garfieldfan80
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Posts posted by garfieldfan80
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There's a lot of talk here out west that WGI is using Fantasia's supposed "request" as an excuse themselves. I do not know directly, but from southern cali there's anger that WGI basically decided and said video is coming down and used the politically correct approach pushing it onto Fantasia's request to avoid charges of censorship, and requests for refunds. It's hard to hear people here coming down hard on Fantasia when if this is true, it's an entirely different situation. It's a great show in person and that part was probably going to be addressed anyway. I agree with a bunch of refund requests. The only way to get WGI's attention is to hit them in the wallet. Interesting that the YouTube version taken down was taken down by Adolf H. This story has holes in it already.
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Here's what I'm not buying. There are probably a lot of "first time" viewers, moms, dads, grandmas, grandpa, band boosters, kids, etc. who are seeing their first or second winter guard competition. If anyone is likely to be offended, it will be these "newbies." The people who subscribe to the Fan Network are probably MUCH more familiar with the activity. People I would consider "vets" and a slightly more educated and involved audience. A "friendly" crowd who is more likely to "get" Fantasia's show. And probably less likely to be offended.
The excuse that Fantasia is giving rings hollow. If they are truly concerned that some people might be offended, they would not have chosen that show in the first place.
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So... now that we are fully into this winterguard season, what are everyones favorite shows they've seen so far?
using the winterguardnetwork.com because i can see the shows better with more closeups and tell the work, here's my list.
Braddock - the closeup cam shows why this guard must be taken very seriously. and they are entertaining in a way the activity really needs.
CrownGuard ~ beautiful, exciting, emotional
West Broward - I like watching this new guard so fresh, coming out of nowhere. prefer watching them when you can see what they are doing
Timber Creek - powerful and very mature
Collins Hill HS ~ what a cool show, didn't like nashville version, looks incredible now.
Walled Lake HS - just great for open class, the floors are so cool.
FIU - just incredible move from class a last year. exciting, great drill, great solos
I really think the winterguardnetwork site should tell people about this very cool feature they have called 'national guards' in the menu that i think is showing you shortcuts to all the groups going to wgi.
not that anyone is that interested on this board, but TCI percussion is probably the best percussion group florida has ever had and if you guard people would check out their show sometime it is amazing. Looking forward to the boca percussion regional this weekend.
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Professionally done videos like the WGI's network and now a new network one watch guard videos, are watchable. YouTube postings of videos are such awful quality I don't know how you can compare. Between those two sites I have seen everything I have interest in, and I also prefer the times when the cameraman shows closeups of the equipment work and uniforms like on the new site. I have paid for both sites and for all you can see I'm having a hard time understanding how people don't realize that for what they give you, it is probably less than 99 cents a guard.
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RE: The original Dayton Drama
Well . . back in the '60's they would let me stroll into rock concerts covered with cameras - but not now. All such things are now licensed for a stiff fee. It's unfortunate but probably inevitable that WGI and most local circuits have eventually followed suit. I'm glad to be relieved of having to do photo chores at shows - I much prefer to just watch - but I'm a bit amused by the conflicts arising from these license agreements in the digital age. This "drama" sounds completely attributable to still photo and video licensees complaining to WGI about unlicensed still shots and video clips flooding internet and facebook sites and undercutting the sales of their licensed images. WGI relies heavily on selling video's of performances or viewing access to them for revenue and can't at all be pleased by seeing video's of regional performances showing up on YouTube (for free!) much quicker than for-pay WGI video's appear on FanNetwork. There were video's of individual group prelim performances at Dayton on internet sites by early Saturday night - not yours, of course, but produced and uploaded by proud parents unmolested by WGI officialdom - well, yet anyway.
This fuss sounds like someone highly aware and sensitive about WGI's declining video sales spotting you (or someone else that WGI staff mistook you for) in the audience and "alerting the authorities" - usually a cameraman or crew member, but given your particular equipment it might have been someone with a lot less technical knowledge. You were probably a somewhat conspicuous sitting target by taking photos of every unit and sitting through the whole show, which is quite a bit more exposed to the authorities than typical parents who only grab shots of one performance and often leave. And, given your clear unobstructed shots of the whole performance area, I suspect you were even more conspicuous sitting away from other spectators whose heads would get in the way. If you were taking notes after each performance on top of that, you might as well have had a target on your back.
I'm not making excuses for the weird behavior of meddlesome officials, just offering some plausible motives. I think that WGI is attempting the impossible - trying to maintain exclusive control of content distribution while still allowing "amateur" photography. Given the already impressive high-resolution still and video capabilities of even amateur-appearing cameras today and the almost universal behavior of parents and children posting the stuff on free internet sites, it's patently un-doable. If WGI banned all cameras (like almost all other entertainment venues) it would at least be a relatively clear and somewhat enforcible rule, and they might (slim chance) buttress their monopoly revenues for a short while (unlikely). It's possible that WGI might go to that, but ultimately I think they will only have a successful business plan by drastically chopping their prices and emulating Itunes - something like $1 for a HD guard performance video (download, not just viewing) or still photo. They would probably get a huge increase in sales volume and have a revenue stream that would GROW over time instead of shrinking.
In the meantime, other weird stuff is occurring in local circuits. Still-photo firms with exclusive licenses are complaining loudly about kids lifting proof-shot images from their websites and posting them on facebook, etc. Even if you buy legitimate prints at $7-10 a pop, you still have no right to post them anywhere because all duplication or publishing rights remain with the photographer or firm. Trying to enforce such things will ultimately be another fool's errand. The organizations and photo-firms effected do not have the political or legal clout of the huge multi-national recording industry and nobody is going to go after facebook, YouTube, etc. (who actually are large multi-national corporations) and their subscribers the way they went after low-budget music file-sharing sites and their users. The circuits and firms need to work out a different business plan, something that includes much lower prices and routing sales through the unit organizations with lots of profit incentives for them to encourage sales. Parents and kids usually want their units to make more money, but frequently have opposite feelings about their circuit and its concessionaires.
So . . . sorry you got hassled. I've been there many times and it always gets my blood boiling and ruins my day. Thanks for hanging in there and keeping up the reviews.
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I like the idea of the competing units owning the 'content' of their shows, and not the sanctioning body. I realize that would lead to the downfall of WGI, DCI, the NFL, MLB, yes and the so-called civilized world as we know it, however I'm just throwing it out there.
You can like it. It does seem fair, but it's not true, and not possible unless the attempted owner of the so called choreography copyright registers visually (such as by videotape registration) and count by count details with the correct government agencies, they can make no claims against reproduction, (someone over at the drum corps forum has covered this in depth) and there is one more big point.
If said dance company piece were to change any aspect of the production, such as a color or steps after all the trouble of registration, the new art with changes would have to be registered all over again. and with instructors changing counts so often as hourly, you can see the piece is only artistically a single entity or secure in one form until a count is changed the next day. Change a shade of a painting, and it is not protected. It's not fair, but it's the way it works.
Reproduce a sculpture in a different medium and change the size or position of a finger, and it's not protected. Put streamers on the flag of Belgium, and you have one of the most copied basic flags ever. Mr Zingales family and the 27th lancers would have appreciated all that money.
All this chat about intellectual property in regard to horns, drums, silks and banners sounds nice and fair, but it's so far from real. If a company front could have been protected, and everyone who used it after that had to pay, what a lovely thought, but not happening. If the photography or filming of that company front also required some sort of "permission" from someone, there are enough lawyers around drum corps we would have seen it.
It's the music used that requires licensing and permission. It stops there. Everytime I see flag artwork I know where the started, I wish the original designers of that art could get credit or cash. There's a reason it's not happening. Artists must register their art to be protected. I have some trademarks and art registered, that's how I know. It's easy to claim, and near impossible to actually protect. Where is the respect for these small business owners expenses to send out employees to photograph, pay for equipment, websites, marketing and customer service to even provide these services? Athletic photography at the school level owes no money to coaches or players, but frequently there may be donations. Imagine a football coach demanding a cut of the game video proceeds because he "designed the uniform".
Having said all that, the review you wrote were really good, and to have those amazing photos right there, I want to thank whoever is doing that. I don't even know how to make things have photos or links in these postings. I hope you are able to keep sharing.
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Since I thought the experience last night was so great I have nothing bad to say whatsoever, I thought I'd share. South Florida is so good this year I think I might want to even go to Dayton again. I don't know about judging and don't understand it or really care about that part, so this is just my thoughts.
Flannagan was gold. really gold. floor costumes, face paint. it was beautiful. I can't believe high school kids are this good. I think the show is about the guy who holds up the earth, and they make a live sculpture of that in the opening thats about the coolest thing. Really aggressive spinners, nailing catches. I see gold in their future, but I don't know that much.
Braddock - One of the best guards south florida has ever had. totally different than I ever saw them before, and I liked them before, especially Radiohead, and this is just even better in every way possible. I've been watching the wgi network and I haven't seen anyone better than this. and they are wearing practice clothes with maybe practice flags as well. unbelieveable. exciting and sexy, I just watched them again on the other website, they are going to shock people in every way possible.
Premonition - another amazing group. they have moveable doors they use to kind of trap the members in different places which makes their show look totally different as it goes along. very exciting, very intense. show is called obsessed, and they are very good. just watched them on the winterguardnetwork - hope that's not favoritism putting them online first so they can get more vewings. That's my only complaint about winterguardnetwork.com, those comments and stars and view counts are going to maybe offend people. The crowd went crazy for this guard so i'm sure kids can't get enough.
West Broward - where did this guard come from? They were so amazing, I don't remember ever seeing them before. I can't remember what class they were in but it was too early to be World, but that's what I was thinking. I am going to watch them again today.
I really hope I didn't offend anyone. South Florida is truly going to have an amazing showing in Dayton.
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Maybe an overage member? their scores and performance have been deleted from the WGI site. . .the recap was even changed, it's as though they never existed.
Is it WGI? or the Stepford Wives? "It's as if they never existed". Who knows where the bodies are buried
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It's wednesday already, is the WGI fan network filming WGI regionals for guard? New York, TX and Florida regionals did anyone for WGI film those this year?
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Had never even heard of this circuit before, always thought that area of guards were in the southeastern guard circuit, but I guess that shows my age.
Crown - mix of "first time I ever saw your face", perhaps the best crown ever. beautiful floor, such a beautiful show, I think I've watched it 10 times since last night.
Lassiter - always great. Wish I could see them at wgi again.
E. Coweta ~ simply amazing. beautiful two colored flag section in middle. amazing solo weapon sky-high tosses. nailed them.
Father Ryna - wish I could find these guys, after hearing so much here. sounds really great.
watching them on winterguardnetwork.com, just waiting for fannetwork so I can see texas and florida today.
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Huh. I'm not sure what that's referring to, but I don't remember them having a guard in years. I checked their circuit website to be sure. They were not at that show, nor do they have any events or scores previous to 2010. Strange...
Thanks for the recommendation. There's so much to watch out there I like reading what people say. What a cute show. The band-aid on the heart was so cool, cute. It just flowed and flowed and was over in a second. can't wait to see more
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I don't really care about all the controversy, but I'll tell you it was great to watch guards from all over the place, the video played great, much faster than some other similar sites for corps. (which I still can't live without). I even watched a few drumlines. Drums in Florida is really great, they are really world class, amazing. can't wait I see on that network site that boston and fort lauderdale groups are even going to be on there. they should have a coming on next section. Not a fan of the ratings. that's bound to upset people.
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You can subscribe to WinterGuardNetwork.com for FREE as a STANDARD MEMBER and browse through images of over 900 individual winter guard and percussion shows from all over the country with hundreds added each week.
those groups really are there to watch. At first I was just looking at all the photos, but got a short membership for $10 and saw a lot of groups. video Quality was good, fast, and it was easy to use.
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so entertaining! such a great guard for the time.
OK; spill the beans
in CGP General Discussion
Posted
How interesting that virtually no one reads anything from here anymore. These type of anonymous boards have run their course, thankfully. ZZZZZZ the 3 of you keep talking to each other