Phantom Regiment troubles?..

[skevinp]

4 hours ago, JimF-LowBari said:

If what I’ve read here is true…

Stopped reading here.

[cixelsyd]

3 hours ago, Mello Dude said:

I know a LOT of professionals that teach, and teach well, that kind of get in your face and make you better.  This is why I want to hear from the people that were there and the context in which this was done.  I marched in the 80's and getting ribbed was kind of a normal thing when you were screwing up.

Things have changed since then.

We probably are all aware (at least from historical accounts, if not from personal experience) that verbal abuse was often part of the training technique for most physically demanding competitive endeavors.  If it was used in the military (from where drum corps originated), then it was thought to be appropriate for coaching sports at equivalent age levels, and even the marching arts.  The most revered, character-developing generals, coaches, instructors... even band directors... were best known for their mouths.

If you visit rehearsals today, you will probably notice that contemporary corps staff prefer to teach/coach without resorting to verbal abuse.  The change in rehearsal culture is profound.  

[Sutasaurus]

Oh, how I miss John Brazale. He was family. He came out with some choice call outs but we all understood things said were to make us think on the field and be better performers. I look back on those days fondly. I understand it was a different day and age from what constitutes today’s drum corps.

Edited December 29, 2021 by Sutasaurus

[JimF-LowBari]

1 hour ago, skevinp said:

Stopped reading here.

Then why are you even looking at the thread?😈😆

Edited December 29, 2021 by JimF-LowBari

[JimF-LowBari]

57 minutes ago, cixelsyd said:

Things have changed since then.

We probably are all aware (at least from historical accounts, if not from personal experience) that verbal abuse was often part of the training technique for most physically demanding competitive endeavors.  If it was used in the military (from where drum corps originated), then it was thought to be appropriate for coaching sports at equivalent age levels, and even the marching arts.  The most revered, character-developing generals, coaches, instructors... even band directors... were best known for their mouths.

If you visit rehearsals today, you will probably notice that contemporary corps staff prefer to teach/coach without resorting to verbal abuse.  The change in rehearsal culture is profound.  

I could never understand how the scream in your face, etc bit ever helped. Yeah we had some lazy bleeps who needed “reminded” about pulling their share. But if any of the rest screwed up it was a mental miscue or misunderstanding. And the person who screwed up was usually the one most upset. Had a few drill instructors who yelled but never personal. You’d get “what the hell are you doing” and after practice it was “haven’t talked for a while, so how are you”. (Jeff knows who I mean 😆)

For reference this is mid to late 1970s in Senior corps

There is a thread on one of the FB groups about punishment in corps. Appears most responses did Jrs in 1960s/early 1970s. Lot of what I’ve read would have me walking out. 

Edited December 29, 2021 by JimF-LowBari

[Jeff Ream]

6 hours ago, cixelsyd said:

Now you are conflating the CEO hire with this?

And breaking the silence with a nothing-burger like "looking into it (again)" will not appease anyone.  Certainly not MAASIN.  They made it clear in their statement that even a firing will not appease them.  Not even two firings.  It will take three - the offending staffer, the guard caption head, and the corps director.

At this point, there are only two ways that breaking the "cone of silence" could benefit Phantom Regiment.  

1.  Announcing three firings.

2.  Announcing a defamation lawsuit against MAASIN.

If Phantom Regiment is choosing any of the other possible courses of action between those extremes, I do not see how a public statement helps them.  But if there is some piece of public relations wizardry that would, I am all ears.

 

not at all. the only conflating and putting words into other peoples mouths/fingers is you.

[Jeff Ream]

1 hour ago, cixelsyd said:

Things have changed since then.

We probably are all aware (at least from historical accounts, if not from personal experience) that verbal abuse was often part of the training technique for most physically demanding competitive endeavors.  If it was used in the military (from where drum corps originated), then it was thought to be appropriate for coaching sports at equivalent age levels, and even the marching arts.  The most revered, character-developing generals, coaches, instructors... even band directors... were best known for their mouths.

If you visit rehearsals today, you will probably notice that contemporary corps staff prefer to teach/coach without resorting to verbal abuse.  The change in rehearsal culture is profound.  

very much so. when i last taught in 2012 it was different from when i first started marching, and it's even more noticeable now. i have been to a few youth sporting events where maybe things were a little too "old school" and even saw a 12 year old call out a coach for yelling in a way that wasn't constructive

[skevinp]

34 minutes ago, JimF-LowBari said:

Then why are you even looking at the thread?😈😆

Because I think it is an important topic that can benefit from constructive discussions that might lead to solutions that prevent these kinds of harms from occurring in the future, you?

[JimF-LowBari]

2 minutes ago, Jeff Ream said:

very much so. when i last taught in 2012 it was different from when i first started marching, and it's even more noticeable now. i have been to a few youth sporting events where maybe things were a little too "old school" and even saw a 12 year old call out a coach for yelling in a way that wasn't constructive

One of the reasons (besides a killer work load from being a transfer student) I only did 1 year of college MB was the attitude of the student aides and some members. Learned a new drill each home game and got stressful at times at practice. “Favorite” was our group learning a drill portion and aide pointing and yelling “wrong” at individual members. So yours truly says “so what’s right?… if this many are wrong then we’re lost and need ‘splaining”. Fellow trombonist who was in a DCI corps quote was “yeah wtf”.

[skevinp]

8 minutes ago, Jeff Ream said:

very much so. when i last taught in 2012 it was different from when i first started marching, and it's even more noticeable now. i have been to a few youth sporting events where maybe things were a little too "old school" and even saw a 12 year old call out a coach for yelling in a way that wasn't constructive

I’m picturing how my old HS band director would have reacted if I said that to him.  Looks something like Yosemite Sam.