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I had this big long review typed up and ready to send,...and my computer froze,...SO, I'm going to make it short then.

First off, BDB....they were definatly the cleanest div 2 corps, so that's why they won. not really much else to it. drumline was ok, way too loud though. guard was pretty big, and dirty.

spokane thunder...it was nice seeing another northwest corps. let's see if they can't do what the other two have in the next few years! :) i actually thought they were more powerful (all around). they did have 6 guard members this year, so that was good.

fever,...the guard was definatly the cleanest div 2 guard. they were definatly the best section in the corps. nothing really stood out in their show. drums were ok, so was the brass. the grey pants were hard to deal with at times,....kinda baggy, and hard to read.

oc...this show needs a lot of work. that's all there is to it. they are big, loud, and dirty. the drill is pretty,...bad, to be frank. staging is bad with voicings and drums very often, and was the reason for a bit of phasing. the hornline was loud...still a little dirty, but good. hopefully they can win high brass in div 2...definatly an impressive hornline. the drums didn't really do anything too spectacular. the guard was,...uh....dirty. the guard work is bad, the staging is bad,...and the white uniform does not look pretty. hopefully the can fix their show, and be near the top in div 2 anyway.

scvc...this was my favorite div 2 show. the only problem with this corps was how small their hornline was. the ballad sounded pretty bad....not sure if that was the arrangements, or just the lack of members. i thought the drumline played very musically, and didn't cover up the corps like bdb, and fever did for the most part.

seattle cascades were next. this is the show that i had typed alot for,...and there is no way i'm doing that again. real quick:

-narration: bad

-props: bad. they should have used them better,....very distracting

-kites: cheezy

-drill: too compact, hard to read

-horns: okay

-drums: for the most part,...hard to notice because of staging and writing

-guard: strongest cascades guard yet. definatly the best section,...however way to bright, and distracting.

overall, i think the the show is not going to get them into the top 12. maybe 15-17. i think the members are probably the best since 2002 or 2003. they need to stick to maybe a more "traditional" type show like 2002,...or like phantom,...who was up next!

phantom...thank you for saving my night! they were wonderful...just like the past two years. the drumline was great! very tasty, demanding writing, and pretty clean for this time of year! the clear bass drum heads were interesting,...but i liked it! hornline sounded wonderful, and the arrangements were good. i don't like gershwin, so the fact that i liked this show says alot about this corps! the guard uniforms were cool, and i think they were the best phantom guard i've seen! the marching and everything was cleaner than i expected this early, to be honest,..and their scores are showing that! it will be interesting to see where they stack up with the cadets in denver this weekend! i think they will be more of competing with madison for the 4-5 spot! i hope that they could get into the top 3, but i don't think it's quite there yet. they do need to fix their ending,...it was kinda flat. they went real fast, and then slowed done, and ended standing still. i'm sure they'll fix it though! thank you phantom!

as for the show itself....it was terrible. $25 to sit on the 20 yard line! it was $40 to sit from the 30-mid field. ridiculous for only 7 corps. the website said the $25 tickets were from the 40-out,...but when we got there is was the 30! i was pretty,...frustrated. also,...UW is a terrible place for a show! the huge track put the corps WAY for away from us! they need to have it in a smaller stadium, with cheaper tickets! those poor div 2 corps had a tough time filling up that huge stadium,...especially being so far away from us!

i know i had more complaints about this show itself, but i can't remember them all now. oh well.

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I had this big long review typed up and ready to send,...and my computer froze,...SO, I'm going to make it short then.

First off, BDB....they were definatly the cleanest div 2 corps, so that's why they won.  not really much else to it.  drumline was ok, way too loud though.  guard was pretty big, and dirty.

spokane thunder...it was nice seeing another northwest corps.  let's see if they can't do what the other two have in the next few years! :)  i actually thought they were more powerful (all around).  they did have 6 guard members this year, so that was good.

fever,...the guard was definatly the cleanest div 2 guard.  they were definatly the best section in the corps.  nothing really stood out in their show.  drums were ok, so was the brass.  the grey pants were hard to deal with at times,....kinda baggy, and hard to read.

oc...this show needs a lot of work.  that's all there is to it.  they are big, loud, and dirty.  the drill is pretty,...bad, to be frank.  staging is bad with voicings and drums very often, and was the reason for a bit of phasing.  the hornline was loud...still a little dirty, but good.  hopefully they can win high brass in div 2...definatly an impressive hornline.  the drums didn't really do anything too spectacular.  the guard was,...uh....dirty.  the guard work is bad, the staging is bad,...and the white uniform does not look pretty.  hopefully the can fix their show, and be near the top in div 2 anyway. 

scvc...this was my favorite div 2 show.  the only problem with this corps was how small their hornline was.  the ballad sounded pretty bad....not sure if that was the arrangements, or just the lack of members.  i thought the drumline played very musically, and didn't cover up the corps like bdb, and fever did for the most part.

seattle cascades were next.  this is the show that i had typed alot for,...and there is no way i'm doing that again.  real quick:

-narration: bad

-props: bad.  they should have used them better,....very distracting

-kites: cheezy

-drill: too compact, hard to read

-horns: okay

-drums: for the most part,...hard to notice because of staging and writing

-guard: strongest cascades guard yet.  definatly the best section,...however way to bright, and distracting.

overall, i think the the show is not going to get them into the top 12.  maybe 15-17.  i think the members are probably the best since 2002 or 2003.  they need to stick to maybe a more "traditional" type show like 2002,...or like phantom,...who was up next!

phantom...thank you for saving my night!  they were wonderful...just like the past two years.  the drumline was great!  very tasty, demanding writing, and pretty clean for this time of year!  the clear bass drum heads were interesting,...but i liked it!  hornline sounded wonderful, and the arrangements were good.  i don't like gershwin, so the fact that i liked this show says alot about this corps! the guard uniforms were cool, and i think they were the best phantom guard i've seen!  the marching and everything was cleaner than i expected this early, to be honest,..and their scores are showing that!  it will be interesting to see where they stack up with the cadets in denver this weekend!  i think they will be more of competing with madison for the 4-5 spot!  i hope that they could get into the top 3, but i don't think it's quite there yet.  they do need to fix their ending,...it was kinda flat.  they went real fast, and then slowed done, and ended standing still.  i'm sure they'll fix it though!  thank you phantom!

as for the show itself....it was terrible.  $25 to sit on the 20 yard line!  it was $40 to sit from the 30-mid field.  ridiculous for only 7 corps.  the website said the $25 tickets were from the 40-out,...but when we got there is was the 30!  i was pretty,...frustrated.  also,...UW is a terrible place for a show!  the huge track put the corps WAY for away from us!  they need to have it in a smaller stadium, with cheaper tickets!  those poor div 2 corps had a tough time filling up that huge stadium,...especially being so far away from us! 

i know i had more complaints about this show itself, but i can't remember them all now.  oh well.

Well said. I pretty much agree with you on your points. As far as the seattle show, I just wish they would actually come here and read our reviews and actually see what it is their fans think of it rather than blindly pretending that everyone just likes it.

Nice review. Seems pretty accurate to me.

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I don't think all of their fans come here.  Probably not even a lot.  Honestly, this is one of the last places I would come to get advice for producing a show.

no but I'd say that its a pretty safe bet that if you read a review here it is from someone who generally is more than a casual fan that just happened to get invited along to a show.

I'll give you an example. My sister in law is a huge disneyland nut. She lives in Washington but every spring she flys to california and goes to disneyland. She subscribes to disney newsletters, posts on disney forums, and can even tell you which order to go on the rides to minimize you line wait time. She is truely a disneyland nut. As for me. I like Disneyland and sure I have been there before but I am not as big of a fan as her and I can't see myself participating in disneyland forums. I'd say that it is safe to say that those who participate on them are more than your average run of the mill family that happened to take a vacation there. It's people who really really enjoy disneyland. Why am I telling you this? Because I think it's the same thing here.

If you come to a drum corp forum and see 4 or 5 reviews from people who all agree on similar points about the show that are generally disliked in for out of 5 reviews (props, guard uniforms, drill is too crammed, narration bad) then it's probably a pretty safe bet that those things are not liked by a lot of other people as well.

Just like if you read all the show reviews that I think all of them complemented Blue Devils B and said that the drums rocked and the corp has a good shot at the div 2 title. I don't see people flaming that. Why? Because it is positive. You are never going to hear from ALL the fans or even MOST of the fans. What you WILL hear from is the hardcore fans or the devoted fans or the vocal fans. And that's just the fact of it. Saying that you can't listen to fan reviews because it is only the vocal minority is silly. The vocal minority is just a small representation of the majority. I think if they read these reviews, all of them, they would see a few common criticisms in them that seem to be in most of the reviews from people who took time to actually go into specifics who know what they are talking about.

Sorry for my rant but I just disagree with that one. :)

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Of course we, the Cascades Staff, read this. I will not speak on behalf of the every single person involved with the corps, but the great majority of alumni, members and staff are having a wonderful time with the show and have graciously accepted standing "O"s at every event thus far. Last year we did not attain a standing "O" until over half way through the season.

About the Narration and Props and Color and Costumes and Drill and 14 year old with a lisp: To each their own, I'm sorry about the disapproval of everything about the show. I think most can tell there is some form of animosity involved in this critique.

The Narration is sincerely wonderful and is the catalyst for the show.

The Props lead to a wonderful effect that most seem to enjoy.

The Colors are quite fun.

The Costumes are futuristic flight suits that flatter and make the guard feel great about themselves.

The Drill uses the entire field, please take note of this again and maybe compare to everyone else.

The Narrator is a 19 yr/old theatre kid from the U of W without a lisp and also an amazing percussionist.

All things do change, a recent judge told us in critique, "I'm not sure the world is ready for a Cascades quite like this." Often, enjoying drum corps styling is originally based on the competitive fashions of when most people experienced their marching (pleasing - because it is familiar.) Should we put the flags back in the holsters? Should we march tympani and keyboards again? Should we go back to bugles with no valves? Symetrical drill? All change is difficult to deal with at first, but we have grown to love and respect these ideas today.

Please don't trap drum corps in a museum, let us explore and entertain!

-kurt jull

seattle staff

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Of course we, the Cascades Staff, read this.  I will not speak on behalf of the every single person involved with the corps, but the great majority of alumni, members and staff are having a wonderful time with the show and have graciously accepted standing "O"s at every event thus far.  Last year we did not attain a standing "O" until over half way through the season.

About the Narration and Props and Color and Costumes and Drill and 14 year old with a lisp:  To each their own, I'm sorry about the disapproval of everything about the show. I think most can tell there is some form of animosity involved in this critique.

The Narration is sincerely wonderful and is the catalyst for the show.

The Props lead to a wonderful effect that most seem to enjoy.

The Colors are quite fun.

The Costumes are futuristic flight suits that flatter and make the guard feel great about themselves.

The Drill uses the entire field, please take note of this again and maybe compare to everyone else.

The Narrator is a 19 yr/old theatre kid from the U of W without a lisp and also an amazing percussionist.

All things do change, a recent judge told us in critique, "I'm not sure the world is ready for a Cascades quite like this." Often, enjoying drum corps styling is originally based on the competitive fashions of when most people experienced their marching (pleasing - because it is familiar.) Should we put the flags back in the holsters?  Should we march tympani and keyboards again? Should we go back to bugles with no valves?  Symetrical drill? All change is difficult to deal with at first, but we have grown to love and respect these ideas today.

Please don't trap drum corps in a museum, let us explore and entertain!

-kurt jull

seattle staff

First of all, for those who don't know Kurt....he's the man. He's the magic that makes it all happen. :)

Well, I have to say. I do applaud you're take on this. You are pushing the envelope and doing what few others dare to do. I guess it's just my personal opinion that I dislike it and I have to say that I think that judge nailed it head on with that comment.

Thanks for clearing up the uniforms bit as well. I had no idea that they were supposed to be futuristic flight suits. I just figured they were just to go with the neon color scheme (which I dislike but again, thats just my opinion).

Reguarding not trapping drum corps in a museum... I see your point but where do you draw the line? Woodwinds? Synthesizers? Video machines? Fog Machines? Heck, lets just pre record the corp's best standstill and play it back while they march to it. Now I know I am being a little extream or at least it seems so right now. But to me, it just seems like the "line" is getting moved out further and further and we are getting further and further away from the roots that make this activity what it is. I say we draw the line at amplification. That's my take. You disagree, but then again, where do YOU say we draw the line?

Thanks for taking the time and posting Kurt. I applaude what you do for our community. Keep it up. Hopefully our reviews have at least given some insite on what some of the fans think. Good luck this year. I wish you the best.

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Of course we, the Cascades Staff, read this.  I will not speak on behalf of the every single person involved with the corps, but the great majority of alumni, members and staff are having a wonderful time with the show and have graciously accepted standing "O"s at every event thus far.  Last year we did not attain a standing "O" until over half way through the season.

About the Narration and Props and Color and Costumes and Drill and 14 year old with a lisp:  To each their own, I'm sorry about the disapproval of everything about the show. I think most can tell there is some form of animosity involved in this critique.

The Narration is sincerely wonderful and is the catalyst for the show.

The Props lead to a wonderful effect that most seem to enjoy.

The Colors are quite fun.

The Costumes are futuristic flight suits that flatter and make the guard feel great about themselves.

The Drill uses the entire field, please take note of this again and maybe compare to everyone else.

The Narrator is a 19 yr/old theatre kid from the U of W without a lisp and also an amazing percussionist.

All things do change, a recent judge told us in critique, "I'm not sure the world is ready for a Cascades quite like this." Often, enjoying drum corps styling is originally based on the competitive fashions of when most people experienced their marching (pleasing - because it is familiar.) Should we put the flags back in the holsters?  Should we march tympani and keyboards again? Should we go back to bugles with no valves?  Symetrical drill? All change is difficult to deal with at first, but we have grown to love and respect these ideas today.

Please don't trap drum corps in a museum, let us explore and entertain!

-kurt jull

seattle staff

Well that's all fine and dandy, but the writer expressed his opinion that he mostly did not like the show. What's wrong with that ? You seem happy that the judges liked the show, and that's fine too. Why can't you continue to have a show that pleases some judges, keeps the members challenged and happy, but puts a lot of the paying fans to sleep ? The Cacades have apparently adopted a style that some judges like. Good for You. You don't seem to care that quite a few fans on here seem to dislike the Corps show this year. so I'm not getting the point of your feeling the need to come on here, and ask fans who disliked the Corps show such silly questions as should we go back to a time of " putting the flags back in the holsters " , etc. Change has not all been good, or we would still be carrying around the timpani's on the field like a kitchen sink and almost giving the kids carrying it a hernia. People came to realize that this new innovative " change " was a bad one, and scrapped it. But there is no need to get offended when a fan tells you honestly a Corps show was disliked. You see no need to change the style to fit a lot of the main stream fans. You fall squarely on the side of pleasing the judges, above all. And there is nothing wrong with that either. But not all the Corps this year have adopted this philosophy of playing to the judges, because the paying fans, ( these dummies )...well....they are just not ready for " change ". like we of the Cascades are providing this year.

Edited by Lieut. General Effect
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All things do change, a recent judge told us in critique, "I'm not sure the world is ready for a Cascades quite like this." Often, enjoying drum corps styling is originally based on the competitive fashions of when most people experienced their marching (pleasing - because it is familiar.) Should we put the flags back in the holsters?  Should we march tympani and keyboards again? Should we go back to bugles with no valves?  Symetrical drill? All change is difficult to deal with at first, but we have grown to love and respect these ideas today.

Please don't trap drum corps in a museum, let us explore and entertain!

-kurt jull

seattle staff

Really, a straw man argument at best. The addition of valves, the pit and drill all encompassed and updated the idiom as it was: brass, percussion, guard, visual. Narration does not do that... however, it is legal, and you can't be faulted for using what everyone else does. We see it with drill, show selection and other things, so this is more of the same.

Perhaps I should apply for a job at the museum. ^0^

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I will not be able to write anything without being questioned or treated as if I don't care about something or someone, so I cannot continue to write.

Is there anyone out there, a student, a co-worker or anyone who can write about my philosophy about the activity or better yet, the Cascades?

-kurt

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I will not be able to write anything without being questioned or treated as if I don't care about something or someone, so I cannot continue to write.

No, that's the give and take of debate; no one is going to agree all the time with all the personalities across the idiom; the questioning is simply part of distilling the message and bringing the debate along. Additionally, you argue with the upper hand regardless, as amplification/narration is legal....and not going away. So it's more or less a little bit of a "hypothetical in action" all across the board.

There are some hard questions that have been put to design teams on these boards and across the internet, concerning everything under the sun... from amplification to unfinished shows to financial consideration from equipment manufacturers. We hear from Mr. Fiedler and Mr. Hopkins occassionally, along with some of the II/III directors...all of us are going to have a different way of going about this...but in order to hash out on DCP where people want to go with drum corps, what they want to do with it, and how they want to get it there...well, human nature dictates some heads are going to butt.

Is there anyone out there, a student, a co-worker or anyone who can write about my philosophy about the activity or better yet, the Cascades?

-kurt

I would encourage you to respond with your own viewpoint, rather than have someone speak out-of-turn concerning your own personal views, biases and ideas conerning the idiom.

Edited by bawker
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