Aaw

Given the extremely slow birth and evolution of jazz, it makes it hard to pin down what exactly jazz is. There is no book or person that can say this is what jazz is. In my past posts I may have been a little to addiment in setting a frame for what jazz is. We obvioiusly have different criteria on what makes a piece Jazz. I'm fine with that.

No bashing here. My posts were simply meant to separate what is Jazz and what is not....Cavies have a great show this year, its kind of incorrect for people to call it Jazz though.

Something that hit me after the last post. It seems to me, that what the Cavies are playing this year is more like that of Glen Miller and groups of the like. Not in terms of style, but how they are playing it. Make no mistake about it, bands like Glen Miller's were not jazz bands. They were "white dance bands" or swing bands. Look at In the Mood. They play it like a concert band would. They had it written out every night, and would read the music. This particular tune probably hasn't changes since it was wirtten. Of course this piece sounded like jazz to most people, but because of they way that they were playing it, it wasn't. Im not even beggining to say that the Cavies don't chance the music. But if they do, its from a show design stand point. When it does change, it stays that way until the next change. In otherword its not as truely flexible and free as jazz is.

Kind of the original point..........maybe music should be more important than the visual side of things.

Of course the Duke played Jazz, orchestration of a piece has nothing to do with it. Look at how close to the original tune his arrangements are...not very. Again, thats where the word comes from....Jazzing the tune or chart. Although Duke was one of the only jazzers to acctually write down his music, it wasn't in the form that the Cavaliers have in modern notation. He would right licks on napkins on the way to the gig, give it to the player and say play this after the shout chorus or something. Most of these guys new the music becuase they learned it by route. Jazz is more than just a style, groove, or sound. Its a way to being able to play through a chart or orchestration by just knowing the form of what is to come. Call it what you want, but in mine and many other jazzers' opinions, what the Cavies are playing isn't jazz.

This is most likely due to the fact that any given bar of music canges about 20 billion times over the course of the season. In the same maner that Sinatra was never a Jazz singer, the Cavies, well I don't have to say it by now. If it walks like a duck..........its probably a person walking like a duck looking kind of silly

Sure there is jazz that is played the same evertime. I didn't say that wasn't ture. But really there is always some kind of improv in all true Jazz that. Thats where the word Jazz came from. The used to say "I'm Jazzin the tune" meaning messing with it or improving. Granted sometimes these guys like Lester Young, Louis, and others played the same solos but thats because everyone else wanted to hear the solos that were on the recordings. The solos really became institutionalized. If you want to hear real Jazz go hear a Jazz orchestra. Having said all of this, it doesn't make the stuff that the Cavies are playing bad, just not Jazz.

Well its not exactly Jazz. Jazz isn't really Jazz until there is some type of improvization. Yea, they're paying tribute the the Chicago jazz style but not really playing Jazz. Now if they could improv every night that would be cool....

First off, I would just like to appologize for my original post. After sleeping on it, and cooling down a bit, I realized that most of what I said is inacurate. 1. The judges aren't anti-phantom, and that shouldn't have been the title of this thread. 2. The Cadets' and BD's shows aren't crap. I marched a few years ago in a very competitive corps. and know first hand the effort these kids put into each show. To say that any show is crap is frankly unsupportive of the activity. 3. I have two very good friends marching in both Regiment and Cadets this year. So its nothing against the Cadets. I only wish that other corps put more of an emphasis on the music as is obvious PR does. I realize that the big picture is what is most important to dci, afterall it is worth 40% of the overall score. Here in lies my complaint. Why is the music only worth 30% compared to the 40% of GE? I guess its just my opinion that music should be valued more. 4. Having always been a HUGE Regiment fan, its just frustrating to hear all of this talk about this "being the year" and seeing how amazing it is on the field, with only close to the same results so far as in years past. Sorry to those who I offended and hopefully regiment can kick it up a few.

Check the Music total. That's what I was talking about.

Yea, your right, when I think great American music or any music for that matter, I think of Kill Bill. Maybe DCI should get back to looking for what really matters, great music played well, instead of giving points for a door on the 50.

Obviously, the judges aren't litteraly anti-regiment, but it sure seems like it. Best show they've had in years but are still being put in the average position that they've been in for the past several years, 5. There is no way that any other hornline in DCI can touch PR this year except the cleanliness of the Cavies. Cadets .2 over PR? Yea right. I think the judges also need to appreciate how truely musical PR's show is. Two pieces that are the cornerstones of American music Raphsody and American in Paris. And crap like Kill Bill and Dance Derby are being placed ahead of it? I'm sick and tired of these musically insufficient shows being scored highed than true quality. What do you guys think?

Cadets beat Phantom in Brass?? Just a few shows ago Phantom spanked the Cadets by .5 in horns. Must have been a really flat show. I also have trouble believing that the GE gap between Cadets and PR could change that much in only a few days....lame <**>

ttt

Comon Regiment! I was expecting the gap to be less than a point, not take a step backwards from a few days ago. Can anyone fill in on how Phantom's show was tonight?

Bump

I've seen a lot of people talking about PR in different topics, mostly the show scores threads. I'd just like to set one up to talk about them specifically. Great, mediocre, nothing special? What do you guys think and why?