NewToPosting Posted January 11, 2022 Share Posted January 11, 2022 "How do we train the staff?" "How do we train the kids?" "How do we train the parents?" Not a popular answer - but look at what WGI did this year. EVERY participant had to take SafeSport training. Every staff member. The training specifically answers those questions. This is not a "reinvent the wheel" scenario. Other activities have figured it out. There is a model already!!! DCI need only adopt it. They are hell-bent on doing it the hard way, though (years and years later, still, for some reason). 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Ream Posted January 11, 2022 Share Posted January 11, 2022 7 hours ago, LoveKathyG said: I've worked in higher education for 36 years. One of my reporting units is student conduct. I understand. well being married to an elementary teacher, i see the trainings she goes through. staggering 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Poppycock Posted January 11, 2022 Share Posted January 11, 2022 DCI is a show promoter that organize and present live music events. They're not interested in being a governing body. The member corps should establish mandatory, enforceable rules, but that won't happen. This is due to the organizational structure put in place for 50 years to only serve its member organizations, and those people whose livelihoods depend on the very existence of the organization and show promoter. Training, self-awareness, social awareness, and organizational awareness should be instituted throughout the activity. However, there is the risk of collaboration between the accused individual(s), organization and DCI to sweep the issue under the rug with the 'there is nothing to see here mentality', or 'that's old news' explanation from the same parties. We have seen a precedent of non-action on numerous occasions. IMO - Those who believe they are victims of sexual harassment, abuse, and assault should report the exchange directly to the local police of where the incident occurred or happened immediately. (911) is your friend. A specially trained police officer is better equipped and prepared to handle the particular situation to document and/or make an arrest. Remember there is no limitation on when a victim can report a crime to police, but sooner is better than later. 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Ream Posted January 11, 2022 Share Posted January 11, 2022 7 hours ago, LoveKathyG said: Kathy's not confused. You're talking about reporting. I'm talking about investigating, counseling, advocating, and adjudicating. Educators of all ilks are trained in reporting, as you note. They have an important role in the process. Investigating, counseling, advocating, adjudicating, etc. are very specialized skills that require a deep knowledge base. My point is that the current model in drum corps (if I'm understanding correctly) puts more responsibility on corps staff (i.e. for investigating and adjudicating) than it should. Mandated reporting can be taught in a few hours. I know this because I take the training every other year. Functions like advocating, counseling, investigating are specialized skills that require a lot more than mandated reported training. This I know because one of my reporting units at the university I work for is the student conduct function. Even though I've had oversight of student conduct for decades, I have to defer to the experts in my operation since I don't have the detailed knowledge and skill they possess. The DCI model gives responsibility for all the above to corps staff. My experience in education leads me to believe that it's not realistic to think that corps staff can adequately fill all roles. Reporting...yes. Investigating, adjudicating, etc...no or at least not consistently. The model I'm talking about is that corps staff do the reporting and DCI or a contractor provides the victim advocacy, investigation, and adjudicating. I think I insulted a few people (BrassTeacher, for one), and for that I apologize. My intent was not to say that music educators as a whole aren't smart enough or dedicated enough or caring enough to do the right thing. My experience with educators is that most will go to the wall to support their students. I believe we're all on the same side. We all want members to have a great experience in a safe environment. I'll leave it there. wow. thank you for this...very enlightening, and it does appear to sum up the ( continuing to be proven) flawed process DCI seems to have in place Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Ream Posted January 11, 2022 Share Posted January 11, 2022 2 hours ago, rpbobcat said: Again, this requires DCI to function as the organization's Governing Body. Something they don't seem to have any interest in. If they did function as a true governing body, they would establish mandatory, enforceable rules all corps must follow. As far as being on the same side, DCI's actions or inactions give the impression that, while they may, at times, talk a good game, DCI (the 12 corps) is unwilling to do the "heavy lifting" needed to address things like the SoA situation from happening again. There are several cliches that come to mind when it comes to how DCI handles difficult/controversial matters: Kick the can down the road Sweep it under the carpet. In my opinion unless/until DCI is in financial or or legal jeopardy, nothing is going to change. for the record all of world class are members, not just the top 12 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Ream Posted January 11, 2022 Share Posted January 11, 2022 1 hour ago, NewToPosting said: "How do we train the staff?" "How do we train the kids?" "How do we train the parents?" Not a popular answer - but look at what WGI did this year. EVERY participant had to take SafeSport training. Every staff member. The training specifically answers those questions. This is not a "reinvent the wheel" scenario. Other activities have figured it out. There is a model already!!! DCI need only adopt it. They are hell-bent on doing it the hard way, though (years and years later, still, for some reason). if i had to guess their reasons for avoiding it, it's the following: money time accountability liability Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NewToPosting Posted January 11, 2022 Share Posted January 11, 2022 2 minutes ago, Jeff Ream said: if i had to guess their reasons for avoiding it, it's the following: money time accountability liability Those are all reasons to invest in such a training. The training already exists! It actually takes them out of the accountability realm, in some regards. If everyone is trained to report correctly, resources are utilized correctly. It's pretty clear what staff would have to do (at least the training that WGI did) and it's not overly complicated. I know many winterguards feel a sigh of relief for having this in place, because similar to DCI, winterguards were doing a lot of investigating and adjudicating on their own. It's not their place! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lance Posted January 11, 2022 Share Posted January 11, 2022 7 hours ago, LoveKathyG said: Kathy's not confused. You're talking about reporting. I'm talking about investigating, counseling, advocating, and adjudicating. Educators of all ilks are trained in reporting, as you note. They have an important role in the process. Investigating, counseling, advocating, adjudicating, etc. are very specialized skills that require a deep knowledge base. My point is that the current model in drum corps (if I'm understanding correctly) puts more responsibility on corps staff (i.e. for investigating and adjudicating) than it should. Sorry for calling you confused when you're not. Now I get what you were saying, and we're really saying the same thing. It shouldn't be the responsibility of an instructor/educator/teacher to do any investigating, counseling, etc regarding issues of abuse. If a student tells us about abuse, we report it. Not our job to investigate or make judgment calls of any kind. We get trained on observable behaviors and physical signs that are typical of abuse that we see, and then report them or run the very real risk of getting charged with a crime. Experts take over from there, and again, I'm not talking about some "Compliance Officer" within the org. Until somebody or a group of somebody's step up and take responsibility as a governing org for the whole activity, the problem is going to stay the same. That's really my only point. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Weaklefthand4ever Posted January 11, 2022 Share Posted January 11, 2022 13 minutes ago, Jeff Ream said: if i had to guess their reasons for avoiding it, it's the following: money time accountability liability I can address the first two of those as it's what I do for a living. Training cost is not as much as one night think to create materials. Instructional designers charge roughly $65 to $100 an hour to create materials. A four hour course for something like this would take roughly 100 hours of development. Maybe less as this topic has been created literally thousands of times. So figure for ID work about 10K. Upload it to an LMS with an enrollment, testing and tracking. There are companies who do this end to end. The cost for that is minimal. They pull the reports and send them back so you have a snapshot of compliance. It's not hard. I did an e-learning course on accessibility issues for designers over the summer and it took me less than 6 hours including voice over work. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rpbobcat Posted January 11, 2022 Share Posted January 11, 2022 (edited) 27 minutes ago, Jeff Ream said: for the record all of world class are members, not just the top 12 Sorry, I wasn't clear. I thought it was the top 12 corps that "controlled" the organization. Edited January 11, 2022 by rpbobcat Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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