JimF-LowBari Posted September 16, 2019 Share Posted September 16, 2019 3 minutes ago, garfield said: And you mean the engineer actually DRIVING the train around the tree, not the one setting it up, right? Woo-woo! Chugga-chugga Chugga-chugga Lol hey my old man was in Army Corps of Engineers.... he was one of the “engineers” driving a bulldozer among other things.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garfield Posted September 16, 2019 Share Posted September 16, 2019 (edited) 3 hours ago, FTNK said: "Okay in hindsight yea Hop was bad but people complaining about serious problems now are just out for money" - DCP homer brigade "The Benefit Of The Doubt". Step one: Presume Positive Intent. Step two: The truth is told in the presence of three people. So far we've heard from one. Apply patience. Step three: Two ears and one mouth, for a reason. (EDIT: <--- The hardest for me and many.) My belief is that Cadets - and Drum Corps, et al - have earned and deserve the benefit of the doubt. Call me an old fashioned Dino. It's OK, I can't hear you anyway. Hop burned up all of his BOTD chits long before 2018 and had none left when he needed them most. The clock resets. Edited September 16, 2019 by garfield 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xandandl Posted September 16, 2019 Share Posted September 16, 2019 8 minutes ago, garfield said: And you mean the engineer actually DRIVING the train around the tree, not the one setting it up, right? Woo-woo! Chugga-chugga Chugga-chugga Current DCI Rule of Thumb...would the Cavaliers 2019 consider him an engineer? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garfield Posted September 16, 2019 Share Posted September 16, 2019 4 minutes ago, JimF-LowBari said: Lol hey my old man was in Army Corps of Engineers.... he was one of the “engineers” driving a bulldozer among other things.... "I need to move 6 battalions from over there to over there." "Hold my beer.." 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
N.E. Brigand Posted September 16, 2019 Share Posted September 16, 2019 2 hours ago, skevinp said: As a homer to absolutely no one, I see the Hop thing as being about Hop, who is gone, and the other stuff seems like the sort of thing that could happen to any corps. It's possible that the scrambling they had to do to put things together with new people in a stressful time may have left them a little vulnerable to not catching or preventing every possible problem, but that's about the extent of it. If I had a child who wanted to march, I would see them as no less likely to be safe with the Cadets than any other world class corps. I would probably be more worried about the practical and emotional impact of all this demonization of their organization and the zeal with which some people seem to have for harming it. Yes, that's my take on this too. Accidents like this happen even at good companies -- although the lack of administrative follow-up that is alleged, if true, shows some carelessness and callousness that YEA should be careful not to repeat. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimF-LowBari Posted September 16, 2019 Share Posted September 16, 2019 8 minutes ago, garfield said: "I need to move 6 battalions from over there to over there." "Hold my beer.." Lol if you’ve seen the movie MASH with Sutherland and Gould at the beginning Hawkeye steals a Jeep. He gets to 4077 and Major Blake asks if the Jeep is stolen. When told yes his response is “well change the serial number”. Whole theatre laughs except for dad. Then he tells me “I remember doing that ####”. Nothing like watching a Korean War movie/show with a KW vet. 😳 1 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
karuna Posted September 17, 2019 Share Posted September 17, 2019 8 hours ago, GUARDLING said: I ve seen some pretty nasty injuries teaching over the years and I will have to disagree. They can be very serious as well as damaging for a long time if not life. Can there be just as many on props? sure but to say one is more or less than the other simply isn't true. Even simple marching, How many older people now are suffering from painful knees after years of marching/ MANY, it's the topic of conversation with many who have marched before. Bottom line "IF" a corps chooses to use a giant prop, THEY have to make sure it is safe just as they need to make sure a MM is safe in all aspects from travel, to food to many many things. I am all for MAKING SURE corps do this BUT to lead the charge on this simply because it's an avenue for those who don';t like props ( and I believe there are some who will) is something quite different...YES, SAFETY MUST BE THE FOREFRONT .We do all have to agree with this. I used a prop ( Huge ) that many members were on dancing as far back as the 90s and we made sure each time it was put together properly. It was quite solid, risk? I guess, probably, but even then we had no injuries ( luckily ) BUT had many from drill, a broken nose from a rifle, even a kid who got sliced open with a cymbal. Risk is there in all aspects in what we do, that's for sure. Injury is injury and we don't know what long term is for everyone. Now if we want to create a scenario to fit a narrative we can do that in ALL aspects of just about anything. Could all things happen? of course, the key is safety, education for all and vigilance in all aspects when MMs are in our care. I have heard the argument on props over the years BUT have also heard the argument on how drill was getting ridiculous also. Usually it was easy to see who liked what and who didn't yet defended the other. Would it be awful if a kid ( as has happened fell off ) of course . but just as awful when you have to send a kid home who broke a leg or arm or whatever because of equipment, drill, or a simple mistake that caused injury. No one wants a member injured for any reason or for any effect. NOONE! I do think we are all saying the same thing but for me I'm not justifying or measuring one injury over another. It all counts, especially to the injured. SAFETY 1ST, EDUCATION, TRAINING, VIGILANCE I think if you look back at what I said, I talked about RISK not incidence. I agree I've seen far more injuries in ordinary drill than from props; on the other hand, the RISK for serious injury from having multiple performers climb up props is far greater. Drill is completely under the performers control; they can MAKE it safe. Prop safety is largely OUT of the performers control. I'm sure I'm biased as well. I think ||: running to a prop , playing some notes, pushing it to a new spot :|| --repeated ad naseum -- is a pathetic degradation of the art, propagated by designers who have run out of the creativity required to bring FRESH ideas to the field. But that's my bias Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GUARDLING Posted September 17, 2019 Share Posted September 17, 2019 (edited) 29 minutes ago, karuna said: I think if you look back at what I said, I talked about RISK not incidence. I agree I've seen far more injuries in ordinary drill than from props; on the other hand, the RISK for serious injury from having multiple performers climb up props is far greater. Drill is completely under the performers control; they can MAKE it safe. Prop safety is largely OUT of the performers control. I'm sure I'm biased as well. I think ||: running to a prop , playing some notes, pushing it to a new spot :|| --repeated ad naseum -- is a pathetic degradation of the art, propagated by designers who have run out of the creativity required to bring FRESH ideas to the field. But that's my bias I see what you are saying . AS far as drill , drill also depends on not just 1 performer but all around them.....BUT I think it can take way more creativity to incorporate a prop to make sense in the theme and have effect. The art has changed..for the better? maybe, for some maybe not BUT it has changed to some degree. I believe more changes are on the horizon. If it keeps the activity alive and interests the MMs then I'm all for it. As far as risk, everything we do out there can be a risk. AS I said injury is injury and sometimes affects the member for a long time For me it also takes a lot of creativity to reshape a football field. Of course everyone is entitled to their opinion and their own personal likes and dislikes....jmo Edited September 17, 2019 by GUARDLING 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghost Posted September 17, 2019 Share Posted September 17, 2019 38 minutes ago, karuna said: Drill is completely under the performers control; they can MAKE it safe. Prop safety is largely OUT of the performers control. As Guardling said, each mm is open to injury from other mm around them, especially during ST and early in the season. When climbing a prop or moving around inside a prop, to me, a mm is on their own with very little interference from other mm. Their not rock climbing. Their is usually many places to grab on to or step on to. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Ream Posted September 17, 2019 Share Posted September 17, 2019 5 hours ago, garfield said: And you mean the engineer actually DRIVING the train around the tree, not the one setting it up, right? Woo-woo! Chugga-chugga Chugga-chugga just say if i had my way, it'd be Gomez Addam's dream train scenario 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.