2020 Rules Proposals

[MikeN]

1 hour ago, Glenn426 said:

 

They are happy then to remain in OC? Outside of BDB and SCVC, you would think the goal is to get into WC. Having a Full Corps should be the goal every year. Having more bodies at their audition camp would help them achieve their goals. Not that this rule would guarantee any of that but you would think that more local Kids would go to march the OC corps if this rule opened up the recruitment to everyone. (By Local, I mean within an hour Driving distance to the location of the Winter Camps) These OC Corps could become an All-star Marching Band for the area they are from. The onus would be on the corps to market and make the camps in a high BOA Density area, (Cobb County, Indianapolis, Dallas)

 

On the subject of OC, I am surprised that someone within the OC Ranks didn't stand up and propose to allow for OC to be AI as revenue increasing tool.

The majority of the fans of DCI are not and do not follow OC until the final week (if that) The emotional connection is simply not there. Why not allow OC to become its own thing? Where there are less rules and there is an opportunity for the Art form to work out its kinks and provide a test bed for WC.

As the Sound guy from BAC Said "DCI is not an all Weather Sport anymore" If it's raining most corps are not having Ensemble as the Speakers and Front ensemble cannot be in the Rain, Same would apply to the WW instruments. You'd be hard pressed to find a corps that will willingly rehearse in the Rain, so the WW would have as much concerns about getting wet as the Front Ensemble would. Same applies to High Wind, Or Lightning.

Actually, many OC corps *are* happy to remain outside of World Class, to *not* have to raise million dollar budgets and arrange for 50-day tours.  And I don't know how much experience you have with OC, we really *do* love drum corps down there, and we like being DCI groups and doing generally DCI-type things without having to become a World Class designer's avant-garde testbed.  

I love the fact in your posts that you challenge everyone's assumptions; I really do.  Sometimes it's good to take a step back and say "why do we do what we do?"  I literally have a job doing that, BTW.  But sometimes, we do things because they *are* the best practice for the situation.

Mike

[MikeN]

21 minutes ago, Glenn426 said:

The Soundsport that keeps being touted as an alternative is poop. To my knowledge Soundsport is not even televised, Can't tell you the name of a single Soundsport Group or who the champs (if there is a champion).

The cutting edge for Designers and the Test Bed for innovation now will be in WGI Winds. With Michael Gaines Involvement in Aimachi Winds and the other Aimachi groups... It wouldn't surprise me if WGI Winds has a Bluecoats Winds Group come out in the coming years as an outlet for the designers and participants as an alternative to DCI. 

Not sure what agreement WGI and DCI have in place but if I were WGI, I'd be pushing out emails to all DCI corps that were in favor of AI to make a WGI Winds group.

 

As to me the future of Marching Music is Indoors.

Actually, I agree with you a bit on the future being indoors, but I think we're talking decades, not years, and it will be a summer circuit - not WGI - so independent groups don't have to compete with scholastic units.

That said, Soundsport isn't quite what you think it is.  Have you actually watched any of them?  It's way more decentralized by design, and the groups that compete at DCI events *do* get televised, same as the DCI groups attending.  I can tell you the name of every one in Texas, if you cared to hear it, but that's not really the point.  Again, decentralization.  You don't have to go to Indy to still have a good experience, and you don't have to do it the "DCI Way" to provide a good season for members.  And the division has done a great job of expanding awareness internationally as well as domestically weeding out orgs that aren't yet ready (or just don't care) to apply for Open Class. 

Mike

[Slingerland]

16 minutes ago, MikeD said:

That goes in any situation, be it drum corps of 1971 or 2020.

Examples of other marching all brass and percussion ensembles in 1971 that drum corps was copying...and go.

Sorry Mike, but if you pick up an instrument already used in the same medium (marching ensembles) and use it the same way hundreds of bands already use it, it's not very 'creative."

 

Edited January 13, 2020 by Slingerland

[cixelsyd]

33 minutes ago, Glenn426 said:

To think that A Corps Director would vote against their Designer and cede to public pressure and vote against the BOD and the RSTF is crazy to me. They don't have to see the faces and work with and collaborate with the faceless angry mob on Reddit or FB, 

They have to work with their customer bases.  Both of them, marchers and fans.  And you know the saying - the customer is always right.

(How can Facebook be faceless, by the way?)

Quote

They do however have to work with their prized Designer who might take this disagreement into future considerations when their contract is up.

Maybe the designer will move on to a SoundSport team, and show us what you are talking about.

[Slingerland]

1 hour ago, Glenn426 said:

But the idea that the Corps Instructor and Director would not be in line with each other is crazy to me. I understand that there are different aspects that they would have to evaluate but wouldn't the Director share their feelings or leaning with the instructor before the Vote.

I assume the Instructor vote was a secret Ballot, Where the Results where revealed but what each person voted was secret.

You would however think that the Instructors got a chance to tell their corps director how they voted?

If they did speak to each other, at least 4 times this happened on Saturday night;

 

Leon May: Yeah Chris I like what was proposed and I voted in favor of AI.

Chris Holland: Cool, cool, yeah that's what we discussed.

CH: [votes against AI]

LM: So Chris How did you vote?

CH: I voted against AI.

LM:........................................................ 

Why would a visual designer care one way or another?  Ok, let's stipulate to your example: in that case, Leon would be free to find another corps next time his LOA or contract is up (even though the other corps would ALSO be sans saxophones) and Boston would find someone to replace him. Everyone would be happy!

...except for those who were really looking forward to someone doing "A Kenny G Portrait" in 2021. They're probably not happy.😎

 

[JimF-LowBari]

2 minutes ago, Slingerland said:

Why would a visual designer care one way or another?  Ok, let's stipulate to your example: in that case, Leon would be free to find another corps next time his LOA or contract is up (even though the other corps would ALSO be sans saxophones) and Boston would find someone to replace him. Everyone would be happy!

...except for those who were really looking forward to someone doing "A Kenny G Portrait" in 2021. They're probably not happy.😎

 

I’d respect someone more for saying “I disagree with you because....” and then respectfully explain why. Work IT designing or trying to fix something you hear a lot of disagreements. Expecting a vote to match the boss or paycheck sounds like yes men-itis to me

Edited January 13, 2020 by JimF-LowBari

[2muchcoffeeman]

27 minutes ago, MikeD said:

As are no limits. Both can inspire creativity, and both can hinder it. There is no one way to be creative.

"All my life I have loved edges; and the boundary-line that brings one thing sharply against another. All my life I have loved frames and limits; and I will maintain that the largest wilderness looks larger seen through a window."

"I have also a pretty taste in abysses and bottomless chasms and everything else that emphasizes a fine shade of distinction between one thing and another; and the warm affection I have always felt for bridges is connected with the fact that the dark and dizzy arch accentuates the chasm even more than the chasm itself."

GK Chesterton

 

You read too much into my point. I did not declare any approach off-limits. I am suggesting, however, that the blue-sky, no-limits approach to drum corps (and thus, its finances and frantic search for financial relief) has been too grounded in one and not curious enough about the other. Building Broadway sets and adding new ingredients, while technically and even truly creative, is in a Chestertonian sense the easy way out. Let's see our arrangers and designers build some bridges over some chasms and show us some vast wildernesses through some frames.

[MikeD]

27 minutes ago, Slingerland said:

Examples of other marching all brass and percussion ensembles in 1971 that drum corps was copying...and go.

Sorry Mike, but if you pick up an instrument already used in the same medium (marching ensembles) and use it the same way hundreds of bands already use it, it's not very 'creative."

 

The tools do not make the creativity; what is done with them shows creativity, or not. 

The comment really had nothing to do with WW. It was a response to the post that said limits foster creativity. My opinion is that both limits and no limits can result in creativity. It is how the tools are used that matters. 

[MikeD]

8 minutes ago, 2muchcoffeeman said:

You read too much into my point. I did not declare any approach off-limits. I am suggesting, however, that the blue-sky, no-limits approach to drum corps (and thus, its finances and frantic search for financial relief) has been too grounded in one and not curious enough about the other. Building Broadway sets and adding new ingredients, while technically and even truly creative, is in a Chestertonian sense the easy way out. Let's see our arrangers and designers build some bridges over some chasms and show us some vast wildernesses through some frames.

Building "Broadway sets" (as one example) can be just as creative as anything. His idea of limits is indeed one way, but having no limits is just as valid. Creativity is based on how the tools are used, IMO. 

[Slingerland]

8 minutes ago, MikeD said:

The tools do not make the creativity; what is done with them shows creativity, or not. 

The comment really had nothing to do with WW. It was a response to the post that said limits foster creativity. My opinion is that both limits and no limits can result in creativity. It is how the tools are used that matters. 

I would disagree. "Creativity", by definition, means to 'create' - to come up with something new. Inherent in the act of invention is the idea that it hasn't been done before, or at least, your approach is markedly different or fresh from what's come before. It's unlikely to think that drum corps designers willl come up with some use of woodwinds (or any other instrument) that hasn't been already done in the marching band world.  

What IS unique in drum corps is the intensity of brass/percussion mix where the players are moving at the same time. Those limits and requirements necessarily force the designers who want to do something new to be creative in order to succeed.

I'd argue there's no such thing as 'no limits' - every artistic act or mechanical invention is dealing with limits, whether they are natural or man made. Gravity is a limit. "11 minutes max" is a limit. What you seem to find troubling are man-made limits, but when they're made in the interest of competition, they're no more than the rules of the game. Designers who want to design with no rules can do so freely in the fields of professional music, theatre, and dance, but then again, the activity isn't supposed to be about the designers.