DCI Exposed Again?

[JimF-LowBari]

“DCI does not include Open Class Corps.” Is this DCI stated policy or your bias showing?

If the former can DCI be sued under truth in advertising act as they promote themselves as the Jr corps activity and nothing publicly said about Class differences.

Would be like BSA saying they they promote Boy Scouts except for poorer troops that can’t participate with the national Jamborees.(but we won’t say that out loud)

Edit: DCI Mission Statement as per wiki has “participating corps”.....

Edited December 29, 2019 by JimF-LowBari

[Slingerland]

2 hours ago, garfield said:

I'm sorry but, besides another effort failing, there's really not much to see here.

 

/thread.

 

I'm sorry that there was a miscommunication, but by definition, that does require two parties. DCI has had (bad) experiences in the past with having to deal with smaller OC corps who bit off more than they could chew, and their policies these last several years are designed to protect them as well as protect any members of those corps from winding up in those situations. I'll be honest and say I've never heard of this NJ corps; great for them in getting a corps going, but it's worth being realistic that unless you have a track record (or at least, a huge amount of cash on hand) and a proven infrastructure to support longer tours, DCI is necessarily going to be discouraging of getting too many tour dates on your calendar.
 

If you have enough kids who want to perform, do a SoundSport this year and aim to win. Use that to build a group of 55 to 70 kids for 2021 and do a summer or two of local shows and parades (which is where the money is in drum corps). It will take a few years to build up the financial and practical infrastructure to support 100+ kids on the road for 2 or 3 weeks, and a few more to get to the point where you're realistically competing at the top of the OC circuit. Build the foundation well, and the organization can thrive for generations.

[cixelsyd]

On 12/28/2019 at 5:33 AM, garfield said:

Step one: recognize that DCI's "constituents" are it's "Member Corps".

Step two: restate all of your contentions under that reality.

There's so much wrong in your presumptions and resulting conclusions that meaningful discussion about Encorps' explanations and what's revealed, if anything, is not possible unless we can agree to recognize this basic truth: DCI actually owes Open Class nothing at all. 

 

Not defending the OP in its entirety... however, your last phrase is not "truth".  DCI most definitely owes "open class".

a.  If not for the wider population of corps that openly compete with each other nationwide, there would never have been a DCI.  And without a wider population of corps going forward to replace those lost to attrition, DCI will not persist long term.

b.  DCI and their member corps have conducted the premeditated shutdowns of several local/regional drum corps circuits.  They made promises to the corps from those circuits.  They specifically owe those corps whatever they promised them.

c.  DCI has always operated as a subset of elite members milking revenue from the larger population of non-members in a variety of ways.  This particular episode (the new member minimums) has the appearance of yet another way to squeeze more $$$ from the non-members by converting some open-class corps into SoundSport groups.  Open-class corps actually get paid on occasion, but SoundSport groups pay DCI just to get performance opportunities.  If the only "new revenue" ideas the DCI strategic plan can come up with are to feed on their own, then DCI will owe even more to the non-member corps who would increasingly sustain the DCI model.

[Ghost]

4 hours ago, Slingerland said:

(which is where the money is in drum corps)

You’re kidding us!  So they do a short tour, like around two weeks, around the 4th of July, and maybe do three parades. They’re not big enough to split the corps in half and do another parade or two.  Would they get the same money as a full size WC/OC corps who doesn’t split the corps?

[MikeD]

4 hours ago, Slingerland said:

/thread.

 

I'm sorry that there was a miscommunication, but by definition, that does require two parties. DCI has had (bad) experiences in the past with having to deal with smaller OC corps who bit off more than they could chew, and their policies these last several years are designed to protect them as well as protect any members of those corps from winding up in those situations. I'll be honest and say I've never heard of this NJ corps; great for them in getting a corps going, but it's worth being realistic that unless you have a track record (or at least, a huge amount of cash on hand) and a proven infrastructure to support longer tours, DCI is necessarily going to be discouraging of getting too many tour dates on your calendar.
 

If you have enough kids who want to perform, do a SoundSport this year and aim to win. Use that to build a group of 55 to 70 kids for 2021 and do a summer or two of local shows and parades (which is where the money is in drum corps). It will take a few years to build up the financial and practical infrastructure to support 100+ kids on the road for 2 or 3 weeks, and a few more to get to the point where you're realistically competing at the top of the OC circuit. Build the foundation well, and the organization can thrive for generations.

Encorps started as a Soundsport organization in 2018 and moved up to Open class in 2019, being approved for a Regional Open Class tour. They also performed at some local DCA shows in exhibition.

hey were actually much larger in 2018 (around 80 members according to DCI!) than 2019. One of my former students was in the corps in 2018 and loved it. They rehearsed in the next town over from me (before I moved) in South Brunswick, NJ.. They had a great group of adults running the corps in both years. Judy joined them after the 2019 season. Their staff is excellent. I know many of them from my band days.

[cybersnyder]

35 minutes ago, MikeD said:

Encorps started as a Soundsport organization in 2018 and moved up to Open class in 2019, being approved for a Regional Open Class tour. They also performed at some local DCA shows in exhibition.

hey were actually much larger in 2018 (around 80 members according to DCI!) than 2019. One of my former students was in the corps in 2018 and loved it. They rehearsed in the next town over from me (before I moved) in South Brunswick, NJ.. They had a great group of adults running the corps in both years. Judy joined them after the 2019 season. Their staff is excellent. I know many of them from my band days.

Didn't realize they were SoundSport in 2018.

[IllianaLancerContra]

17 hours ago, Terri Schehr said:

The Canadian corps didn’t have 55 either. 

I don't think we ever marched 55 members, but we threw it down every night.

We used to say we performed with enough confidence that we didn't need 100 people backing us up.

[Slingerland]

2 hours ago, Ghost said:

You’re kidding us!  So they do a short tour, like around two weeks, around the 4th of July, and maybe do three parades. They’re not big enough to split the corps in half and do another parade or two.  Would they get the same money as a full size WC/OC corps who doesn’t split the corps?

A parade can pay $1500-3500, depending on the parade. A DCI Open Class corps makes $0 to a few hundred bux for a show (a WC corps makes around $2800 for a show - also less money than they might get from doing a parade).

That's not kidding - it's math.

Edited December 29, 2019 by Slingerland

[cybersnyder]

8 minutes ago, Slingerland said:

A parade can pay $1500-3500, depending on the parade. A DCI Open Class corps makes $0 to a few hundred bux for a show (a WC corps makes around $2800 for a show - also less money than they might get from doing a parade).

That's not kidding - it's math.

Tour math holds up for OC, but assumes best case for WC corps and ignore double sales. Those would be zero on parade day. Housing would likely be easier to obtain in conjunction with an event rather than a parade. 

[Slingerland]

6 minutes ago, cybersnyder said:

Tour math holds up for OC, but assumes best case for WC corps and ignore double sales. Those would be zero on parade day. Housing would likely be easier to obtain in conjunction with an event rather than a parade. 

Almost every corps lives within 100 miles of 30 parades every year, and they always need 'bands' - no need for housing if it's a two hour bus ride.

There is no money to be made from doing drum corps performances; even the WC corps actually lose money each show, since their transportation and food costs for the day usually dwarf the performance fee.

Edited December 29, 2019 by Slingerland