War on Pits

[MikeD]

18 hours ago, N.E. Brigand said:

This man was probably the best-known lieder singer of the past century. And even the first paragraph of his Wikipedia entry mentions two of his regular accompanists (one of whom is playing here). They played an integral role while remaining in a supporting role. So if someone believes that's the role that front ensembles ought to play in drum corps, it's not an insult. 

 

We disagree on the purpose of the pit. It is not to remain "in a supporting role". The music ensemble is the brass, battery and pit. IMO none of them are of lesser importance. All three are equally part of the music being performed in modern drum corps.  That is our main area of disagreement, on this topic it seems. 

It is in no way an insult to say somebody is an accompanist, if that is what the part they are playing is intended to be. It is quite an art form in and of itself. I just don't find it relevant to the contribution of the pit in drum corps. 

 

[Ghost]

37 minutes ago, MikeD said:

We disagree on the purpose of the pit. It is not to remain "in a supporting role". The music ensemble is the brass, battery and pit. IMO none of them are of lesser importance. All three are equally part of the music being performed in modern drum corps.  

Yes, in today's DCI, "music ensemble is the brass, battery and pit".  But, if there was only the pit or percussion by themselves, you wouldn't have too many butts in the seats.  A corps repertoire lists music that the brass section is mainly responsible for, but occasionally the pit will "support" the melody.  

[ironlips]

If one is not attentive to balance and blend, one risks "Pit, with Brass and Battery Accompaniment".

This situation often pertains.

It's similar to that other malady, "Color Guard with Drum Corps Accompaniment". It matters little how nice it looks if it doesn't sound good.

If we posit that drum corps is essentially a musical entity, everything must serve the whole, and balance is key. If Mozart had a synth, he'd have used it, but you'd still be able to hear the strings.

[MikeD]

39 minutes ago, Ghost said:

Yes, in today's DCI, "music ensemble is the brass, battery and pit".  But, if there was only the pit or percussion by themselves, you wouldn't have too many butts in the seats.  A corps repertoire lists music that the brass section is mainly responsible for, but occasionally the pit will "support" the melody.  

There is much more to music than the melody. The arrangement of a musical work is the sum total of all of the voices. Everything written is important to the music being performed. 

[Ghost]

41 minutes ago, MikeD said:

 The arrangement of a musical work is the sum total of all of the voices. Everything written is important to the music being performed. 

In the D&BC arena? For judging purposes sure.   Who gets more visitors during pre show warm ups?  Brass, percussion, or pit?

[N.E. Brigand]

4 hours ago, Jeff Ream said:

If it gave them a place to march yes. With the growth of indoor percussion the number of kids trying out for the FE in drum corps has grown quite a bit.

but why let facts get in the way of a “in my day” thread 

Why wouldn't that argument apply to woodwind players also? They're told they can switch to brass or percussion if they want to be in a corps. The same message could be delivered to the pit players. 

(As far as "my day" goes, there's always been a front ensemble.)

[N.E. Brigand]

2 hours ago, ironlips said:

If one is not attentive to balance and blend, one risks "Pit, with Brass and Battery Accompaniment".

This situation often pertains.

It's similar to that other malady, "Color Guard with Drum Corps Accompaniment". It matters little how nice it looks if it doesn't sound good.

If we posit that drum corps is essentially a musical entity, everything must serve the whole, and balance is key. If Mozart had a synth, he'd have used it, but you'd still be able to hear the strings.

And he wouldn't use it throughout. In recent years, there are stretches when the brass is silent, and stretches when the battery is silent, but it's much more rare for the pit to be silent.

[N.E. Brigand]

4 hours ago, MikeD said:

We disagree on the purpose of the pit. It is not to remain "in a supporting role". The music ensemble is the brass, battery and pit. IMO none of them are of lesser importance. All three are equally part of the music being performed in modern drum corps.  That is our main area of disagreement, on this topic it seems. 

It is in no way an insult to say somebody is an accompanist, if that is what the part they are playing is intended to be. It is quite an art form in and of itself. I just don't find it relevant to the contribution of the pit in drum corps. 

Just remember that in drum corps right now (well, in 2019 when drum corps were active), there's something that you admire very much that someone like you will be complaining about in 20 years: some aspect of drum corps that you think is "intended" to be the way it is will be decried as having been a bad idea. 

We're all dinosaurs eventually.

[greg_orangecounty]

4 hours ago, Jeff Ream said:

but why let facts get in the way of a “in my day” thread 

Drum lines would get the **** beat out of them (verbally) if they were too loud.  Ask Ralph Hardimon, or Tom Float.  The same thing exists today except its pits and they get away with it for some reason.  For the life of me I can't understand how it's an "in my day" issue.  Is the overall sound and balance of the total ensemble no longer important?

I don't get it.  

[JustEnjoyIt]

2 hours ago, Ghost said:

In the D&BC arena? For judging purposes sure.   Who gets more visitors during pre show warm ups?  Brass, percussion, or pit?

Most butts are in the stands listening to the whole, not camped out in the warm-ups. That said, WGI does pretty well on the percussion side if we want to look at if people want to hear pits or not.



I also want to combat a tone that was woven into this thread. Members in the top groups choose and work hard to be in those pits. Not settle for being in them.

As far as them not taking breaks in playing as opposed to the battery or brass - that's because they're not marching around the field. Of course they're going to play more. Their voice is able to tie those moments together to help move the show along.

In modern ensembles, which the members and audience seems to like, the pit is an equally important voice that plays many parts. Sometimes it's accompaniment for the brass, sometimes accompaniment for the battery, sometimes accompaniment for both. Sometimes it's a co-voice that carries through equally important melodic lines, and yes, sometimes it's the melodic focus as well. I can't help but think of how less-exciting Bluecoats would've been last year without their pit, or how Phantom 2010 would've been without that glorious front ensemble writing. Crown from 2006 -2009, with sweeping pit moments. Blue Knights the past few years have been super tasty in their percussion writing (to my preference, to be fair), and the entire ensemble fits so well for their style. The pit helps tie that together just as the brass or battery does. It is equally important to be heard in the ensemble as a whole.

Edited May 28, 2020 by JustEnjoyIt