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March or Die thoughts 2021....


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1 hour ago, OldSnareDrummer said:

I have to agree that sponsors forking over goods and cash have to have some influence, how much I have no idea.
Mello, are you proposing (for the lack of better term) forced parity via spending caps? 

Sorta.  Control what can be controlled for a judged activity.  Obviously corps do a lot better getting funds.  Which is fantastic, but at some point it needs to be less invasive for "score".  Even pro sports see this, non-profits should be able to see the forest through the trees.  Advantage will away be there, there is zero reason to make it more than it already is.

 

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2 hours ago, MikeN said:

It'd be hard to make a case that ticket / merch / streaming sales support that.  (Though, to be fair to your argument, without a whole lot more data than DCI gives, it's probably unlikely to *disprove* that as well.)  From a macro level, it seems like the fanbase is chugging along at a pretty steady clip over the past decade.

But if you had to pick one or the other, which would you say DCI has truly grown in the past decade?

- Electronics/props/tarps

- Fanbase

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 Fans are important to Drum Corps activity, but nowhere near as important as some on here seem to believe as I read the comments on here.

 The people DCI Drum Corps are primarily interested in maintaining and growing a base are the marchers in scholastic marching bands. These are the new and replenished " customers " for DCI each and every year. They are the ones that play lots of money to audition, and for some to perform. Half the attendeees of the DCI Finals are parents, boy friends, girl friends, etc. Most of this segment are there to cheer on their loved one, and they really could care less what the marcher is playing or wearing. This  fan segment  loyalty to the  activity extends to the marching friend/ family. When that marcher is done marching , they are done. They're gone for good when the marcher goes. Keep in mind also that about 85% of the marchers who finish DCI marching years ( usually 1-4 years at most now), move on with their life and we never see them again at any Drum Corps shows.

 The DCI market for their product are primarily the H.S. Marching Band and WGI Scholastic Groups. Thats their target " audience ".  Not the die hards in the audience  ( and here on DCP )  that have been gong to shows for years and years. Just about all the movers and shakers in DCI instrumentation, attire choices, show designs,  music choices, prop choices , etc are involved in the scholastic environment and derive income from that target market environment. So when we say that DCI needs to please its " audience ", they are. But the " audience " definition might not be defined the same with everyone. The " audience " is not primarily the die hard DCI loyalist in the stands. The " audience " is primarily not the die hards here on DCP, or the ones that make their annual pilgrimage  to the same shows year after year, after year either. They are but a very very small " audience " segment that DCI is attempting to please. The " audience " that DCI wants to please the most with their product are the ones that are willing to pay the most for the privilege. A ticket purchase is nice. But thousands of dollars payed to audition tryout camp evaluations, or to receive seminar teachings, or to perform in the summer, etc is  understandably far more the reward for DCI, than the ticket purchase to a show from the fan in the stands " audience ". The young in the scholastic groups are still looking to pay a lot to march DCI in healthy numbers, so the marketing product DCI has to their target " audience " continues to be a success, as near as I can tell.

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27 minutes ago, Boss Anova said:

 Fans are important to Drum Corps activity, but nowhere near as important as some on here seem to believe as I read the comments on here.

 The people DCI Drum Corps are primarily interested in maintaining and growing a base are the marchers in scholastic marching bands. These are the new and replenished " customers " for DCI each and every year. They are the ones that play lots of money to audition, and for some to perform. Half the attendeees of the DCI Finals are parents, boy friends, girl friends, etc. Most of this segment are there to cheer on their loved one, and they really could care less what the marcher is playing or wearing. This  fan segment  loyalty to the  activity extends to the marching friend/ family. When that marcher is done marching , they are done. They're gone for good when the marcher goes. Keep in mind also that about 85% of the marchers who finish DCI marching years ( usually 1-4 years at most now), move on with their life and we never see them again at any Drum Corps shows.

 The DCI market for their product are primarily the H.S. Marching Band and WGI Scholastic Groups. Thats their target " audience ".  Not the die hards in the audience  ( and here on DCP )  that have been gong to shows for years and years. Just about all the movers and shakers in DCI instrumentation, attire choices, show designs,  music choices, prop choices , etc are involved in the scholastic environment and derive income from that target market environment. So when we say that DCI needs to please its " audience ", they are. But the " audience " definition might not be defined the same with everyone. The " audience " is not primarily the die hard DCI loyalist in the stands. The " audience " is primarily not the die hards here on DCP, or the ones that make their annual pilgrimage  to the same shows year after year, after year either. They are but a very very small " audience " segment that DCI is attempting to please. The " audience " that DCI wants to please the most with their product are the ones that are willing to pay the most for the privilege. A ticket purchase is nice. But thousands of dollars payed to audition tryout camp evaluations, or to receive seminar teachings, or to perform in the summer, etc is  understandably far more the reward for DCI, than the ticket purchase to a show from the fan in the stands " audience ". The young in the scholastic groups are still looking to march DCI in healthy numbers, so the marketing product DCI has to their " audience " continues to be a success, as near as I can tell.

If that statistic is correct, DCI losing 85% is a really bad number..OUCH!

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30 minutes ago, Boss Anova said:

 Fans are important to Drum Corps activity, but nowhere near as important as some on here seem to believe as I read the comments on here.

 The people DCI Drum Corps are primarily interested in maintaining and growing a base are the marchers in scholastic marching bands. These are the new and replenished " customers " for DCI each and every year. They are the ones that play lots of money to audition, and for some to perform. Half the attendeees of the DCI Finals are parents, boy friends, girl friends, etc. Most of this segment are there to cheer on their loved one, and they really could care less what the marcher is playing or wearing. This  fan segment  loyalty to the  activity extends to the marching friend/ family. When that marcher is done marching , they are done. They're gone for good when the marcher goes. Keep in mind also that about 85% of the marchers who finish DCI marching years ( usually 1-4 years at most now), move on with their life and we never see them again at any Drum Corps shows.

 The DCI market for their product are primarily the H.S. Marching Band and WGI Scholastic Groups. Thats their target " audience ".  Not the die hards in the audience  ( and here on DCP )  that have been gong to shows for years and years. Just about all the movers and shakers in DCI instrumentation, attire choices, show designs,  music choices, prop choices , etc are involved in the scholastic environment and derive income from that target market environment. So when we say that DCI needs to please its " audience ", they are. But the " audience " definition might not be defined the same with everyone. The " audience " is not primarily the die hard DCI loyalist in the stands. The " audience " is primarily not the die hards here on DCP, or the ones that make their annual pilgrimage  to the same shows year after year, after year either. They are but a very very small " audience " segment that DCI is attempting to please. The " audience " that DCI wants to please the most with their product are the ones that are willing to pay the most for the privilege. A ticket purchase is nice. But thousands of dollars payed to audition tryout camp evaluations, or to receive seminar teachings, or to perform in the summer, etc is  understandably far more the reward for DCI, than the ticket purchase to a show from the fan in the stands " audience ". The young in the scholastic groups are still looking to march DCI in healthy numbers, so the marketing product DCI has to their " audience " continues to be a success, as near as I can tell.

Been checking once in a while to see how much Crap people get with dissenting opinions. But have to jump in and play Captain Obvious here and say BA sees the elephant in the room. My concern is always DC survival and have said for 20+ years I’m surprised the activity still exists.

Survival is not going to be keeping lot of long term fans as think that boat left a while back. Survival is going to be more year to year by having something the current eligible members will want to spend the money and time to join. So you can look at way things used to be and if you like/don’t like current styles or use of props, electronics, etc, but it’s the opinion of the possible members that count. 
 

Due to family issues haven’t made DCA weekend in years. But seeing the average age in the stands “not get any younger” DCA needs to keep this in mind too.

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33 minutes ago, Mello Dude said:

If that statistic is correct, DCI losing 85% is a really bad number..OUCH!

 Even in the pre DCI years, attendance was made up of primarily family members, boyfriends, girlfriends, etc. At Veteran sponsored Drum Corps National Championships, add in about 40% of the audience at Championships as Veterans and maybe the spouse  as an adjunct add on to their Veterans Convention Attendance that week.  Drum Corps... I know, hard to accept for all us die hards, ... is really one of the smallest of the smallest of niche activities. It has always been.

 Drum Corps... to my knowledge... has never had an  " audience " at any single show in its history ( DCI years or prior ) that reached 50,000 of paid " audience " to any show.

 

 DCI losing 85% of its " audience " that move on likely will ( imo ) become more problematic in the ensuing years however, as a much higher percentages of them go into teaching careers,  ( compared to age outs decades ago ), and teaching is not exactly a high paying career. When Corps call on age outs  down the line, not a lot of them are going to be writing big checks as Alums to their former corps. Not when many ( but not all ) have degrees in Music Ed., instead of Finance, Economics, Engineering, Information Technology,  Business, etc . Degrees that, on average, ultimately pay its graduates in their careers, far, far more than most with degrees in Music Ed.

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6 hours ago, MikeN said:

Respectfully, not *that* many corps get corporate sponsorship dollars from within music, especially once you get down the ranks.  Where top corps get freebies, lower corps merely get discounts, and sometimes not even great ones at that.  

Mike

True….But the corps who buck the current trends suffer in the standings and therefore are relegated down the ranks. Play the game or pay the penalty?

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16 minutes ago, Sutasaurus said:

True….But the corps who buck the current trends suffer in the standings and therefore are relegated down the ranks. Play the game or pay the penalty?

I dont know what this means... " buck the current trends ".  DCI Drum Corps does not have much in the order of " current trends ". It is constantly doing new things that make " current trends " passe. if a Corps comes out and does an old show, or a " current trend ", it finds itself left behind on the judging sheets.

 The DCI judging sheets reward freshness, and new things, ie, new music, being creative, progressive, daring, bold. The Corps voted and approved these sheets.  The Blue Devils dont do " current trend " or a redo of former shows. They push the envelope.. The Cavaliers did not do the " current trend shows " that BD was doing in the 1990's. The Cavs came out with new visual/ guard integrated shows that for a couple of years caught BD flat footed, as Cavs went right to the top via better visually designed shows. BD then responded to that, and created their own " new " trend.

 

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1 hour ago, Boss Anova said:

 Fans are important to Drum Corps activity, but nowhere near as important as some on here seem to believe as I read the comments on here.

 The people DCI Drum Corps are primarily interested in maintaining and growing a base are the marchers in scholastic marching bands. These are the new and replenished " customers " for DCI each and every year. They are the ones that play lots of money to audition, and for some to perform. Half the attendeees of the DCI Finals are parents, boy friends, girl friends, etc. Most of this segment are there to cheer on their loved one, and they really could care less what the marcher is playing or wearing. This  fan segment  loyalty to the  activity extends to the marching friend/ family. When that marcher is done marching , they are done. They're gone for good when the marcher goes. Keep in mind also that about 85% of the marchers who finish DCI marching years ( usually 1-4 years at most now), move on with their life and we never see them again at any Drum Corps shows.

 The DCI market for their product are primarily the H.S. Marching Band and WGI Scholastic Groups. Thats their target " audience ".  Not the die hards in the audience  ( and here on DCP )  that have been gong to shows for years and years. Just about all the movers and shakers in DCI instrumentation, attire choices, show designs,  music choices, prop choices , etc are involved in the scholastic environment and derive income from that target market environment. So when we say that DCI needs to please its " audience ", they are. But the " audience " definition might not be defined the same with everyone. The " audience " is not primarily the die hard DCI loyalist in the stands. The " audience " is primarily not the die hards here on DCP, or the ones that make their annual pilgrimage  to the same shows year after year, after year either. They are but a very very small " audience " segment that DCI is attempting to please. The " audience " that DCI wants to please the most with their product are the ones that are willing to pay the most for the privilege. A ticket purchase is nice. But thousands of dollars payed to audition tryout camp evaluations, or to receive seminar teachings, or to perform in the summer, etc is  understandably far more the reward for DCI, than the ticket purchase to a show from the fan in the stands " audience ". The young in the scholastic groups are still looking to pay a lot to march DCI in healthy numbers, so the marketing product DCI has to their target " audience " continues to be a success, as near as I can tell.

If that’s the case, then why bother to tour? If the corps are raking in the cash with audition fees and membership fees why have competitions? Could it be that DCI relies on ticket sales and partnerships with Flo Marching to survive? I see the point you are trying to make here but it seems that one of the basic ingredients is missing. There are PLENTY of venues where the audience is mainly local people who come to a show as part of an annual celebration. It’s not just DCPers or parents of MMs but lots of Mr snd Ms Anytown USA who want a summer evening of entertainment. I think this is a good part of DCI’s and the corps’ bread and butter. Otherwise they wouldn’t do it?

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6 minutes ago, Boss Anova said:

I dont know what this means... " buck the current trends ".  DCI Drum Corps does not have much in the order of " current trends ". It is constantly doing new things that make " current trends " passe. if a Corps comes out and does an old show, or a " current trend ", it finds itself left behind on the judging sheets.

 The DCI judging sheets reward freshness, and new things, ie, new music, being creative, progressive, daring, bold. The Corps voted and approved these sheets.  The Blue Devils dont do " current trend " shows. They push the envelope. SCV as well.

 

Current trends like tarps, vertical props, hit or miss electronics to name a few. We touched on this very point several pages back. It’s monkey see/monkey do that gets rewarded. If a corps comes out and does an “old show” as you stated without putting a fresh twist on it, then yes they will not advance in the standings. Corps who perform a show that excites and entertains without the use of props or gimmicks should be recognized and rewarded as being just that and not scored lower because they decided to go the route of music and motion to entertain the audience.

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