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And the floodgates are opening


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2 hours ago, craiga said:

I think (or at least hope) that we can agree that every corps and DCI itself needs to refocus zero tolerance for bad actors and follow through on these people, as they belatedly seem to have done with SOA.  Having said that however, for our part we should not allow ourselves to devolve into nothing more than a rumor-mongering abyss. It is so easy to post on DCP (anonymously, mind you) that some staff person, director or even member from the Santa Clarita Cadets Regiment may have done this or that.  If we go down that road, it devalues the valid complaints of the actual victims and ends up with about as much credibility as the Salem Witch Trials.

sadly they seem to keep better track of who owes money

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3 minutes ago, Jeff Ream said:

but....

 

 

reading Warrens book and some of the stories alumni celebrated.....that #### wouldn't fly today

I stopped reading part way through for that reason…. Kept thinking “they’re bragging about this?”

Edited by JimF-LowBari
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the one thing i am wondering is at what point do the kids en masse across al corps go public in their demands for a change? will they go there? do they care enough?

 

honestly i am wondering if it's time for the members of today to speak up. that may be the best way to get change rolling

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5 minutes ago, Jeff Ream said:

 

honestly i am wondering if it's time for the members of today to speak up. that may be the best way to get change rolling

That’s what it’s going to take. But the flack being given by “supporters” and alumni to their current “family” members I see a corps killing lawsuit more likely.

Edited by JimF-LowBari
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41 minutes ago, Jeff Ream said:

but....

 

 

reading Warrens book and some of the stories alumni celebrated.....that #### wouldn't fly today

Of course it wouldn’t.  But the essence of what he was trying to do shouldn’t be lost on us. That was a different kind of kid back then.  Not band kids.  I was one of the first band kids in Norwood Park.  Hardly any of them could read a note of music.  I had one fellow French horn player tell me years later that he couldn’t figure out why I was there.  It was because I want to be in a drum corps.  Things were different but it kept the bulk of kids out of trouble.

Now, they have the crème de la crème of the pageantry world with far more creature comforts on the road than we ever had and equally awful #### is happening. Explain that one to me.  

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38 minutes ago, Terri Schehr said:

Of course it wouldn’t.  But the essence of what he was trying to do shouldn’t be lost on us. That was a different kind of kid back then.  Not band kids.  I was one of the first band kids in Norwood Park.  Hardly any of them could read a note of music.  I had one fellow French horn player tell me years later that he couldn’t figure out why I was there.  It was because I want to be in a drum corps.  Things were different but it kept the bulk of kids out of trouble.

Now, they have the crème de la crème of the pageantry world with far more creature comforts on the road than we ever had and equally awful #### is happening. Explain that one to me.  

It changed when people found a way to make money off the activity. The students are now the instrument for them. 

Edited by Poppycock
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3 hours ago, IllianaLancerContra said:

 

 

I'm not comfortable naming names if I don't have first-hand knowledge.

I have no first-hand knowledge but have heard rumors (the rumors a lot of us have heard).  Others will know more & may  be able to clarify.

“The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing.” - attributed to both Edmund Burke & John Stuart Mill in 18th-19th Century respectively

Understood.  However, this is what an offender relies on.  Anonymity allowing plausible denial.  And as you noted, others may know more.  But again, unless somebody says something people are left to speculate, rumors persist, accusations arise. Some rumors could be wrong and damage an inoccents reputation.  As has been seen in other public scandals, once an innocents reputation is damaged. There is no getting that back.  That is why it is so important, especially with the growing number of issues and some bad actors moving from org to org, that verifiable exposure of these people is made known.  Silence perpetuates the behaviors.  Love the quote too.  One of my favorites.

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2 minutes ago, LabMaster said:

Understood.  However, this is what an offender relies on.  Anonymity allowing plausible denial.  And as you noted, others may know more.  But again, unless somebody says something people are left to speculate, rumors persist, accusations arise. Some rumors could be wrong and damage an inoccents reputation.  As has been seen in other public scandals, once an innocents reputation is damaged. There is no getting that back.  That is why it is so important, especially with the growing number of issues and some bad actors moving from org to org, that verifiable exposure of these people is made known.  Silence perpetuates the behaviors.  Love the quote too.  One of my favorites.

For one reason or another, the individual I am thinking of has totally disappeared from the activity.  

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For those asking about kids speaking up, they are speaking up, that is why we are having these discussions. 

This is not just a drum corps problem it is a problem with all youth activities. You see similar stories in team sports, church groups, companies that employ teenagers, schools, etc. No one is immune and blowing up DCI will not make the problem go away.

Pointing out that things are better today than ten, twenty, thirty or more years ago does not diminish the pain any victim experiences. Nor does it  excuse any organizations who do not respond quickly and appropriately when an incident is reported.

What we need are corps that set and enforce zero tolerance for illegal activity. Individuals who engage inactivity that leads to their dismissal from one organization should not be allowed at another. When the rules are well defined and everyone is held accountable we will see the number of incidents reported continue to decline.

I think the vast majority are doing things right. Those who are not needs to be exposed and cut from the activity. 

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