so much with the elites.It’s why Open Class and SoundSport are so vital to the activity’s future. 

But not the money or “the draw”.  Just ask them.

 

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10 hours ago, drumcorpsfever said:

Perhaps its time for DCI to become an exhibition showcase for the marching elite. DCI can be FOUR corps running across the great landscape of America, wowing the wanna-be’s at their regional and community shows.

It has gotten to the point where 80% of the attention is given to 20% of “World-Class corps.  National touring and broadway shows on football fields are not for every corps. In fact, the majority of groups can only dream of playing on that field. So, maybe its time for the elite to stop beating up on the little ones and go off and do their own thing - as the showcase of  “Marching Music’s, Major League”.

I started following in the 70s and the top corps we’re getting all the attention. When was this magical time that the little corps trying to learn to play and march got all the love? I guess I missed it 

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1. The G7 tried this.  "We are the 7 best corps in DCI and no one comes to see the other guys.  We want all the control of the activity and all the money".  Signed: The Cadets, The Blue Devils, Vanguard, Phantom Regiment, The Cavaliers, Carolona Crown and The Bluecoats.  If we went along with this dumb idea Boston would be sitting at home and Phantom and The Cadets would be Top 7 for life.  No G4 please.

2.  People come to see their corps, their friends, their kids, their relatives.  Civilians just don't come in numbers to watch band, fact.  Having 4 corps with no scoring equals NO FANS!  Star did this.  They did fill venues, but not stadiums.  The model was not a big ticket long term project.  Broadway....great for a while but where are they now?

3.  LIsten closely -  I am staring at you with my hands on your shoulders - drumcorps is for members NOT fans.  This activity is great for many reasons, and its fun to watch.  But it isn't for you Mr./Mrs. fan.  It needs you, it is indifferent to DCP, it needs your money and attention, but you aren't the focus.  End talk with light slap on the cheek.  Capiche?

4.  I like the guy that said you aren't a fan of drumcorps if the battle for 12th doesn't excite you.  I agree and add the best corps fans ##### are in seats at the beginning of the show.  The most loyal fans top corps list doesn't stop at the Top 5, Top 12, Top 17.  True blue fans know who the Jersey Surf is, Genisis, Music City etc.  If you only want to see/discuss/rank/watch the Top 3 corps that is your right.  You are a fan of the Top 3 but not DCI.  Sorry not sorry.

 

Edited by jonnyboy
typo

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9 hours ago, drumcorpsfever said:

I love competition as much as anyone. But, really, look at almost any show and you can pretty safely know the order before the show even starts.   Where is the “competition”?

That becomes true within a season... but it isn't true until about half way through.

Were you not a fan in the 80's, 90's and 00's?

Drumcorps that are in your bracket are fighting to even make finals this year.

Drumcorps that weren't in finals then are in your bracket now.

Not to mention the jockeying and position cycling that has happened between these eras.

Your thesis seems to be driven by an extremely small sample of time and a narrow focus on 1 drumcorps.

Edited by cfirwin3

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2 hours ago, jonnyboy said:

1. The G7 tried this.  "We are the 7 best corps in DCI and no one comes to see the other guys.  We want all the control of the activity and all the money".  Signed: The Cadets, The Blue Devils, Vanguard, Phantom Regiment, The Cavaliers, Carolona Crown and The Bluecoats.  If we went along with this dumb idea Boston would be sitting at home and Phantom and The Cadets would be Top 7 for life.  No G4 please.

2.  People come to see their corps, their friends, their kids, their relatives.  Civilians just don't come in numbers to watch band, fact.  Having 4 corps with no scoring equals NO FANS!  Star did this.  They did fill venues, but not stadiums.  The model was not a big ticket long term project.  Broadway....great for a while but where are they now?

3.  LIsten closely -  I am staring at you with my hands on your shoulders - drumcorps is for members NOT fans.  This activity is great for many reasons, and its fun to watch.  But it isn't for you Mr./Mrs. fan.  It needs you, it is indifferent to DCP, it needs your money and attention, but you aren't the focus.  End talk with light slap on the cheek.  Capiche?

4.  I like the guy that said you aren't a fan of drumcorps if the battle for 12th doesn't excite you.  I agree and add the best corps fans ##### are in seats at the beginning of the show.  The most loyal fans top corps list doesn't stop at the Top 5, Top 12, Top 17.  True blue fans know who the Jersey Surf is, Genisis, Music City etc.  If you only want to see/discuss/rank/watch the Top 3 corps that is your right.  You are a fan of the Top 3 but not DCI.  Sorry not sorry.

 

1.  No G4, please.  Right.  But I believe the facts belie your opinion.  Try filling a stadium, or even covering the cost of the DCI contract, if your show has no top 6 corps and you'll find out quickly how much draw those top corps have.  It's a symbiotic relationship between the top corps and all the others. The top corps "release" some DCI gate revenue to those corps to challenge them, and the "non-G" corps get financial benefit from sold out stadiums that, otherwise, probably wouldn't be.

2.  Go to a band competition.  People do come to see their bands, their friends (other parents), their kids, and their relatives.  And band show (and WGI) organizers get to sell the same seat multiple times per show!  "Civilians" (who else are we talking about?) do, in fact come to see the band geeks play (and ring their cowbells in appreciation).

3.  Listen closely back at ya':  drum corps is organized to provide an experience for kids, but those kids get very little of the "experience" (and all of the work) if there are no fans to buy tickets.  If "it" (the activity) needs fans, then "it" can't thumb its nose at the fans who support it.  "I have an emotional attachment to my children and I spoil them as you can see.  They talk when they should listen."  Capiche paisano?

4.  I completely disagree with this.  Is the activity going to disavow the ticket price of a BD fan if said fan comes only for BD's performance after all (except maybe one or two) other corps have already performed?  Your definition of the "most loyal fans" is inaccurate and skewed.  I know many people directly involved with the activity who don't like, and aren't excited, by almost anything of the performance.  They give time, money, effort, and enthusiasm even while they turn up their nose at the design choices.  "True Fans" don't have to love, or even support, ANY corps let alone every corps.

Edited by garfield
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8 minutes ago, garfield said:

2.  Go to a band competition.  People do come to see their bands, their friends (other parents), their kids, and their relatives.  And band show (and WGI) organizers get to sell the same seat multiple times per show!  "Civilians" (who else are we talking about?) do, in fact come to see the band geeks play (and ring their cowbells in appreciation).

I appreciate your responses.  To clarify, I meant the general public (civilians-non corps/band people) would not attend a drumcorps exhibition in any significant numbers.  The tickets buyers are family and friends of the corps and the activity.  If you reduce DCI to 4 exhibition corps you would be cutting the potential audience down drastically.  Drumcorps is just not worthy of a stadium tour for pure entertainment purposes. 

 

19 minutes ago, garfield said:

4.  I completely disagree with this.  Is the activity going to disavow the ticket price of a BD fan if said fan comes only for BD's performance after all (except maybe one or two) other corps have already performed?  Your definition of the "most loyal fans" is inaccurate and skewed.  I know many people directly involved with the activity who don't like, and aren't excited, by almost anything of the performance.  They give time, money, effort, and enthusiasm even while they turn up their nose at the design choices.  "True Fans" don't have to love, or even support, ANY corps let alone every corps.

I 100% agree with this and don't think it is contrary to what I said.  I won't disavow a BD fan that buys a ticket to see only their corps.  Neither would I disavow a Pioneer fan that buys a ticket to see their corps then leaves after the performance.  I will say that anyone that only counts 4 corps in DCI isn't a fan of the big picture.  I believe there are many would could not care less if every corps after 8th place folded.  They can be a very loyal fan of the Blue Devils, or the Top 3 or Top 12 or bottom 12, but if that's all they are a fan of they aren't a fan of DCI. 

 

I agree that true fans don't have to support ANY corps let alone all.  I find myself volunteering more than ever, but I have no interest in seeing a show.  None.  I like to see the results page and read reviews, but I could not care less who wins, places or shows.  I am truly puzzled when people submit topics like this one, pairing DCI down to 4 corps.  I was very puzzled, but not surprised, that some greedy corps wanted the G7.  

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3 hours ago, jonnyboy said:

1. The G7 tried this.  "We are the 7 best corps in DCI and no one comes to see the other guys.  We want all the control of the activity and all the money".  Signed: The Cadets, The Blue Devils, Vanguard, Phantom Regiment, The Cavaliers, Carolona Crown and The Bluecoats.  If we went along with this dumb idea Boston would be sitting at home and Phantom and The Cadets would be Top 7 for life.  No G4 please.

Although there are probably some subtleties that I'm not considering, I agree that the whole G7 concept was pretty much a completely narcissistic power / money pull IMHO. I do get what the OP is trying to say and we should at least recognize that it's coming from a good place. we ALL want to see this activity thrive. The G7 concept just isn't the way to do it. 

DCI needs to get off their collective ##### and actually advertise and push the activity forward. Right now, they don't have the proper staff to actually do that (or apparently the desire.) But the G7 concept is certainly not the way after reading what I have read. 

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