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1 minute ago, xandandl said:

Be more specific and clear on your conclusion.

Do you hope it does not pass (as in you disagree with the the proposal) or are you passing it along so that it will?  DCI caucuses are noted for how some wordsmiths there twist perceptions and conclusions to get their own end result. My experience in these meetings is not pleasant memories especially when lobbying groups (mfrs.) put monies and endorsements into play.

so I will rephrase F*** NO lol.

They already solved the safety problem by restricting field judges to the sideline, but reducing the number of judges, there is a danger that those judges that have a perception of bias will have more control over the outcome. 

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I'm with a few others in that I don't think the "any instrument" proposal is particularly hair-raising; the important ones to me are actually the sound reinforcement & brass amplification limiting proposals. Having spent millions of hours on these forums, I feel like THAT'S where the current distraught mostly lies within the fan community; yes, we all have nebulous discussions about whether drum corps will fundamentally change with a woodwind instrument on the field, but the real ink has been spilled (proverbially) in the last few seasons over the purity & authenticity of the sound being produced on the field, as well as where it's physically coming from and often how harsh and unbearable it has become in the first few rows. I've seen this discussed a million times more than most other subjects, and I think these are the rule changes at stake that could go the furthest in preserving the authenticity of the activity. Even more, I feel like now would be the perfect time to put limits on sound reinforcement --- the cat is far from out of the bag, corps are still experimenting, and now is the time to enact limits after a few seasons of free-range testing. Those are the two proposals I'll be watching with the most curiosity.

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25 minutes ago, xandandl said:

This proposal would adjust the current scoring system to include six judges who would all adjudicate off the field from within the stands. The proposal calls for these judges with the following percentages factored into a corps’ total score. One overall general effect judge with a music background (20%), one overall general effect judge with a visual background (20%), one visual ensemble judge with a visual design background (15%), one visual ensemble judge with a color guard background (15%), one music ensemble judge with a percussion background (15%), one music ensemble judge with a brass background (15%).

 

23 minutes ago, ContraFart said:

Ok I understand now. 6 judges all from the booth.......I am going to pass on that.

"...from within the stands."

It may be my great anticipation that the judging system will be changed to eliminate "playing to the box" to appeal to a greater number in the stands, but, could this be a prelude?

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Just now, garfield said:

 

"...from within the stands."

It may be my great anticipation that the judging system will be changed to eliminate "playing to the box" to appeal to a greater number in the stands, but, could this be a prelude?

what greater number in the stands? You are talking judges, not audience I presume.  Unless you are anticipating piccolo parents filling every seat.

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7 minutes ago, Jake W. said:

I'm with a few others in that I don't think the "any instrument" proposal is particularly hair-raising; the important ones to me are actually the sound reinforcement & brass amplification limiting proposals. Having spent millions of hours on these forums, I feel like THAT'S where the current distraught mostly lies within the fan community; yes, we all have nebulous discussions about whether drum corps will fundamentally change with a woodwind instrument on the field, but the real ink has been spilled (proverbially) in the last few seasons over the purity & authenticity of the sound being produced on the field, as well as where it's physically coming from and often how harsh and unbearable it has become in the first few rows. I've seen this discussed a million times more than most other subjects, and I think these are the rule changes at stake that could go the furthest in preserving the authenticity of the activity. Even more, I feel like now would be the perfect time to put limits on sound reinforcement --- the cat is far from out of the bag, corps are still experimenting, and now is the time to enact limits after a few seasons of free-range testing. Those are the two proposals I'll be watching with the most curiosity.

Well said.

Now imagine if the flute section will have to be mic'd to be heard over the 80 member brass line...

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1 hour ago, 2muchcoffeeman said:

That works only if you intend to increase the size of the unit beyond the current 154-member limit. Otherwise, any flute you add is a bass drummer you need to cut. Net result: Same number of people experiencing the life-enriching benefits.

I don't detect anything in the proposal that would increase the number of performers allowed on the field -- as if the already brutal economics of drum corps could even survive it.

Without a proposal to increase the size of competing units, the stated rationale is an empty platitude.

Actually, it's just the opposite.

It's not likely that clarinets will replace any one section, it is true that "making room" for WW will likely cut an, otherwise, fully qualified participant.  If you put some of them with a group of WW newly-entering the activity (and the battery and pit, but maybe fewer of them), and presuming you can get 55 of them in one place, you have the makings of a new drum corps just waiting for an ambitious team to take up the challenge, or for an existing corps to justify starting feeder programs in the lower classes.

I believe Any Instrument with NO increase in MM maximums is the only way new participants and new revenue are possible from changing the allowable instrumentation. 

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8 minutes ago, xandandl said:

what greater number in the stands? You are talking judges, not audience I presume.  Unless you are anticipating piccolo parents filling every seat.

No, I mean ending the silly procedure of selling tickets from endzone to endzone and designing shows that appeal mostly to the center "V" from field-50.

My hope is that they've finally figured out that accomplishing that means ending adjudication from the box and putting the judges actually "in the stands" from endzone to endzone.

If corps don't know where the judges will be, they'll design shows that appeal to all ends and sides of the stadium.

 

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Time to give my obligatory thoughts on all these proposals.

#1 (Brass Amplification Limitations): Yes! Hopefully the voting membership will finally see the light on this issue that has been apparent for a few seasons now.

#2 (Evaluation Structure Innovation): Interesting idea, although I would prefer if there were still adjudicators for the Monday-Tuesday shows, but only a small (5-member) panel of judges with no scores. Also, the DCI Tour Premiere should still be scored as a regular weekend competition, IMO, even though it's on a Thursday.

#3 (Guard Sheet Reinforcement): Not my area of expertise, although I will add that Michael Cesario said back in 2016 that colorguards should not be judged by their "effect," for whatever that's worth. But I see where they're coming from; it's a different age, even from just 4 years ago.

#4 (Any Instrument Policy): NOPE. They will lose me as a fan if this happens. The only way I can see this working for me at all is if they limit the number of non-brass/percussion players at any one time. It will be even more egregious if they decide to go ahead with this full-stop for 2020, unless they can get a corps or two to "trial" this proposal.

#5 (Live Sampling): As long as it's used primarily by soloists/small ensembles only and not by the whole ensemble (see #1), I'm down. After all, I loved when the Bluecoats got away with their "looping" effect in 2015.

#6 (RSTF Voted On Every 3 Years): Probably a good idea for the organization, although it doesn't matter to me (or any of the fans, for that matter).

#7 (Scoring System Update): To be honest, I could see this passing if DCI goes ahead with #4, or if they're OK with limiting the panels for weekday shows in #2. But as it is, it's OK; it reminds me of a similar proposal that a former SCV director presented a few years back. Also, I'd prefer this system be trialed at early-season or smaller shows.

#8 (Sound Reinforcement): ####, totally forgot about this one before posting! Well, I get where he's coming from. I still would absolutely prefer #1, though.

TL;DR I like #1 and #5, dislike #4 (unless there's a way to make it work without sacrificing the essence of DCI), and am neutral on all the others.

Edited by Cadevilina Crown
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Some joke that the D in DCP stands for Dinos, but  quick reviews of other discussion sites/platforms, etc. about the proposed changes don't differ widely from the feelings expressed on DCP threads that the Black mark proposal by Kathy is not worthy of passing, the electronics/amping/soundscapes are worthy of good discussion, color guard judging is getting mixed reactions, limiting judging to 6 off the field is not being positively backed, and other tweeking is worthy of review. Boomers, millenials, geriatrics, and cmms don't seem to be that different from the fmms, alumni, donors, and thread posters here. Look for yourself.

Edited by xandandl
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