Jeff Ream Posted June 9, 2021 Share Posted June 9, 2021 4 hours ago, karuna said: We're not disagreeing. I mention Bloo/Crown only because that's where Boston wants to be. Digging out the trusty 10 yr avg finals placement... yup, takes time. Bostons average is up due to 17-19. or else it'd be lower. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
craiga Posted June 9, 2021 Share Posted June 9, 2021 I would offer the following; Boston's placements pre-2017 with entirely different management and design teams are not an indicator of anything. If anything, BAC's 12th place finish skews the number completely, and it is impossible for past performance to indicate future performance (ie: 2016-2017). 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cixelsyd Posted June 9, 2021 Share Posted June 9, 2021 (edited) 19 hours ago, JimF-LowBari said: Ok… starting to see your point clearer. Could you explain “using the non-member corps”? I could, if not for this 500 internal server error I keep getting. I will try again later... Edited June 9, 2021 by cixelsyd 500 internal server error 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
waliman4444 Posted June 9, 2021 Share Posted June 9, 2021 I have no problem with props when used appropriately and by appropriately I mean that they enhance the MUSIC production...As the MUSIC becomes more complex I don't want my sensory organs to be overwhelmed by EXPENSIVE, gaudy, props that take my attention away from what should be a cohesive show on a FOOTBALL field..As long as the mm's talents are on full display so be it...If all I talk about after a show is how the props looked (good or bad), maybe the mm's efforts become underappreciated or overhyped..peace Quote 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeN Posted June 9, 2021 Share Posted June 9, 2021 2 hours ago, cixelsyd said: I could, if not for this 500 internal server error I keep getting. Trying again in pieces... Both DCI and DCA run based on the model of haves and have-nots. Some of their corps are "members". They get access to all the shows they want/need, with enhanced pay (membership has its benefits). Meanwhile, there are other corps who are not members (that includes "associate members" and other such euphemisms) who get less access to shows and less pay. These circuits were created for the purpose of establishing/maintaining a sustainable operating model for competing drum corps. Why, then, do we have these seemingly permanent underclasses? It is not fair, equitable, or even IMO ethical. Well, thanks to several other contributors to this thread, I can explain why (see next post). Having worked for a Have Not, I have to say DCI's always been pretty accommodating with scheduling. We told them how many shows we wanted to do and which direction we wanted to travel, and they usually were able to make it work, for the most part. Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeN Posted June 9, 2021 Share Posted June 9, 2021 20 hours ago, keystone3ply said: Weed, the"Devil's Lettuce", Quaaludes, Acid, "Angels in the Sky", "Mello Yellow"? Back on topic @:40, here's a 6k lb. prop that uses a generator equipped with industrial hydraulics: Purely as a fan, that thing was bada$$ - that whole show was awesome. I'd put that squarely in the category of "good use of props." Mike 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimF-LowBari Posted June 9, 2021 Share Posted June 9, 2021 (edited) 3 hours ago, cixelsyd said: I could, if not for this 500 internal server error I keep getting. Trying again in pieces... Both DCI and DCA run based on the model of haves and have-nots. Some of their corps are "members". They get access to all the shows they want/need, with enhanced pay (membership has its benefits). Meanwhile, there are other corps who are not members (that includes "associate members" and other such euphemisms) who get less access to shows and less pay. These circuits were created for the purpose of establishing/maintaining a sustainable operating model for competing drum corps. Why, then, do we have these seemingly permanent underclasses? It is not fair, equitable, or even IMO ethical. Well, thanks to several other contributors to this thread, I can explain why (see next post). Responding as an FYI: Not close enough to DCA today to know the inner workings. IMO DCAs biggest issue has always been dealing with corps outside of the northeast. Back in my day there was a “lesser corps” circuit that ran shows in smaller places for cheaper prices. To host a DCA sanctioned show a host had to provide set amount of prize money and these places couldn’t raise the ticket revenue for the cost. So they held the lesser circuit shows with a smaller ticket price. Problem in the late 70s was as costs went up even the lesser corps needed a bigger prize money payout. So this raised the show costs and lot of places quit having shows as they couldn’t afford it or they could make the money doing other things. So corps had to travel further to shows which jacked up travel expense, which meant they needed higher prize payout, which meant show costs went up…. repeat vicious circle. Edit: forgot as shows upper the ticket prices less people attended so eventually hosts took in even less money. Was in a bunch of these lesser circuit shows for a few years and watched as they went away. Top of that the economy went bad in some areas which hurt membership and sponsorship in their local corps. Lack of corps killed that circuit apparently Edited June 9, 2021 by JimF-LowBari 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WilsonStaff Posted June 9, 2021 Share Posted June 9, 2021 (edited) On 6/8/2021 at 2:36 PM, JimF-LowBari said: Did the activity move away from the sponsoring churches. Posts etc? Or did the sponsoring churches, Posts, etc move away from the activity? American Legion/VfW membership and number of Posts has gone down as highest membership was due to WWI and WWII vets. Know of two local Posts (one VFW and one AL) who keep alive with social memberships. Not to be nasty that means cheaper beer for the members and many use it. Bottom line is the glory days of both AL and VFW have been gone for a while. Understand city churches sponsored good number of corps. Having gone through it I know that city churches have also taken a huge hit since the 50s/60s as people went to the suburbs. Bottom line is these groups can’t spend the money on activities like they used to. Even if we went back to local non touring mode many places couldn’t afford that. That is if they still exist. If you think DCI was the only cause, I disagree. Asked this 20 years old and never got a response from anyone. If DCI is the main reason for decline in number of corps, how does this explain the huge percentage of loss in the Senior/all age area Edited June 10, 2021 by WilsonStaff Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WilsonStaff Posted June 9, 2021 Share Posted June 9, 2021 1 hour ago, JimF-LowBari said: Responding as an FYI: Not close enough to DCA today to know the inner workings. IMO DCAs biggest issue has always been dealing with corps outside of the northeast. Back in my day there was a “lesser corps” circuit that ran shows in smaller places for cheaper prices. To host a DCA sanctioned show a host had to provide set amount of prize money and these places couldn’t raise the ticket revenue for the cost. So they held the lesser circuit shows with a smaller ticket price. Problem in the late 70s was as costs went up even the lesser corps needed a bigger prize money payout. So this raised the show costs and lot of places quit having shows as they couldn’t afford it or they could make the money doing other things. So corps had to travel further to shows which jacked up travel expense, which meant they needed higher prize payout, which meant show costs went up…. repeat vicious circle. Edit: forgot as shows upper the ticket prices less people attended so eventually hosts took in even less money. Was in a bunch of these lesser circuit shows for a few years and watched as they went away. Top of that the economy went bad in some areas which hurt membership and sponsorship in their local corps. Lack of corps killed that circuit apparently What about the bottom line? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimF-LowBari Posted June 9, 2021 Share Posted June 9, 2021 38 minutes ago, WilsonStaff said: What about the bottom line? I’m giving a history lesson.. no idea what you’re talking about… Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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