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March or Die thoughts 2021....


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9 hours ago, Boss Anova said:

 There are no penalties for non use of props in any Show. There is no caption in the judging sheets for " props ". Corps will place high or low, but it wont be for the size or cost, or elaborateness of any prop. I've seen some of the Corps with the biggest, most elaborate, most costly to make and transport props in Drum Corps not even make Finals.... lol ! I would imagine you have too. As a matter of fact, going back and looking at props the last decade, I see very little connection to the size , numbers, elaborateness of " props " to placements. Without naming names ( no need) some Corps have placed high in the last few years with rather small, inexpensive ( some might say " flimsy ) props. I dont see judges being fooled by big and expensive props, or handicapping Corps with smaller, inexpensive props. Same with WGI Scholastic groups, or BOA competitions. Some units with the biggest, most expensive props ( some as big as a small airplane...literally.. lol) did not win. So I'm not getting how any Corps scores or placements are predicated on a " prop" in the show. Judges want to assess if that prop you use in the show works or does not work. What a Corps might have paid for the prop, or how you transport it to the field and the like, is of no concern to them at all, imo. Nor should it be.

 

Well, then, it should be of no consequence if we just ended the practice by banning their use, right?

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4 hours ago, cixelsyd said:

Well, then, it should be of no consequence if we just ended the practice by banning their use, right?

We as in who.. the " WE" who decide all this are the corps period. The corps  decades ago  decided their own pathway. Kinda the main reason DCI was formed to begin with, which I'm sure you know.

Edited by GUARDLING
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3 minutes ago, GUARDLING said:

We as in who.. the " WE" who decide all this are the corps period. The corps decided decades ago to decide their own pathway, kinda the main reason DCI was formed to begin with.

It was just a question from one person to another, not a formal proposal to the DCI Rules Congress or a call to end all democracy.

But since I have your attention - this is not the first time we have heard this sort of double-speak about the ever-increasing array of "stuff" in drum corps.  Whatever kind of "stuff" it may be (any-key, any-brass, any-pit-percussion, anything electronic, props, tarps, annual recostuming), there is this fervent fight to include it in an activity of limited financial resources.  Yet, at the same time, there is this fervent denial that it has any affect on the score a corps receives. 

Where do you stand on those two issues?  Do you think this "stuff" should be in drum corps?  And do you think it adds anything to the scoring power of a competitive show?

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22 minutes ago, GUARDLING said:

We as in who.. the " WE" who decide all this are the corps period. The corps  decades ago  decided their own pathway. Kinda the main reason DCI was formed to begin with, which I'm sure you know.

Actually, the "we" are the judges that interpret the sheets.  It's almost like a bubble reality here where reality is not what you think it is.  If stuff = "score", in which the evidence is pretty damning...show me on the sheet where this written......hmmmmmm

 

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8 minutes ago, cixelsyd said:

It was just a question from one person to another, not a formal proposal to the DCI Rules Congress or a call to end all democracy.

But since I have your attention - this is not the first time we have heard this sort of double-speak about the ever-increasing array of "stuff" in drum corps.  Whatever kind of "stuff" it may be (any-key, any-brass, any-pit-percussion, anything electronic, props, tarps, annual recostuming), there is this fervent fight to include it in an activity of limited financial resources.  Yet, at the same time, there is this fervent denial that it has any affect on the score a corps receives. 

Where do you stand on those two issues?  Do you think this "stuff" should be in drum corps?  And do you think it adds anything to the scoring power of a competitive show?

My personal opinion doesnt mean a thing. These corps will and have the power to decide whats best for them. Now with that said. Do I believe all change is good ....NO...do I believe it all works? ...Not for all... 

Do I thinkCorps should decide what they want to do and not be under the thumb of in many cases a minority opposed to almost any change  YES

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23 minutes ago, Mello Dude said:

Actually, the "we" are the judges that interpret the sheets.  It's almost like a bubble reality here where reality is not what you think it is.  If stuff = "score", in which the evidence is pretty damning...show me on the sheet where this written......hmmmmmm

 

 

 

I have written shows as well as judged. Not all " stuff " equals success nor a guarantee of success.  It all comes down to how well someone does something OR how well something is used and IF it adds or detracts from a program.

If the "WE" is the judges then for sure they do not have the power to ban anything as what was seemed to be suggested in the WE statement. I was just questioning the WE, the rest is just opinion

Edited by GUARDLING
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14 minutes ago, GUARDLING said:

 

 

I have written shows as well as judged. Not all " stuff " equals success nor a guarantee of success.  It all comes down to how well someone does something OR how well something is used and IF it adds or detracts from a program.

If the "WE" is the judges then for sure they do not have the power to ban anything as what was seemed to be suggested in the WE statement. I was just questioning the WE, the rest is just opinion

Thank you.  So, because of this, stuff = "score" thus winning.  There are no guarantees in life but there sure seems to be zero chance of getting "score" thus winning without a truckload of props.  IMHO it's ridiculous (and unfair) to have an entire semi truck hauling around props (at huge cost) to have a chance at winning a judged activity that "claims" that this is not so.  Not to mention the sound systems that are producing "score" with a non-member running it.  A GOOD sound system costs a lot...a great one even more.  Just more and more things where money=winning.  This was warned about when this all started years ago and here we are.  So when the name "Varsity" is thrown around as well as some others, this bodes ill for a competitive activity to say the least.  ESPECIALLY in a mostly non-profit activity.

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6 minutes ago, Mello Dude said:

Thank you.  So, because of this, stuff = "score" thus winning.  There are no guarantees in life but there sure seems to be zero chance of getting "score" thus winning without a truckload of props.  IMHO it's ridiculous (and unfair) to have an entire semi truck hauling around props (at huge cost) to have a chance at winning a judged activity that "claims" that this is not so.  Not to mention the sound systems that are producing "score" with a non-member running it.  A GOOD sound system costs a lot...a great one even more.  Just more and more things where money=winning.  This was warned about when this all started years ago and here we are.  So when the name "Varsity" is thrown around as well as some others, this bodes ill for a competitive activity to say the least.  ESPECIALLY in a mostly non-profit activity.

Putting aside everything that is basically opinion..who said " stuff = score = winning..in fact I said the opposite..Not all " stuff is done well and others done very well. Now you can have an opinion of course if you think something is done well or not.

We might have a middle ground here with a non member producing aspects of a show BUT again the "WE" who decides all this is.....the corps.

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3 minutes ago, GUARDLING said:

Putting aside everything that is basically opinion..who said " stuff = score = winning..in fact I said the opposite..Not all " stuff is done well and others done very well. Now you can have an opinion of course if you think something is done well or not.

We might have a middle ground here with a non member producing aspects of a show BUT again the "WE" who decides all this is.....the corps.

Then why are all corps doing it since it costs an amazing amount?  When marching and playing are not given equal or MORE credit for demand that falls on judges and the way they interpret sheets.

The corps can write anything they want on the sheets.  Those that judge and interpret those sheets hold sway and the direction everyone will travel to achieve "score".

Opinions based on evidence and empirical evidence are something to behold.

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