Olympics

[silvertrombone]

OK, good conversation, I'll continue. While I disagree with MadScout and rut-roh, we're being civil, which I appreciate.

According to Merriam-Webster (www.m-w.com). Not my words...

Athletics - exercises, sports, or games engaged in by athletes; the practice or principles of athletic activities

Athletes - Etymology: Middle English, from Latin athleta, from Greek athlEtEs, from athlein to contend for a prize, from athlon prize, contest; a person who is trained or skilled in exercises, sports, or games requiring physical strength, agility, or stamina

I think the reason that I began with Athletics and Athletes instead of Sport first will become clear pretty quickly.

Sport1 verb - 1 a : to amuse oneself : FROLIC <lambs sporting in the meadow> b : to engage in a sport

2 a : to mock or ridicule something b : to speak or act in jest : TRIFLE

3 [2sport] : to deviate or vary abruptly from type (as by bud variation) : MUTATE

transitive verb

1 : to display or wear usually ostentatiously : BOAST <sporting expensive new shoes>

2 [2sport] : to put forth as a sport or bud variation

Amuse? Mock? Hardly. Deviate? Wear ostentatiously? Umm, doesn't fit with the idea of uniformity.

Sport2 noun - 1 a : a source of diversion : RECREATION b : sexual play c (1) : physical activity engaged in for pleasure (2) : a particular activity (as an athletic game) so engaged in

2 a : PLEASANTRY, JEST b : often mean-spirited jesting : MOCKERY, DERISION

3 a : something tossed or driven about in or as if in play b : LAUGHINGSTOCK

4 a : SPORTSMAN b : a person considered with respect to living up to the ideals of sportsmanship <a good sport> <a poor sport> c : a companionable person

5 : an individual exhibiting a sudden deviation from type beyond the normal limits of individual variation usually as a result of mutation especially of somatic tissue

synonym see FUN

Recreation? OK. Sexual play? Yikes! Maybe on the gym floor, but that isn't the primary focus of the DC activity. Mean-spirited jesting? Only on DCP.

Something tossed or driven about in as if in play? Umm...kind of a stretch, but look at part b--laughingstock. Driven about in a humiliating manner?? Not applicable. Unless you refer to beach balls in VK's shows!

Sportsman--now there's a good term! Don't break ranks; show repect in uniform (others and your own); don't smoke in uniform; salute; etc.

Humorous take on #5--see soprano/trumpet soloists!

Sport3 adjective - of, relating to, or suitable for sports; especially : styled in a manner suitable for casual or informal wear <sport coats>

Umm, doesn't fit.

So you see why I skipped "sport" at first. It doesn't seem to fit very clearly except in a derisive context, in which case DCP fits the definition more than DC!

But athletes?

To contend for a prize? Check.

A person skilled in exercises, sports, or games requiring physical strength, agility, or stamina? Check.

There's really not a definition that I consider great for either Athletics or Sports that applies very well to drum corps. But the same could be said for several other activities with long histories in the Olympics. And excluding baseball? Or golf? Both are officially considered 'games,' by the way.

Synchronized swimming? Synchronized diving? Rythmic gymnastics? C'mon, DC has a pretty good following. And believe me, if it will draw an audience, the logistics will be alleviated REAL quick! Like I said, use the track and field stadium and you get to sell 20,000 seats times a couple of additional events in the evening during the first week when everyone is watching the pool anyway! Ticket sales speak very loudly!

[Meaghatron]

I like WGI's take on things...

"Sport of the Arts."

[madscout96]

There's really not a definition that I consider great for either Athletics or Sports that applies very well to drum corps. But the same could be said for several other activities with long histories in the Olympics. And excluding baseball? Or golf? Both are officially considered 'games,' by the way.

That's why I don't like using the dictionary to find definitions of words to which I already know the definition. And baseball, golf, and all those other sports are sports because the outcomes are decided not by subjective judging, but by objective rules. The ball dropped in the hole or it didn't. The runner touched home plate before the tag was applied or he didn't.

Synchronized swimming? Synchronized diving? Rythmic gymnastics? C'mon, DC has a pretty good following. And believe me, if it will draw an audience, the logistics will be alleviated REAL quick! Like I said, use the track and field stadium and you get to sell 20,000 seats times a couple of additional events in the evening during the first week when everyone is watching the pool anyway! Ticket sales speak very loudly!

Although I don't know for sure, I would bet that Sync swimming and sync diving and rhythmic gymnastics have way more objective judging than drum corps does. Do those athletes have to think about audience communication? Is that in the scoring criteria?

[sburstall]

I like WGI's take on things...

"Sport of the Arts."

DCI had as it's motto as "The Summer Music Games". Games signify something sportlike.

[drumcat]

The IOC dropped baseball. Snowball's chance on the sun, if it was even desirable.

[Lancerlady]

You'd be amazed at what the 27th Lancers did on the ice at the closing ceremony in 1980. Check this out from a story by a 27th Lancer alum on dci.org.

As the closing ceremonies approached, we perfected our run-through adapted to a skating rink surface, and perfected the Moses Pendleton interpretive dance piece. As the athletes gathered, they got engrossed in our run-throughs, and gave our “file” flag/rifle toss signature move a number of standing ovations. I remember asking a Finnish figure skater for his autograph (I’d seen him earlier on the TV broadcast, so I knew he spoke English), but was shocked when he asked for mine because he thought we were “Awesome!”

For the rest of the story click here:

http://www.dci.org/news/news.cfm?news_id=f...a5-1bf7cfdae33f

Pretty cool uh?

Edited May 16, 2007 by Lancerlady

[supersop]

<---------- JEALOUS!!!!!!!!!

awesome fanfare article!

[bldbrkr]

OK, enough with the figure skating references. Being a skating coach who was in corps (Crossmen) I can tell you there is a world of difference in judging systems and training (of athletes and judges). Our new judging system is more complex than ever and the amount of time an athlete spends in training is much more than anyone does in corps. Having said that, I wish corps could be in an Olympic style or true world style competition. It would require some of the things people have listed on here..LOL I can see a compulsory program...same music for everyone and same drill. Synchro skating does come close to what a corps does on the field. In our sport, music is secondary to the demonstration of skills so the similarities are more from a drill perspective.

Ok..just had to add my two cents....

John

[silvertrombone]

OK, enough with the figure skating references. Being a skating coach who was in corps (Crossmen) I can tell you there is a world of difference in judging systems and training (of athletes and judges). Our new judging system is more complex than ever and the amount of time an athlete spends in training is much more than anyone does in corps. Having said that, I wish corps could be in an Olympic style or true world style competition. It would require some of the things people have listed on here..LOL I can see a compulsory program...same music for everyone and same drill. Synchro skating does come close to what a corps does on the field. In our sport, music is secondary to the demonstration of skills so the similarities are more from a drill perspective.

Ok..just had to add my two cents....

John

Cool--thanks for chiming in! Nice to have someone with perspective in the area. Although I'm not sure about the time thing comparing skating to DC. I've never done skating (actually, there was a skating rink available at DCM in 94--I fell pretty bad!), but I know those kids get up at crazy hours in order to get ice time which is somewhat limited pretty much everywhere. Yes, they practice year-round and for many years before we see them at the Olympics. But it's also one or two people having to coordinate together. We're talking about 150 people times 8-12 hours per day times 3 +/- months.

That's a lot of hours!

Keep in mind that in order to be at the PLAYING level necessary to audition for one of the top corps these folks have been spending hours in practice rooms for YEARS. Not blasting you, just sayin'.

And having musical performance added to the competition just adds another level of skill, difficulty, etc. Unless you're that North Korean band someone was talking about that doesn't actually play! Ha-ha! But that is a consideration that must be taken into account when considering a Kristie Yamaguchi (my personal fave), Mary Lou Retton, or Sergei Fedorov--these athletes are not having to also play a musical instrument. But DC members are most definitely having to haul 30 lbs of extra equipment while basically running a 5k, regulate their breath and play Beethoven while marching, or in the case of the guard, toss stuff that if it lands in the wrong place will kill someone and destroy their instrument. (flashback to the cartoon of the Berkeley Band tuba section for some reason)

I especially like your input regarding scores--good comments. I've said at some time that it should be relatively easy to come up with some sort of judging standard and it might as well be on an International-standard, 6-point format already familiar from other sports. Compulsories? Good idea. Maybe a technical performance and an artistic performance??? Lots of ways to accomplish this.

And regarding mads comments on sport...VK always had generous usage of beach balls and I tend to remember Southwind doing the music to the movie about the all-women's baseball league. So who says there's no sport in drum corps??? :P

[bldbrkr]

Cool--thanks for chiming in! Nice to have someone with perspective in the area. Although I'm not sure about the time thing comparing skating to DC. I've never done skating (actually, there was a skating rink available at DCM in 94--I fell pretty bad!), but I know those kids get up at crazy hours in order to get ice time which is somewhat limited pretty much everywhere. Yes, they practice year-round and for many years before we see them at the Olympics. But it's also one or two people having to coordinate together. We're talking about 150 people times 8-12 hours per day times 3 +/- months.

That's a lot of hours!

Keep in mind that in order to be at the PLAYING level necessary to audition for one of the top corps these folks have been spending hours in practice rooms for YEARS. Not blasting you, just sayin'.

And having musical performance added to the competition just adds another level of skill, difficulty, etc. Unless you're that North Korean band someone was talking about that doesn't actually play! Ha-ha! But that is a consideration that must be taken into account when considering a Kristie Yamaguchi (my personal fave), Mary Lou Retton, or Sergei Fedorov--these athletes are not having to also play a musical instrument. But DC members are most definitely having to haul 30 lbs of extra equipment while basically running a 5k, regulate their breath and play Beethoven while marching, or in the case of the guard, toss stuff that if it lands in the wrong place will kill someone and destroy their instrument. (flashback to the cartoon of the Berkeley Band tuba section for some reason)

I especially like your input regarding scores--good comments. I've said at some time that it should be relatively easy to come up with some sort of judging standard and it might as well be on an International-standard, 6-point format already familiar from other sports. Compulsories? Good idea. Maybe a technical performance and an artistic performance??? Lots of ways to accomplish this.

And regarding mads comments on sport...VK always had generous usage of beach balls and I tend to remember Southwind doing the music to the movie about the all-women's baseball league. So who says there's no sport in drum corps??? :P

I agree with alot of what you said. I have to admit though, practicing my French Horn never compared to skating training. A competitive skater spends 15 to 20 hours a week on ice and at least an additional 5 to 10 hours a week in off ice training. Oh umm equipment??? one skate boot is much heavier than a soprano. Some can weigh up to 5lbs each. The fact that you reach an anaerobic threshold in skating in usually less than 30 seconds into a skating program compared to going through an entire hmm what was it.. 13 minutes? LOL I can't remember.....field show. It's sort of like comparing apples and oranges.

They just aren't the same..good bad or indifferent. Dc is Dc and skating is skating.

I loved my years in corps and they really helped my work ethic as a skater and now as a coach. Back to the original topic, there are certain criteria tha have to be met. Skating has many more members world wide than DCI. The money in skating far exceeds what there is in DCI. My parents were more than happy to send me to drumcorps, it saved them a ton of money. Feel free to ask any skating questions.

John