Drums on the Ohio 6/27

[Galen]

Some of the booing came when they announced the results. People were really stunned that the Cadets show won. Really stunned. I don't think it resonated with the fans very well. Certainly the Bluecoats (my objections aside) had a show that the fans really thought was much better.

Jim

It should also be noted that at Cadets beat Bluecoats at this same show last year (which I attended), although Blue had been closing the gap on them at each of the previous 2 or 3 shows they had competed at, and a lot of people in the stands last year were thinking (and probably hoping) that that would be the night that Bluecoats would beat Cadets (and were dissapointed when they didn't). More likely than not, people had high expecations going into the show that this night would also be "the night" based on how scores had been so far.

[spitvalve]

To the original poster I would say give many of these shows a second or third viewing before you judge....

Most fans only go to one or two shows every year.

They want to "get it" the one time they see it.

I should "get it" by just purchasing one ticket.

[nero14]

once again - you need to learn to read and get over yourself. that reviewer NEVER said anything about bluecoats ripping off madison. he said he didn't understand why they would play the same song madison played, which would make that song be played three years in a row by two different corps. he was mistaken and he acknowledged the mistake. he also never said the only reason bluecoats were doing well was because they had an easy show. he said the drill wasn't very demanding, and he's not the only one who's said that. learn to comprehend what you are reading.

actually i cant read... i dont know how i've made it this far in life...

i wish i knew what you were trying to say- actually i wish i knew what

i was typing now... it just doesnt make any sense... this is so frustrating....

stupid english language!

Edited June 29, 2006 by nero14

[MUSICandCHARACTER]

It should also be noted that at Cadets beat Bluecoats at this same show last year (which I attended), although Blue had been closing the gap on them at each of the previous 2 or 3 shows they had competed at, and a lot of people in the stands last year were thinking (and probably hoping) that that would be the night that Bluecoats would beat Cadets (and were dissapointed when they didn't). More likely than not, people had high expecations going into the show that this night would also be "the night" based on how scores had been so far.

Matt,

That might be part of it. But I really think a lot of the fans had no idea what had transpired score wise in the first few shows of the year. The lady behind me, who had been to this show for like the last 10 years, really did ask me if the scoring was fixed. She was not a rabid drum corps fan who would follow the scores day to day. She was the more typical drum corps fan who loves the activity and may only see one show a year.

This is the kind of fan DCI talks a lot about. We the hard corps fans are in the minority to this more casual fan.

She was stunned. So were some very knowledgeable fans. From a purely GE/Entertainment standpoint, the Cadet's show was vastly inferior and did not resonant with the fans (IMO). From a technical standpoint, as always from this great corps, they were excellent. According the DCI judges, this year there were no changes on the sheets, but the judges had been instructed and trained to focus more on the bigger picture. This is smart, IMO, because then the scoring will slightly edge towards more of what the fan sees.

I think the disappointment with the scoring was the fact that it was a vast disconnect with the fans in the seats.

But I do think you are on to something about expectations. I was thinking a lot about this last night. The Edinburgh Military Tattoo is an amazing event. 3 weeks of a show (not a competition) of precision military units. It was at this show in 2003 that the "Super Secret Swiss Drum Corps" (Click Here to See) first was made known to the world. I have the 2003 DVD and it is amazing to watch. But more importantly, the Edinburgh Castle is sold out for three weeks solid. It is a once in a lifetime event to see live. Something like 100 million people watch the telecast.

Why such a large audience (try HUGE audience) for a 90 minute show of military precision? People love to see precision. Many of the military units have musical attachments: drums, bugles, bagpipes. Some are highly entertaining, but precise and honoring of their units. Precision and music are very engaging.

I think the casual drum corps fan comes to see precision with music. In the days of the Bridgemen and VK, you got lots of entertainment, but the precision and music was still there. I think with the Cadets show of 2006, the yelling by the characters, the seemingly nonsensical carrying around of the risers for basically one fun maneuver, and what I would say was an "over produced" show -- was not what the fans wanted. People didn't like what Star of Indiana did sometimes. But when they played and marched, they were something. The show that won, "Roman Images", was a precision show with dramatic music.

I think the Cadets precision (which was there) was covered up by the other stuff going on in the show and therefore, was lost on the audience. IMO, to the extreme point of being annoying. So Matt, I do think you are right that there were some expectations -- but I think it was more along these lines than wanting the Bluecoats to pass The Cadets in the scoring (rooting for the underdog so to speak).

Lots and lots of props. Lots and lots of vocalizations. Characters that added little to the show from a "drum corps" standpoint. And music that was not immediately familiar to people. I think the distractions caused a disconnect and the show seemed to be about 5 people and not about the corps.

Jim

[Fan of the Arts]

Matt,

Lots and lots of props. Lots and lots of vocalizations. Characters that added little to the show from a "drum corps" standpoint. And music that was not immediately familiar to people. I think the distractions caused a disconnect and the show seemed to be about 5 people and not about the corps.

Jim

I agree :) Cadets have lots and lots of props -- I disagree with the lots and lots of vocalization; that's misleading to the audience who have not seen the Cadets. As a favor to those who may be concerned about the amped issue, I am going to see the Cadets, again, this Friday in Westminter, MD. I will actually time how much vocalization there is to the show. The characters are necessary because the show is themed Volume II. Just like a good movie -- you may have to see it more than once to catch what you didn't see in the first viewing. Just like last year, this production is well thought out and the members are getting comfortable performing it. Most of us know the Cadets know how to clean their show. I look forward to seeing their progress. Now sit back and and enjoy the show before you miss it again :)

Irving

Fan of the Arts

[MUSICandCHARACTER]

Irving,

Few get to see movies twice. Fewer still get to see drum corps shows twice.

When singing is about 25 to 30% of the show and the characters shout and talk to each other ... that is a lot of vocalization for a drum corps show. More than narration, or drum speak. So, from a drum corps standpoint, I do not think that saying there is a lot of vocalization is a misrepresentation.

Fans should see the show. Reviews are just reviews.

Jim

[X DM]

LOL.....interpretation is such a dangerous word. You believe or assume what you want. You certainly tried to make that one fit. FACT: There is plenty positive about the Cadets show. Now for some simple math: The show is about 11 1/2 minutes long; Cadets amp voices no more than three minutes and most of that is the ballad. You amp haters talk as if they sing and talk through the whole show. :)

Irving

Fan of the Arts

Oh Contraire. You can only speak for yourself on" facts " regarding "the positives "of a Corps show. How a person reacts to a Corps performance is a personal and subjective thing. If a poster says he likes everything, OR NOTHING about a Corps performance, or something in between, he or she is absolutely correct on that " fact ". You or me could disagree with his review and lack of positives that he saw, but we have no lock on " the facts " about a thing so subjective as " entertainment " value. Lots of people have walked out of theatres because they saw no positives in the movie or stage production in front of them. If pressed for " positives " perhaps they could tell us they liked the lighting, or the sound effects or what have you. But what's the point of asking that of someone walking out of the theatre ? And what's the purpose of trying to stop and tell the person exiting the theatre that he forgot to notice " the positives ". Seriously, does it really matter to him ? And if he exits the theatre, does this mean you have to as well ? Maybe you like the show. That's fine. Stay and enjoy. And tell us about it, if you like. But what's up with this badgering of reviewers telling us they think some show had little or no positives for them ?

Edited June 29, 2006 by X DM

[rut-roh]

I agree :) Cadets have lots and lots of props -- I disagree with the lots and lots of vocalization; that's misleading to the audience who have not seen the Cadets.

As a general rule, I don't go around with a stopwatch when I watch shows live, but I think it's safe to say that the 2006 Cadets have more mic'd vocals in their show than any other show in the brief history of DCI's era of amplification. By a lot. Just sayin.

[Fan of the Arts]

Irving,

Few get to see movies twice. Fewer still get to see drum corps shows twice.

When singing is about 25 to 30% of the show and the characters shout and talk to each other ... that is a lot of vocalization for a drum corps show. More than narration, or drum speak. So, from a drum corps standpoint, I do not think that saying there is a lot of vocalization is a misrepresentation.

Fans should see the show. Reviews are just reviews.

Jim

Jim

From what I've seen of people standing in line, very early, at each championships just to get their tickets early for the next year; I think more than a few people are seeing a drum corps show twice.

How would you rate BD's show last year? If you're saying Cadets show has lots and lots of vocalization; what would you say about Blue Devils show of last year?

Irving

Fan of the Arts

[rut-roh]

How would you rate BD's show last year? If you're saying Cadets show has lots and lots of vocalization; what would you say about Blue Devils show of last year?

They had a lot, too. I believe the Cadets have much more this year.

But the major difference between the two to me? The quality of the sound systems. The Blue Devils' sound system was, IMO, clear, balanced, and it was easy to understand the speaker. The Cadets on the other hand, both last year and this year (so far) seem to have the same issues with the quality of their sound system. Muddy, muffled, way out of balance, often distorted. I enjoyed the drumspeak last year for all the effect it generated, but honestly, it sounded like they were at the drive through at Burger King.