Ray Kimber

Time to Say Goodbye, after 15 years

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16 minutes ago, MikeD said:

When contras were added circa 1960, there was at least one letter to the editor of DCN  bemoaning their addition as it was changing drum corps to band.

 

Well, if this is true I would say that is silly.  But, if you are saying that adding a contra is the same as adding woodwinds, strings, etc then I also say that is also silly.  Drum & bugle corps used to be easy to define as percussion and bell-front valved brass.  That look and sound.  It was cool and unique.  An exotic niche that had such a unique sonic footprint and clean, muscular look.  I am all for innovation and moving forward.  But why change the things that made it unique to make it something that looks like everything else?  Why did they add trombones and change it to look like Big 10 marching band when the baritone is essentially the same voice minus the ability to gliss?  Are there seriously people out there that are saying "this show is sooo much better thanks to that 30 second trombone soli?"  But we forever changed the look and definining element of drum corps for what- a very minor change in timbre?  Why?  All these new elements added to enhance creativity are just that- minor enhancements that forever change the look and sound of the all brass and percussion ensemble that was once drum & bugle corps.  

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31 minutes ago, Guitar1974 said:

Well, if this is true I would say that is silly.  But, if you are saying that adding a contra is the same as adding woodwinds, strings, etc then I also say that is also silly.  Drum & bugle corps used to be easy to define as percussion and bell-front valved brass.  That look and sound.  It was cool and unique.  An exotic niche that had such a unique sonic footprint and clean, muscular look.  I am all for innovation and moving forward.  But why change the things that made it unique to make it something that looks like everything else?  Why did they add trombones and change it to look like Big 10 marching band when the baritone is essentially the same voice minus the ability to gliss?  Are there seriously people out there that are saying "this show is sooo much better thanks to that 30 second trombone soli?"  But we forever changed the look and definining element of drum corps for what- a very minor change in timbre?  Why?  All these new elements added to enhance creativity are just that- minor enhancements that forever change the look and sound of the all brass and percussion ensemble that was once drum & bugle corps.  

You're making a good point and strong argument but since I am fine with all of the changes made to-date, I am not buying it. Plus, you have to admit that these changes are being made relatively slowly so we do have time to adjust to them over the years.The final product has been a real treat to watch and listen to.

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1 hour ago, MikeD said:

When contras were added circa 1960, there was at least one letter to the editor of DCN  bemoaning their addition as it was changing drum corps to band.

 

There was probably a letter too when uniform inspections were eliminated, but contras to bugles is not the same as woodwinds to bugles.  One is not like the other.  Not even close.

No need for reeds!

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45 minutes ago, denmum said:

You're making a good point and strong argument but since I am fine with all of the changes made to-date, I am not buying it. Plus, you have to admit that these changes are being made relatively slowly so we do have time to adjust to them over the years.The final product has been a real treat to watch and listen to.

I respect your opinion and I still do love the activity, but my point is that the entire activity was forever changed when it no longer became an exclusive brass and percussion activity.  I understand there are, presumably, many fans who love the changes and look forward to anything-goes DCI marching band.  However, there are many who lament the loss of the purity of brass and percussion only.  For me it has nothing to with wanting it to stay the same.  I just don't agree that allowing any instrumentation was needed for it to evolve.  I loved a lot of the shows this year- and every year- but feel they would be no less awesome without all the superfluous elements.  

I am a saxophone player.  I hit the woodshed, learned low brass, and joined a drum corps because of the all brass and percussion instrumentation.  I LOVED the unique instrumentation and to me the instrumentation and sonic quality is what made it cool.  The all-brass acoustic large horn line blasting on bell-front brass was unique and awesome, the only thing quite like it in the world of music!  Now it is gone forever.  There are already a million marching bands, why did we have to dismantle drum & bugle corps and make it like everything else?

Getting back to Kimber's post, the loss of the pure acoustic brass sound was what drove him away.  I still love the activity, but definitely morn the loss of the unique all-brass acoustic ensemble.

 

 

 

Edited by Guitar1974
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10 minutes ago, Guitar1974 said:

I respect your opinion and I still do love the activity, but my point is that the entire activity was forever changed when it no longer became an exclusive brass and percussion activity.  I understand there are, presumably, many fans who love the changes and look forward to anything-goes DCI marching band.  However, there are many who lament the loss of the purity of brass and percussion only.  For me it has nothing to with wanting it to stay the same.  I just don't agree that allowing any instrumentation was needed for it to evolve.  I loved a lot of the shows this year- and every year- but feel they would be no less awesome without all the superfluous elements.  

I am a saxophone player.  I hit the woodshed, learned low brass, and joined a drum corps because of the all brass and percussion instrumentation.  I LOVED the unique instrumentation and to me the instrumentation and sonic quality is what made it cool.  The all-brass acoustic large horn line blasting on bell-front brass was unique and awesome, the only thing quite like it in the world of music!  Now it is gone forever.  There are already a million marching bands, why did we have to dismantle drum & bugle corps and make it like everything else?

Getting back to Kimber's post, the loss of the pure acoustic brass sound was what drove him away.  I still love the activity, but definitely morn the loss of the unique all-brass acoustic ensemble.

 

 

 

Your last point-we definitely agree. But I get my "fix" by getting in the middle of a top brass line or 2 before the show. They blow me away.

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6 minutes ago, denmum said:

Your last point-we definitely agree. But I get my "fix" by getting in the middle of a top brass line or 2 before the show. They blow me away.

Definitely!  And I understand where you are coming from, I loved many of the shows this past season.  My corps is probably the one pushing the envelope the most on a lot of the new tech- but I still miss my pure all-brass sound haha..  Good discussion. 

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2 hours ago, MikeD said:

When contras were added circa 1960, there was at least one letter to the editor of DCN  bemoaning their addition as it was changing drum corps to band.

 

So?  At least one letter?  In 1960?  That’s what you have?  That person was 60 years ahead of their time apparently. 

Edited by HockeyDad

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4 hours ago, garfield said:

54 new bodies on a bus is something like $200,000 in additional revenue.  Subtract expenses and one gets net.

The activity has been supplementing student tours since day one with every donated dollar, hour, or instrument.  The last I looked, show budgets for 150 kids are averaging close to $1million.  150 members x $4,000 tour fees is around $600,000 (plus some for camps and stuff).

I don't think anyone seriously considering the idea is thinking that new MM positions will pay for themselves.  But then, they haven't thought that for a long, long time (in WC anyway).

so food, insurance, equipment, , transportation, staff, fuel, housing, uniform/costume/whatever they call it....doesn't guarantee net now does it? after all, we don't see many corps swimming in cash now

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3 hours ago, Terri Schehr said:

EBBUB. Which spawned EBBUBERY. 

now let's not get EVERYONE  digging all this back up

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14 hours ago, Lance said:

adults probably figured out i was talking about the violin, and that it's not at all crazy for people to reason that ww could very easily be used as feature instruments in the future.  

for the record, i'm 100% against ww being in dci.  i hate the idea. but like i said before, now that corps are amplifying entire sections for sustained periods throughout shows along with all of the featured soloists and sections hanging off of megaprops while mic'd leads me to believe that they're probably not that far away, either as featured instruments or as entire sections.  

But that works against your case.  Woodwinds cannot be played with one hand while climbing/hanging onto a prop with the other hand.

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