shawn craig
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Posts posted by shawn craig
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You know the saying "if it ain't broke, don't fix it"? Well, being in an outdoor stadium and changing up finals locations wasn't a broken idea so why did DCI decide it had to "fix it"? Certainly not for the fans!! There are so many other things they should have spent this time and effort to fix.
Yes, they picked some bad locations previous to moving to the Oil Can, but (other than Orlando) we typically only had to deal with the bad location once or once in a great while. Even at that, while some had shortcomings, most of the previous locations did offer superior stadiums for sound and visual enjoyment (sure Buffalo has little to offer, but that's one great stadium to watch drum corps in - same for Orlando - and I'm speaking only of the sight and sound lines). Jackson is the only stadium I can think of that offered a worse viewer (again, sight and sound lines only) experience, on average, than the Oil Can.
If I remember correctly, the Cotton Bowl in Dallas had support pillars for the upper deck that blocked or partically blocked your view if you sat up under the deck.
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except the majority of shows are outdoors
For now anyway.
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Until this year I would have said either close to where I live or cheap/good deal on seats.
After experiencing finals in Lucas Oil it's a no brainer for me; OUTSIDE!!!
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Even in the BEST place they could find horn lines sound weak. Blaming DCI for this stadium is only part of the issue.
A stadium with perfect accoustics? No. Stadiums with better accoustics then Lucas Oil, many!
I'm not blaming DCI for the problem. They didn't build the stadium. I also realize there are many other financial and logistical concerns for them to consider as well.
I also know they can't make a public statement ranting about their disappointment with the accoustics the way us fans can here on DCP.
I would simply like them to, diplomatically, admit there were some problems. Something like:
"While most aspects of the week in Indy were very good, we do have some concerns, especially concerning the sound, and will be working with Lucas stadium management to resolve our concerns."
Would that be so hard?
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Somehow, I suspect things are being addressed and will be addressed for quite some months. The powers that be don't live in a vacuum.
It would be nice if they acknowledged that instead of saying "everything was great." (Both Dan P and Dan A on the last webcast)
I don't care how many things there are to do in any given metro area, if the venue for the main event is sub-par, then it's not a good place for the event. (I can always find a park to walk in or an antique store or read a book etc.)
It doesn't do the young members justice to have their hard work and talent displayed in a venue like LOS that distorts the sound and makes their playing sound less then it really is.
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This has been said a couple times........and I guess I don't understand it.
If you are in a corps.....and have your worst performance of the season....guess what.....most (If not all) people in the crowd have no idea that you just performed your worst show of the season (And don't care).
I give standing O's at the conclusion of a corps performance. If you reached me big time.....my reaction/clapping will reflect it. If you did an ok job reaching me.....you get a polite standing O and applause.
I am a drum corps nut....I can find something in every show that I like (It might be something as simple as the way a corps hornline brings it's horns down at the end of a show).....
First I'm talking about any performance drum corps or concerts. Second, everything is relative; there are those truely great and special momentes like Phantom 08, there are those really bad ones, and a lot in between.
Certainly there are times when the performer doesn't think they did their best but it was certainly good enough to move poeple. I've learned to take comliments, thank people, and say something like "I'm glad you enjoed it." It's rather rude to contradict someone when they're giving you a compliment, especially if you don't know them.
I guess when I said I wouldn't want people to stand I mean when EVERYONE knows a specific performance was really poor.
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I clap politly for every corps. I only stand if moved to do so, be it once at the end or several times during a show.
I have been very entertained and stood for non-finalist groups many times over the years. I have also given only a slight polite golf clap to top 6 corps.
Part of being a performer is learning to take what the audience gives. As a performer I wouldn't want the crowd to stand when I know the performance was not there. It's meaningless unless truely deserved.
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It seems some of the posters look at a specific aspect of the event rather then the event overall. I tend to look at the over all experience; venue, site in relation to activities, access to hotels, getting to the site/city easily, weather, etc.
Personally looking at everything and at the last 30 some years of DCI (sorry OP), Dallas was the worst. Including taking your life in your own hands if you wanted to venture outside of the stadium. Jackson was second worst, although I know you can't control the weather, that humidity was the worst I ever experienced..... including south Florida.
I agree Lucus was a bad place to "listen" to drum corps. I loved it because it's only a 3 hour drive from me, we could walk to the venue from the hotel (didn't have to pay for parking), it was close to downtown Indy and all of its restaurants and bars and mall. The stadium was quite nice because of it being so new. You could eat off the bathroom floors.... well, maybe not literally but the whole place was pretty darn clean.
My favorate; KC was great although you had to travel a little to get to downtown. Second favorate, Denver. Again, hotels and restaurants near, etc.
I can appreciate that those other elements are important and a part of the overall experience.
However, the main event is the Championship and how the corps sound gets A LOT more weight then some other things.
For example, yes, it's nice to walk from the hotel and not have to pay parking but it would be worth it to me if the sound of the coprs was going to be greatly imporved.
Lucas Oil was new and clean and I can't complain about that aspect, However, I didn't find it exceptional, Denver was superior IMO.
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11 minutes of space chords
You would actually only need to play about 11 spacechords for a few seconds every minute or so. The echo in Lucas Oil would take care of the rest.
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So Lucas Oil Stadium was GREAT!!!
REALLY?????
I guess Dan A and Dan P havn't been reading the hundreds of emails sent to DCI in the last two weeks.
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FREEEEEDOM!!!
But at least they didn't need to amp him.
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I thought there were some clauses in the contract DCI has for a situation where the stadium (accoustics or otherwise) didn't meet DCI's expectations.
Considering how far in advance leases and contracts are made for professional venues it's probably not a choice to move it for next year at this point. But maybe it could be moved of 2011 and after. There was already one year finals have to be at another location but don't remember which year. I guesss that will be the next time I attend championships.
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Outside none!
Blasts first trumpets were painful at times coming through the mics in the second half of the show.
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What is proper technique? Is it not dependent on the style of music being played? Do you want to see orchestral snare technique in a marching battery?
Technique is just a means to an end, and hammering the keys WAS the proper technique when trying to project in a football field without the aid of amplifiers.
Exactly!
I've performed in good halls, bad halls, and outside; I've performed classical and pop music, play flute, recorders, tuba, and voice. At the very least you always have to make minor adjustments and sometime you have to make big adjustments.
Nothing, including amps, works for every situation.
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I've been in four of those venues:
College Park
Denver
Pasadena
Lucas Oil
Of those four Denver was by far the best and Lucas Oil by far the worst.
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I do find it surprising that after winning the DCI Championship in such dramatic fashion last year and being the toast of the Drum Corps world for that stunning achievement, that the Corps rookie base was at this talent level. Actually, in my opinion, it was not the members or the staff techs that resulted in their unexpected lower placement and scores this year, but the design team ( and guard ) that was most responsible for this surprising result after last years Title winning season.
I don't know stats but I believe they had a large number of age outs last year. Gregg Newell said in one thread that some were not able to return because of the economy and family money matters. Plus they added 8 members to the horn line; 72-80.
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Of y'all want proof of what I am saying about sound/performance (maturity) -- look/listen to-at vids out there from early season to present (finals week) as well as coupling that w/the journal entries by a horn member on PR's page - and even more so 'see it from the guy himself' on the FACEBOOK regiment page "VBlogs" He talsk about the hornline stressing fundamentals, rtechnique, phrasing and articulat and how they were being told to buckle down......
Daniel also mentions in one of his Vlogs how young the corps was and if I heard him right that there were only 25 vets in the hornline. If that was the case the staff and those vets did a great job of teaching 55 rookies what it takes and how to be a regiment hornline.
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That's alot of fabric. You'd need some sound baffles to line the ceiling. Who is going to pay for this? DCI? Lucas Oil? YOU? I'd love to see it, I don't think its probable. My greatest fear is opening the roof on a hot day. and with the hanging speakers and the banners.....the sunlight will create very annoying shadows on the field during daylight performances.
Several corps could donate there fly overs, back drops, and larger flags. That woud almost be enough! Then Academy and Cavies could contribute all their rope to help hang stuff up.
Seriously though, the stadium people promised there would be design elements and products in place. From what I could see they didn't deliver other than that flimsy black curtain. They need to step up and deliver to DCI and other music groups what they promised.
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I enjoyed all three shows. It was close between Troopers and Colts for sure. I give Troopers a slight edge in show design plus the horn line really sounded great!
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Phantom, at least from a music perspective. Difficult book and such a huge symphonic sound!
I loved Mandarins. I know the drum line had issues but IMO the show design was far better than Spirit or Crossmen.
I really enjoyed Madison as well. The guard was much improved over the last couple years with some great unison flag work; great brass line.
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Now I'm not a physicist, but I think opening the roof would lessen the echo and improve the acoustics overall.
Possibly, but as someone else mentioned on the "Roof" thread, the roof is so high that there still might be a lot of echo generated before the sound gets out of the stadium.
As I looked around, I saw no evidence of anything that would help the accoustics; accoustic tile, banners, wll coverings, carpet, etc. Everywhere I looked I saw glass, concrete and metal; hard surfaces that created a lot of echo. I don't know what the black curtain is made of or how thick the material is but it looked very thin and not all that absorbant and therefore not very helpful.
By the way I'm glad DCI is going to do a survery and get our feedback. I participated in the past and will gladly do so again.
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Great..... so now we're gonna get 2342432432 98934 wonderful thinkers that will complain to DCI and BEG them to open the roof next year....
...it will be 95 degrees like this year and we'll all bake inside of that oven known as Lucas Oil Stadium.
2010 rolls around and 23439483290849320489324 WONDERFUL thinkers will AGAIN write to DCI asking them to turn on the A/C!
Sometimes, it's better to not let the masses speak. Why do you think we have an electoral college pick our presidents? Cause we're not smart enough to do it ourselves.
Please don't assume you know what people are saying to DCI. I didn't mention the roof at all, only the bad accoustics.
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Today I received the same response to the email I sent.
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I was in Montreal in 81 and LOS this year. There is no comparison to the sound. LOS was terrible. I don't remember an echo problem in Olympic stadium, at least not where we were sitting.
DCI Twin Cities?
in DCI World Class Corps Discussions
Posted
That's great that it has a band hall.
I was wondering, if it rains in Indy supposedly the show can go on at LOS. But how do the corps warm up, dress, unload equipment etc. Is there any where in Lucas or the neighboring convention center for all the prep to take place?
I know there were one or two other events taking place in Indy at the convention center during championship week. Therefore, not all, if any, of the convention center would have been available.