Would it make sense for DCI to implement temporary rules limiting certain things that add to a corps ability to tour

[GUARDLING]

51 minutes ago, DAvery said:

And we have all seen this done to the financial detriment of many corps. Maybe its time corps look at sustainability rather than their immediate competitive success. Maybe the first 4-5 weeks of the season should be just weekend shows of combined world and open class, having the judges travel instead of the corps. Sure you would only see the same corps for the first 4 weeks and some corps are not that close to others, but I think it could work. 

What members in 2021 you attracting? Where are they coming from?

The worst thing the activity can do is pretend ( like some in the past ) or forget WHO the activity is serving and times and needs always changing.  Not in 1972,  the 80s, 90s 2000s but today. The smart or successful directors knew in each of those decades WHO they were serving, what kind of member, where they were coming from etc. To do otherwise would be certain failure. 

With all the suggestions , which some might have some merit I haven't heard about members in 2021

Many of the failed corps of the 70s etc were because of big hearts BUT poor management, including WHO were the members of the day, not of the past. Quite different

Edited July 4, 2020 by GUARDLING

[DAvery]

1 hour ago, GUARDLING said:

What members in 2021 you attracting? Where are they coming from?

The worst thing the activity can do is pretend ( like some in the past ) or forget WHO the activity is serving and times and needs always changing.  Not in 1972,  the 80s, 90s 2000s but today. The smart or successful directors knew in each of those decades WHO they were serving, what kind of member, where they were coming from etc. To do otherwise would be certain failure. 

With all the suggestions , which some might have some merit I haven't heard about members in 2021

Many of the failed corps of the 70s etc were because of big hearts BUT poor management, including WHO were the members of the day, not of the past. Quite different

What are you saying, that a limited tour does not serve the 2021 members? If so, how about the potential 2025 or 2030 members if that corps is no longer around? Each corps has to look at finances and determine a course of action that will keep them on the field after 2021. If that means a limited tour in 2021, and possibly reduced recruits and lower scores, then so be it. The reality is this pandemic has forever changed our lives and there is no going back.  You can plan to try and return to life as before (which will not happen) or you can plan for the new normal. Three to five years from now you will be able to look back and see which people and organizations had the vision to synthisize and extrapolate this new normal. 

[greg_orangecounty]

2 hours ago, GUARDLING said:

What members in 2021 you attracting? Where are they coming from?

The worst thing the activity can do is pretend ( like some in the past ) or forget WHO the activity is serving and times and needs always changing.  Not in 1972,  the 80s, 90s 2000s but today. The smart or successful directors knew in each of those decades WHO they were serving, what kind of member, where they were coming from etc. To do otherwise would be certain failure. 

With all the suggestions , which some might have some merit I haven't heard about members in 2021

Many of the failed corps of the 70s etc were because of big hearts BUT poor management, including WHO were the members of the day, not of the past. Quite different

I can only speak for one corps and as I saw it.  We had a smart and successful Director and he always thought he was serving the audience, and we did too.  Everything else fell into place from that.

[GUARDLING]

45 minutes ago, DAvery said:

What are you saying, that a limited tour does not serve the 2021 members? If so, how about the potential 2025 or 2030 members if that corps is no longer around? Each corps has to look at finances and determine a course of action that will keep them on the field after 2021. If that means a limited tour in 2021, and possibly reduced recruits and lower scores, then so be it. The reality is this pandemic has forever changed our lives and there is no going back.  You can plan to try and return to life as before (which will not happen) or you can plan for the new normal. Three to five years from now you will be able to look back and see which people and organizations had the vision to synthisize and extrapolate this new normal. 

Of course finance is important BUT have you given any thought where members today come from. For most corps if members didnt travel from many parts of the country they wouldnt have a corps.

I totally agree things will have to be different but 1st look who and what you are serving. You will never get someone from Florida go off to a corps in another part of the country for some local shows. ( just an example ) How do I know this? I am and have been very involved in several auditions and interviews.

This isnt the days of the local kids with nothing to do join a corps

With all that said, lets just hope there is a 2021 season, the way things look I'm not quite sure , and Yes it's talking with new and old members, directors and parents.

Far more than finance, the way a corps interacts, transports, places to practice and stay will be a huge challenge, far more than finance. Corps even through these times are finding ways to make money or obtain donations from many. The things I mentioned will be much harder to overcome.

I think we agree mostly just not the same focus or the where members will or have come from and THEIR wants , needs and what gets them to participate. Especially if they travel the country just to be in a corps. Which is many..

Edited July 4, 2020 by GUARDLING

[GUARDLING]

56 minutes ago, greg_orangecounty said:

I can only speak for one corps and as I saw it.  We had a smart and successful Director and he always thought he was serving the audience, and we did too.  Everything else fell into place from that.

You did have a good corps and director .

 As a director ,you must serve your members That is their responsibility, Many good directors ( as people )of the past, didnt make it past the 70s for a reason. ( generally speaking ) not speaking of your corps.

Each decade is different. Any good director , winter fall or summer must know their members . Todays member is quite different from decades gone by. I know this 1st hand. The good and bad of that.

Edited July 4, 2020 by GUARDLING

[corps8294]

What's ultimately going to affect corps ability to tour? Housing, plain and simple. A corps could have everything solid, secure, and sitting in good standing all around; however, if housing is severely limited or non-existent next summer, then even the most successful of organizations are going to be having a rough go of it. 

[JimF-LowBari]

Too long to repost what guardling post when just making one point. DCI members come from all over the county today. If you have a month (half the season?) of local shows just still have to feed and house them. That is if you can find a place or a way to house them for a month. True transportation costs down but food and housing will not go down.

[cixelsyd]

11 hours ago, GUARDLING said:

What members in 2021 you attracting? Where are they coming from?

Good question.

Quote

The worst thing the activity can do is pretend ( like some in the past ) or forget WHO the activity is serving and times and needs always changing.  Not in 1972,  the 80s, 90s 2000s but today. The smart or successful directors knew in each of those decades WHO they were serving, what kind of member, where they were coming from etc. To do otherwise would be certain failure. 

With all the suggestions , which some might have some merit I haven't heard about members in 2021

That is precisely what I was thinking about when I said, in my previous post, that there are other complicating factors.  The biggest complication is that any corps seeking to maintain the same quality experience would therefore need to have their corps together 24/7 for the same amount of weeks.  And as Jim points out... 

1 hour ago, JimF-LowBari said:

Too long to repost what guardling post when just making one point. DCI members come from all over the county today. If you have a month (half the season?) of local shows just still have to feed and house them. That is if you can find a place or a way to house them for a month. True transportation costs down but food and housing will not go down.

... if you have the same membership, coming together from all over, you have the same need for housing, food, insurance and vehicles for the same number of weeks. 

Note that many corps have promised their 2020 contracted membership spots for 2021.  As humane a gesture as that seems, it has the unintended consequence of preventing them from recalibrating to a locally-based operation.  A corps with substantial local membership would be better able to adapt their schedule and reduce their housing/feeding requirements while in their home area.  And we should face the likelihood that if there is a 2021 season, it will require frequent adaptation to late-breaking developments.

[JimF-LowBari]

Any guesses to possibility of long term housing? Especially in age after CV?

[GUARDLING]

1 hour ago, cixelsyd said:

Good question.

That is precisely what I was thinking about when I said, in my previous post, that there are other complicating factors.  The biggest complication is that any corps seeking to maintain the same quality experience would therefore need to have their corps together 24/7 for the same amount of weeks.  And as Jim points out... 

... if you have the same membership, coming together from all over, you have the same need for housing, food, insurance and vehicles for the same number of weeks. 

Note that many corps have promised their 2020 contracted membership spots for 2021.  As humane a gesture as that seems, it has the unintended consequence of preventing them from recalibrating to a locally-based operation.  A corps with substantial local membership would be better able to adapt their schedule and reduce their housing/feeding requirements while in their home area.  And we should face the likelihood that if there is a 2021 season, it will require frequent adaptation to late-breaking developments.

The only problem with this ( although it would be nice ) Many of the top corps  do not have a local base, Many corps would not even be around today if it weren't for potential members from many states away. Many staff brought members from their areas ( HS students to fill spots in corps ) How many members are actually from the areas of corps. My experience with this , I would say very few.

I would agree local membership would solve some of the problems although the days of sending members home after a day of rehearsal is gone. The days of heading off to Mc Donalds to grab something quick is gone. If we went back to any of that or shoving kids in death trap school busses the outrage of the public would be huge and even with  liable situations. 

Creative thinking for sure is needed moving forward and being discussed for sure but we are in very hard times and handling it will be a very delicate situation for sure.