SuperSaderFan

Here is a thought on broadcasting shows

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2 hours ago, Slingerland said:

My understanding is that the live theatre events go through Tom Blair's team, which is not connected with Flo.  Finals week content is streamed by Flo, but the content is produced and directed by Blair's group.

Correct.

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22 hours ago, Glenn426 said:

"hiring" for the length that they are needed. Contract workers. Since there was concerns about hiring Interns to run the cameras. These "Professionals" would only be paid for 8 weeks to cover the whole season, and they would have the "experience" necessary to put on a quality production.

Twitch's policy says that you have to secure Licensing for the Music. DCI already does this for the FLO Broadcast and the Bluray Sales. So what difference would it make if its for FLO or on Twitch. The Licensing fees are the same as long as the Streams are live. With no rewatch (VOD) available. DCI posted a $497,046 cost to stream in 2017 so you would assume that some of those cost are associated with the Music rights fees. It's not clear who is paying for the rights for the current streaming structure. Maybe FLO and DCI are splitting the cost, Maybe DCI is paying for all of it or maybe FLO is paying for all of it.

You can choose to be ignorant on how Twitch works, that's on you. The information is there on how money can be made by DCI from switching to Twitch.

https://kotaku.com/twitch-launches-subscriber-only-streaming-feature-1835883968

DCI Spent $497,046 to stream via FLO and the Big loud and live events. That much money can be used in different ways if the format changes from FLO to Twitch. Also I would imagine that Fathom charges a lot of money to stream these two events. I know they are of interest to some, but for many who have decent viewing equipment at home, I'd rather see that money spent on making sure that the Stream is watchable on Finals night... That is of course if the Big loud and live event aren't big money makers for DCI.

I'd be interest to see the 990 for 2018 and 2019 once they become available, to see if this much money spent to stream the events is stable or it is fluctuates based on investments in one year.. 

Alright Sparky, let's think about this logically.. I can tell you from being a position to have to book crews in my past life that a majority of that $500k budget is spent around the world championships week, its not distributed throughout the season equally. if you want to hire freelance Crews full time for eight weeks, that budget will probably quadruple. Add to the the cost to move the broadcast equipment around to satisfy your taste for a high level production. Network level production crews aren't cheap, and having them available for the same amount of shows they cover now would probably run you about $70k-$100k per day (with the production truck thrown in, just for ##### and giggles). Add to that travel costs, putting up your modest of freelance crew of about 20 professionals (who are ALL union workers). Other things to think about:

  1. You won't be able to hire a freelancer full time for an eight week run because you will be outbid by the networks, who often will hire their crews months in advance and can out pay you at the drop of a hat). You will need to hire a full time production company just to staff your events or hire a full time production coordinator at least two to three months in advance to make arrangements, hire crews, etc. 
  2. You'll have to carry insurance for all of your broadcast entities and make sure they are fully covered (that can get pricey, especially when you're dealing with a $5 million dollar production truck).
  3. Did i mention it would be pretty expensive?
  4. Thinking that professional broadcast production people are going to be much better than the folks who work at Flo is a myth. They might be marginally better in terms of working the equipment, but most of the pro production crews that work champs are in the sports broadcast industry. Tom Blair does a massive amount of work to get most of the people prepared to cover the event. And it's a testament to his team he's assembled because many of them we're working champ[ionship week broadcasts back when I was with the crew in the late 90's and early 2000's. 

So, we can take the professional production route, spend a ton of money we don't have and bankrupt the sport...

Or....

We an all stop whining and be grateful for the fact that for a nominal fee we get to watch live drum corps 12-15 times a year. Yeah, there are going to be a few hiccups, but it worked more than 95% of the time for me. While the transmission wasn't the best, I thought the production value was just right for what we paid for.  

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10 minutes ago, Newseditor44 said:

Alright Sparky, let's think about this logically.. I can tell you from being a position to have to book crews in my past life that a majority of that $500k budget is spent around the world championships week, its not distributed throughout the season equally. if you want to hire freelance Crews full time for eight weeks, that budget will probably quadruple. Add to the the cost to move the broadcast equipment around to satisfy your taste for a high level production. Network level production crews aren't cheap, and having them available for the same amount of shows they cover now would probably run you about $70k-$100k per day (with the production truck thrown in, just for ##### and giggles). Add to that travel costs, putting up your modest of freelance crew of about 20 professionals (who are ALL union workers). Other things to think about:

  1. You won't be able to hire a freelancer full time for an eight week run because you will be outbid by the networks, who often will hire their crews months in advance and can out pay you at the drop of a hat). You will need to hire a full time production company just to staff your events or hire a full time production coordinator at least two to three months in advance to make arrangements, hire crews, etc. 
  2. You'll have to carry insurance for all of your broadcast entities and make sure they are fully covered (that can get pricey, especially when you're dealing with a $5 million dollar production truck).
  3. Did i mention it would be pretty expensive?
  4. Thinking that professional broadcast production people are going to be much better than the folks who work at Flo is a myth. They might be marginally better in terms of working the equipment, but most of the pro production crews that work champs are in the sports broadcast industry. Tom Blair does a massive amount of work to get most of the people prepared to cover the event. And it's a testament to his team he's assembled because many of them we're working championship week broadcasts back when I was with the crew in the late 90's and early 2000's. 

So, we can take the professional production route, spend a ton of money we don't have and bankrupt the sport...

Or....

We an all stop whining and be grateful for the fact that for a nominal fee we get to watch live drum corps 12-15 times a year. Yeah, there are going to be a few hiccups, but it worked more than 95% of the time for me. While the transmission wasn't the best, I thought the production value was just right for what we paid for.  

Listen Chief You can take your experience in professional antiquated TV and take them somewhere else... 

I can almost guarantee you that FLO is not spending 70-100K per day to produce a DCI Stream.

If you don't want to compare Apples to Apples because you'd have to concede that there might possibly be a chance for DCI to take a different route, then that's on to you. 

But the issue still remains that FLO is poop and their service at the heights of Demand have suffered all the years that they've had the DCI contract. There are other avenues that could be worth exploring for DCI that don't involve FLO that could improve everyone's enjoyment of DCI.

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8 minutes ago, Glenn426 said:

Listen Chief You can take your experience in professional antiquated TV and take them somewhere else... 

I can almost guarantee you that FLO is not spending 70-100K per day to produce a DCI Stream.

If you don't want to compare Apples to Apples because you'd have to concede that there might possibly be a chance for DCI to take a different route, then that's on to you. 

But the issue still remains that FLO is poop and their service at the heights of Demand have suffered all the years that they've had the DCI contract. There are other avenues that could be worth exploring for DCI that don't involve FLO that could improve everyone's enjoyment of DCI.

Have you considered that your issues are the fact that you're deliberately mis-using the service?

FLO's inability to stream outside the US is an issue, yes. But it's likely that several of the issues you have with FLO have something to do with piping it through a VPN, too.

And if we went with the Twitch setup you want we'd still have the same production issues you're complaining about.

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1 hour ago, ftwdrummer said:

Have you considered that your issues are the fact that you're deliberately mis-using the service?

FLO's inability to stream outside the US is an issue, yes. But it's likely that several of the issues you have with FLO have something to do with piping it through a VPN, too.

And if we went with the Twitch setup you want we'd still have the same production issues you're complaining about.

My issues where shared among many all across the US. VPN or Not so if I was the only one who experienced the Poop show that was Finals night, then yes I'd concede to that thought but the majority of people across the internet had problems with the stream.

I watch Twitch daily for other content and other streams, Never once had anything close to the fundamental problems that FLO had on Finals night.

And yes production issues like the Camera angles, poor sound mixing, etc.., are issues that would need to be addressed by FLO or Twitch, but not as big an issue with me as the stream dropping non-stop during the last two corps of the night on what was their championship runs.

And worse, FLO blaming the users for their own shortcomings. 

Edited by Glenn426

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56 minutes ago, Glenn426 said:

Listen Chief You can take your experience in professional antiquated TV and take them somewhere else... 

I can almost guarantee you that FLO is not spending 70-100K per day to produce a DCI Stream.

If you don't want to compare Apples to Apples because you'd have to concede that there might possibly be a chance for DCI to take a different route, then that's on to you. 

But the issue still remains that FLO is poop and their service at the heights of Demand have suffered all the years that they've had the DCI contract. There are other avenues that could be worth exploring for DCI that don't involve FLO that could improve everyone's enjoyment of DCI.

File this under the category of people who like to complain just to hear themself complain. It's great that you're passionate about this issue, but personally I don't think you're going to see DCI make a move. If they do, good on them, just as long as they don't raise the price.

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1 hour ago, Glenn426 said:

Listen Chief You can take your experience in professional antiquated TV and take them somewhere else... 

 

LOL....How ignorant can person get.

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46 minutes ago, Spatzzz said:

LOL....How ignorant can person get.

Oh Hey its you I answered your remarks about music licensing a couple of pages back.

I would take your silence as agreement?

And NewsEditor44, given his name, I would assume was trying to apply professional level Broadcasting coverage to a DCI show. Unless I'm mistaken DCI only does that level of production quality for finals week and not to the level that it was been compared too, I don't think DCI has a 20 man Unionized crew for Finals week.

Hence my Apples to Apples comparison. 

Compare what FLO is doing to what DCI could do on their own. Cost for cost. Apples to Apples. Not Apples to Watermelons.. 

Edited by Glenn426

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5 hours ago, Glenn426 said:

Oh Hey its you I answered your remarks about music licensing a couple of pages back.

I would take your silence as agreement?

And NewsEditor44, given his name, I would assume was trying to apply professional level Broadcasting coverage to a DCI show. Unless I'm mistaken DCI only does that level of production quality for finals week and not to the level that it was been compared too, I don't think DCI has a 20 man Unionized crew for Finals week.

Hence my Apples to Apples comparison. 

Compare what FLO is doing to what DCI could do on their own. Cost for cost. Apples to Apples. Not Apples to Watermelons.. 

Do what you do well.  Hire other people to do what they do well.  

Sometimes Almost always "bringing things in-house" is a terrible mistake.  

I think DCI is quite correct to outsource their streaming.  Is Flo the best vendor for that effort?  I don't know -- maybe there's someone else better they overlooked. 

I will say:  Flo is doing an adequate job most of the time.  Yes they underprovisioned bandwidth for Finals.  But the rest of the product is "ok" and I think it's shown improvement each season. I expect them to properly over-provision for Finals bandwidth next season.  And heck -- if you time your subscription right, you can get the last full month for $30.  It's really a fantastic deal.  

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13 hours ago, Glenn426 said:

Its my understanding that FloSports hired these people from the Marching arts community in Texas to create content for FloMarching when they signed the deal with DCI, BOA and WGI. In a hypothetical scenario where FloMarching doesnt exist anymore, these people I would imagine not have jobs anymore, because they were hired specifically to cover and create content for FloMarching. 

So yeah before FloMarching came around they were just people with knowledge of the Marching arts community that could provide some insight into DCI and its community.

Tried looking for backgrounds or bio on the staff but could not find anything.. 

I would also assume that the cameramen don't have a background in the Marching arts and are just Flosports employees that go around the country and video all of the different Flo sports events.. Judging by their excellent camera work throughout the years.

Thanks. Still, I think your last paragraph validates what I posted. The camera operators, at the least, are actual professionals, n'est pas?

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