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6 hours ago, FTNK said:

A good thought and probably a real factor, but also… who can afford to march 3 or 4 years in a top corps when fees plus travel to camps is like $7-8k a year?

IDK, I marched in five different corps in as many years. True, three of those five folded during my career, and I would have been loyal to one of those three if they hadn’t folded, but after four years of marching in 60- 70 ish point corps, you want to end your career with a finals, if for no other reason than to prove to yourself that you can. I picked the one I loved through those years, and I was lucky to have marched with them. 

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3 hours ago, GUARDLING said:

Although I also hate how expensive the activity has become, it's not just the model. Winter programs with little travel compared to summer is very expensive, especially independent groups. Gone are the days of free or cheap rehearsal sites ( if you can get them )  church or community support ...etc etc

I still find the cost staggering and it saddens me that many kids get "priced out".....Back in the 70's, I struggled as a college kid to do corps, and it took me 10 years to pay back college loans.....if my life was fast forwarded to today, there is zero chance I would be able to afford to go college and also march corps.  Zero.    Every aspect of the activity is expensive these days........I still wonder if a corps need $80,000 of props on the field (and if they make that much difference) , but that's just my opinion....I kidded a friend recently....when DCI was in Orlando years ago, there was a parade at Epcot, and the corps members were given free time in the park......I was behind some of them at a food venue, and they were buying ALOT of food (overpriced park food at that), and all pulled out credit cards to pay the tab without any concern at all over cost.....They were also wearing sneakers that cost more than all of the clothes that I would have brought on tour....I laughed, as I remembered the last year that I finished tour, and I was digging for change in the bottom of my suitcase to get enough to buy a soda......

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8 hours ago, Bob984 said:

I still find the cost staggering and it saddens me that many kids get "priced out".....Back in the 70's, I struggled as a college kid to do corps, and it took me 10 years to pay back college loans.....if my life was fast forwarded to today, there is zero chance I would be able to afford to go college and also march corps.  Zero.    Every aspect of the activity is expensive these days........I still wonder if a corps need $80,000 of props on the field (and if they make that much difference) , but that's just my opinion....I kidded a friend recently....when DCI was in Orlando years ago, there was a parade at Epcot, and the corps members were given free time in the park......I was behind some of them at a food venue, and they were buying ALOT of food (overpriced park food at that), and all pulled out credit cards to pay the tab without any concern at all over cost.....They were also wearing sneakers that cost more than all of the clothes that I would have brought on tour....I laughed, as I remembered the last year that I finished tour, and I was digging for change in the bottom of my suitcase to get enough to buy a soda......

Different world for sure from back in the day..In all aspects.. The good and BAD of it

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15 hours ago, Bob984 said:

It's a bit sad that the dedication has shifted to the individual (self) and not to the group/organization.  There are kids who march in multiple corps during their youth; some as many as 3 or 4 corps.  I guess it's for "varied experiences"; I do understand if a kid goes to a corps, marches a season, is unhappy there, and decides to make a change.    However, one very common thing is that a kid will march in an open or world class corps (perhaps a non-finalist, but in some cases, even a finalist), and will then jump ship at the end of that season to join a top 6 corps. Also, there are more individuals than ever who only do one season due to costs, and the percentage of kids who do three or more seasons (which was common back in the day) has dwindled big time.  It would be interesting to see if kids would choose to march more seasons if the cost to march was suddenly cut in half or more, but I don't expect that to happen with the current model.

Kids marched in more than one corps even pre-DCI. I marched in 3 corps from 64-72, and other people I know did similar moves. It was less unusual than many make it out to be.

Kids did march longer in the past. Some of it was due to kids starting younger. 

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Many kids these days have cell phones which cost over $1000. And, the hs band I teach always has a huge amount of kids who go the the Maine Jazz Camp up here each summer. It lasts one week,  has no travel,  and but one performance for the parents on the final night.  Price? $1100. So yeah, it is a different time. Also, for the record, fast food jobs here in New England start at $16-$18 per hour, so everything is relative. 

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Also, to circle back to the topic, the Cadets are now in great hands. Ron Lambert is a great guy and well organized.  He will bring them to a new level.

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19 minutes ago, craiga said:

Many kids these days have cell phones which cost over $1000. And, the hs band I teach always has a huge amount of kids who go the the Maine Jazz Camp up here each summer. It lasts one week,  has no travel,  and but one performance for the parents on the final night.  Price? $1100. So yeah, it is a different time. Also, for the record, fast food jobs here in New England start at $16-$18 per hour, so everything is relative. 

I hear 'ya.........it does sadden me that some kids are quietly priced out of everything....in DCI,  the number of marchers who are from middle/average and low/average income households is much lower than it was in the 70's and 80's....like you say, everything is relative, but even in yesterday's dollars, kids are paying significantly more to do drum corps......I paid $300 to march in a finalist in 1977.....and I scrounged to get that together...lol.....we have schools (Florida) screaming for substitute teachers (nationwide as well), but in my county, the fast food worker is making more money per hour than the sub.......in NJ (where I used to teach) many districts had to quietly raise their sub pay on 1/1 to meet minimum wage requirements.....and they wonder why nobody's jumpin' for the job to work in the middle of a petri dish in a pandemic!!  Crazy times......

 

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6 hours ago, MikeD said:

Kids marched in more than one corps even pre-DCI. I marched in 3 corps from 64-72, and other people I know did similar moves. It was less unusual than many make it out to be.

Kids did march longer in the past. Some of it was due to kids starting younger. 

Not saying that it didn't happen in the past.....starting in an open (or back in the day, "A")  corps,  and then advancing to a "big boy" at a more mature age was common, and that still happens frequently.  What I was implying is that jumping from one big corps to another big corps didn't happen back then as frequently as it does now.....and economics/cost is definitely impacting the number of seasons members choose to march.....many more "one and done" members, and many who do 2 seasons and that's it.  One interested parallel to the times involves athletics......as the "sit out a year" rule involving college transfers is all but gone, and now athletes can start at one school, and play the next season at another....school hopping by athletes is going to become a big thing over the next several years.....far more in the past, because they can play for their new school right away......my only worry about that is "powers" actively recruiting kids already at other programs, and there will be no way to monitor that....it could become just like the pros in terms of trades, buying players, etc.....I don't think that corps has reached the point where corps are attempting to openly recruit/"steal" players from other corps (though historically it has happened),  but I don't think that it is an open practice....the bottom line is that it is a kid's choice to stay with the corps that they join, or to march in multiple corps.....not sure if it still happens, but some corps would offer a returning vet "discounts" for returning, which sometimes was a larger discount each year.......perhaps not a bad idea if the corps can get by.....

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17 hours ago, Bob984 said:

I still find the cost staggering and it saddens me that many kids get "priced out".....Back in the 70's, I struggled as a college kid to do corps, and it took me 10 years to pay back college loans.....if my life was fast forwarded to today, there is zero chance I would be able to afford to go college and also march corps.  Zero.    Every aspect of the activity is expensive these days........I still wonder if a corps need $80,000 of props on the field (and if they make that much difference) , but that's just my opinion....I kidded a friend recently....when DCI was in Orlando years ago, there was a parade at Epcot, and the corps members were given free time in the park......I was behind some of them at a food venue, and they were buying ALOT of food (overpriced park food at that), and all pulled out credit cards to pay the tab without any concern at all over cost.....They were also wearing sneakers that cost more than all of the clothes that I would have brought on tour....I laughed, as I remembered the last year that I finished tour, and I was digging for change in the bottom of my suitcase to get enough to buy a soda......

reduce the 6 weeks of spring training with its increased costs but no revenue and boom...savings

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23 hours ago, Bob984 said:

It's a bit sad that the dedication has shifted to the individual (self) and not to the group/organization.  There are kids who march in multiple corps during their youth; some as many as 3 or 4 corps.  I guess it's for "varied experiences"; I do understand if a kid goes to a corps, marches a season, is unhappy there, and decides to make a change.    However, one very common thing is that a kid will march in an open or world class corps (perhaps a non-finalist, but in some cases, even a finalist), and will then jump ship at the end of that season to join a top 6 corps. Also, there are more individuals than ever who only do one season due to costs, and the percentage of kids who do three or more seasons (which was common back in the day) has dwindled big time.  It would be interesting to see if kids would choose to march more seasons if the cost to march was suddenly cut in half or more, but I don't expect that to happen with the current model.

I was one of those kids. The previous two corps before Cadets left bad tastes in my mouth. Hell, I almost didn't go back to Cadets in 2000 because 1999 was such a sub-par experience (behind the scenes). I was never a ring chaser, but when I first saw Cadets live in 1996, I knew that was the corps I wanted to march. I was just a horrible trumpet player when I first discovered drum corps. 

 

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