Eleran Posted August 7, 2019 Share Posted August 7, 2019 1 minute ago, cfirwin3 said: Those kids that are playing beautifully under mic, can certainly meet you where you are at (I promise). But ... are ALL the players being mic'ed? Or just the stars (beyond the issue of solos)? That is I think one of the questions a lot of the others have here, beyond the issues that I have. What I believe some here are concerned at is that the wonderful ability of the most talented players is being amplified, while other player are being relegated to the aural background. Again - in my case, that concern is secondary to the simple desire to hear acoustic instruments acoustically. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jurassic Lancer Posted August 7, 2019 Share Posted August 7, 2019 (edited) 18 minutes ago, cfirwin3 said: Are they being secretive? I don't think they are concerned with it, because on the 'inside', it isn't an issue. Tell the brass instructors in Crown or SCV that fans are concerned about how they are using amplification to sound better than they are... and they will laugh... hard... then pause to look you in the face. And then laugh again. They would do that because their compartmentalized job has nothing to do with electronic amplification. They teach articulation, breath control and facility. I am postulating it is secretive because other than here and now we really haven’t addressed the nuts and bolts of how the integration of sound mixing and performance technique have intermixed. It is happening but even we, dare I say the best informed fans in the activity, have not been this frank and rational in our discussions. What we are discussing has been tossed about in rants, but now we are trying to drill down to what is happening by the best practices of top corps. And it is a bit jarring even if it is the right direction. So please allow some of us latitude in processing the information as it is unfolding. Edited August 7, 2019 by Jurassic Lancer 6 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarimbaManiac Posted August 7, 2019 Share Posted August 7, 2019 5 minutes ago, Eleran said: Again - in my case, that concern is secondary to the simple desire to hear acoustic instruments acoustically. Then don't go to any live music performances, ever. Amplification for reinforcement and balance is ubiquitous across all genres and venues, with very limited exceptions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eleran Posted August 7, 2019 Share Posted August 7, 2019 (edited) 3 minutes ago, MarimbaManiac said: Then don't go to any live music performances, ever. Amplification for reinforcement and balance is ubiquitous across all genres and venues, with very limited exceptions. Yeah. Such as symphonies and opera, which are the live music performances I prefer. But thank you for telling me how to live my life, when its DCI that is changing its tune, not my preferences which remain the same. Edited August 7, 2019 by Eleran 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cfirwin3 Posted August 7, 2019 Share Posted August 7, 2019 1 minute ago, Jurassic Lancer said: I am postulating it is secretive because other than here and now we really haven’t addressed the nuts and bolts of how the integration of sound mixing and performance technique have intermixed. It is happening but even we, dare I say the best informed fans in the activity, have not been this frank and rational in our discussions. What we are discussing has been tossed about in rants, but now we are trying to drill down to what is happening by the best practices of top corps. And it is a bit jarring even if it is the right direction. So please allow some of us latitude in processing the information as it is unfolded. I don't mean to come across terse. I am suggesting that the drumcorps likely have no clue that this is some sort of "issue" in fandom because their motivations, usage, and the fact that microphones can be seen and amps are abundant all point to a fairly open book on the subject. I think this has to do with the fact that we see an image with a section of instruments all seeming to have a microphone on... and certain fans instantly deduce the worst motivation, causes and effects (no matter how far fetched and impossible). I think we can demonstrate that the type of usage that is being suggested is not only far fetched, but also impossible as a means of remediation for inability (of the sort being discussed). Amplification does the opposite... it exposes. It can't make a brass instrument at mp (from a person that, for some unknown reason, can't play at fff) sound like fff. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cfirwin3 Posted August 7, 2019 Share Posted August 7, 2019 (edited) 12 minutes ago, Eleran said: But ... are ALL the players being mic'ed? Or just the stars (beyond the issue of solos)? That is I think one of the questions a lot of the others have here, beyond the issues that I have. What I believe some here are concerned at is that the wonderful ability of the most talented players is being amplified, while other player are being relegated to the aural background. Again - in my case, that concern is secondary to the simple desire to hear acoustic instruments acoustically. If I had a group facing back or hidden behind staging and I wanted them to sound like they were out front facing... I would mic 'em all up in a heartbeat if that was the effect that I wanted. It has nothing to do with their capability... it has to do with making the impossible possible within the design. Concerning the amplification of talented people... you can't make a group of 40 sound like 60, no matter how you mic them. 40 mic'd members will sound like 40. This is how it works when you cut members from a difficult passage... it loses body (you can't get around it and the mic's can't lie). Edited August 7, 2019 by cfirwin3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarimbaManiac Posted August 7, 2019 Share Posted August 7, 2019 (edited) 5 minutes ago, Eleran said: Yeah. Such as symphonies and opera, which are the live music performances I prefer. Each of which are performed in meticulously designed venues built specifically for that type of music to be performed in. INSANE amounts of money and technical knowhow have gone into the design of concert halls, including shaping the rooms for natural reflections, removing right angles that can trap sound, treating the surfaces to maximize reflection in specific ways, and STILL they end up using amplification in certain circumstances. Football stadiums, have none of those things. Neither do most clubs, bars, amphitheaters, band shells, breweries, parks, high school gymnasiums, or any other place you can think of that might host live music, which is why engineers get paid lots of money to make those venues sound as balanced and full as possible. Edited August 7, 2019 by MarimbaManiac 2 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eleran Posted August 7, 2019 Share Posted August 7, 2019 Which is why you have 24 trumpets outside instead of 2-6 inside. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cfirwin3 Posted August 7, 2019 Share Posted August 7, 2019 1 minute ago, Eleran said: Which is why you have 24 trumpets outside instead of 2-6 inside. That's doesn't make it all good. I, personally, can't stand collegiate marching bands. Can't stand them one bit. It's not about the numbers. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terri Schehr Posted August 7, 2019 Share Posted August 7, 2019 Just now, cfirwin3 said: That's doesn't make it all good. I, personally, can't stand collegiate marching bands. Can't stand them one bit. It's not about the numbers. I’m sad. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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