A Modest Proposal

[craiga]

49 minutes ago, ContraFart said:

The tour is already 3-4 weeks shorter and about 10 to 15 performances fewer than it was 25 years ago. But at what point does the tour get so short that you diminish the product? How would regionalizing the tour help a corps like the Troopers? How would the activity engage in the Southeast with only one WC and one OC corps?

Whatever the solution may be, its far from simple. 

I don't know you, but I have to say that your last several posts are spot on.  Some folks seem to be using SCV's financial incompetence and internal infighting as a justification to roll back the clock 40 years.  

So, let's look at the 80's, when corps:

DID have to pay for their uniforms; they don't now. 

DID have to pay for their drums, including front ensemble; they don't now.

DID own their own buses, usually 25 year old converted city buses.  Anyone remember seeing Troopers, 27 or VK pulling into a show?

DIDN'T have professional drivers, but Uncle Al or corps dads driving uninspectable old relics with broken AC and springs.

Did feed their kids fast food or pb&j sandwiches a week at a time; they all have food kitchens now.

Did give kids SALT tablets in hot weather with not a water jug in sight.

Told them to suck it up when they were injured; now they have medical teams on tour and several vehicles to transport kids to the nearest hospital.  Heck, BAC even has an actual doctor with them all summer.

Despite looking at "real" drum corps from back then through rose colored glasses, it is clear that drum corps these days is a far better experience for the kids.

And for the record, there were plenty of props on the field in those days as well. Anyone remember 87 SCV? Bridgmen? VK?

Look, if you don't like modern drum corps,  that is your choice.  But it is disingenuous  to use SCV's downfall  to  indulge yourself on a wishful time travel fantasy. 

And, if you don't know, I am 62.

[Terri Schehr]

This place gives me a headache. 

[MikeN]

2 hours ago, craiga said:

DID have to pay for their drums, including front ensemble; they don't now.*

Only if you’re a top 15 WC corps. 😞

Mike

[Sutasaurus]

2 hours ago, craiga said:

I don't know you, but I have to say that your last several posts are spot on.  Some folks seem to be using SCV's financial incompetence and internal infighting as a justification to roll back the clock 40 years.  

So, let's look at the 80's, when corps:

DID have to pay for their uniforms; they don't now. 

DID have to pay for their drums, including front ensemble; they don't now.

DID own their own buses, usually 25 year old converted city buses.  Anyone remember seeing Troopers, 27 or VK pulling into a show?

DIDN'T have professional drivers, but Uncle Al or corps dads driving uninspectable old relics with broken AC and springs.

Did feed their kids fast food or pb&j sandwiches a week at a time; they all have food kitchens now.

Did give kids SALT tablets in hot weather with not a water jug in sight.

Told them to suck it up when they were injured; now they have medical teams on tour and several vehicles to transport kids to the nearest hospital.  Heck, BAC even has an actual doctor with them all summer.

Despite looking at "real" drum corps from back then through rose colored glasses, it is clear that drum corps these days is a far better experience for the kids.

And for the record, there were plenty of props on the field in those days as well. Anyone remember 87 SCV? Bridgmen? VK?

Look, if you don't like modern drum corps,  that is your choice.  But it is disingenuous  to use SCV's downfall  to  indulge yourself on a wishful time travel fantasy. 

And, if you don't know, I am 62.

Not buying your argument Craiga. Whatever happened internally with SCV’s organization is merely speculation on everyone’s point.

As for “costumes”…I’m not sure they are “free” nor are the drums, horns, etc. Contracts are signed to supply corps with what they need for a competitive season. It ain’t free. We don’t know the bottom line for those contracts. Do we?

What is going on with SCV now has been and is going on with many/all corps at the moment. 
Kudos for BAC if they have it nailed down financially, I question that, but, whatever. Not privy to BAC’s books.

The point here is how to make drum corps “more affordable” To me that means “less is more”. Distill the activity what it originally represents and you just may get a handle on ballooning costs.

[ContraFart]

1 hour ago, MikeN said:

Only if you’re a top 15 WC corps. 😞

Mike

Name a WC corps without a Brass and or Percussion sponsor.

Edited December 15, 2022 by ContraFart
Stupid Swype text

[ContraFart]

1 hour ago, Sutasaurus said:

Not buying your argument Craiga. Whatever happened internally with SCV’s organization is merely speculation on everyone’s point.

As for “costumes”…I’m not sure they are “free” nor are the drums, horns, etc. Contracts are signed to supply corps with what they need for a competitive season. It ain’t free. We don’t know the bottom line for those contracts. Do we?

What is going on with SCV now has been and is going on with many/all corps at the moment. 
Kudos for BAC if they have it nailed down financially, I question that, but, whatever. Not privy to BAC’s books.

The point here is how to make drum corps “more affordable” To me that means “less is more”. Distill the activity what it originally represents and you just may get a handle on ballooning costs.

SCV literally said the reason was revenue shortfall from Bingo in their statement.

Uniforms are a line item in the corps dues. Most uniforms are less than $300 per member. 

What's going on with SCV is not going on with all corps. You can look at the 990s and see that. Sure some corps are in better shape than others, but organizations like the cadets have been on thin ice for decades.

While there is a valid argument to get costs down for members, that is not the issue at hand. This is a revenue issue. The costs are relatively the same for all the WC corps. 

 

 

[2muchcoffeeman]

14 minutes ago, ContraFart said:

The costs are relatively the same for all the WC corps. 

Fuel, housing, food . . . yes (but with allowances for W Coast corps who have to cover 4 time zones).

But I'd like to see the numbers on services contracts -- program design and coordination especially. I suspect there is a wide range.
 

<snip>

Edited December 15, 2022 by 2muchcoffeeman

[jwillis35]

6 hours ago, C.Holland said:

its the only way you can guarantee coverage for all captions, while your staff has to deal with band concerts, summer band camps, development workshops, orientations, etc etc etc.   That doesnt account for the staff who ARENT band directors.  Who are using their own vacation time to be on tour.    

You're not increasing the budget for staff.  Youre spreading that budget out amongst more people so you always have someone teching on the field.   Not everyone is on the road at once.  Not everyone goes to finals.  Some will only work the camps, some will come in during a period when the rest all have a band camp at the same time.  

You are correct about this, but you have to admit that some of the staff salaries have gone way up. Mostly those of designers and caption heads. If the corps can afford it then fine, but how many have been playing the keep up for the sake of competition and not really adhering to the best interest of the corps and its future well being? I don't necessarily have an answer to that, just a question. 

[ContraFart]

23 minutes ago, 2muchcoffeeman said:

Fuel, housing, food . . . yes (but with allowances for W Coast corps who have to cover 4 time zones).

But I'd like to see the numbers on services contracts -- program design and coordination especially. I suspect there is a wide range.
 

<snip>

The differences are in name, not quantity.

[ContraFart]

14 minutes ago, jwillis35 said:

You are correct about this, but you have to admit that some of the staff salaries have gone way up. Mostly those of designers and caption heads. If the corps can afford it then fine, but how many have been playing the keep up for the sake of competition and not really adhering to the best interest of the corps and its future well being? I don't necessarily have an answer to that, just a question. 

Well to answer that, we would have to look who made the biggest staff upgrades in recent years. BAC comes to mind and from all accounts, they are fiscally healthy.