East9900
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Posts posted by East9900
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Any idea if Shaw is bringing most of the brass staff from SCV with him?
Very impressed with the staff changes PR has made. 2020 is looking like it could be an even more competitive year. Corps like PR and Cadets getting stronger is a good thing for DCI. Not sure how far either corps will move up, but I think both will be drastically improved.
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6 hours ago, 2000Cadet said:
Was MADLY in love with this show but absolutely HATED the narration. But I was at finals live and it didn't really bother me too much then. Still love the hell out of this show.
"Hated the narration" is a massive understatement. I know I have given this show some grief, but that is ONLY because of the narration. It was completely unnecessary. Not only was it unnecessary it was overload. That corps was so extremely talented and the drill writing is fantastic. Horn line.... wow. It's a shame that when many of us look back on this show (myself included) the first thing that is remembered is how bad the narration was and not how great this corps truly was. That is a serious design flaw.
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30 minutes ago, Spatzzz said:
I don't know "Do Better" or the 5 second jazz tag with no context with the "screamers" at the end of Bridge over Troubled Waters which was worse? I could go on with more stellar programming choices in that show but why beat a dead queen, the snare drummer did a sufficient job of that the first time.
I suppose this is Cadets 2019 stuff, but I agree with that. Not sure if you heard earlier versions of the show, but the tag made a little bit more sense (and just mean a little).
The horn line used to hit the chorus strong, but instead went technical with dynamics in perhaps an effort to appease the judges. As a result, they killed an awesome moment that the fans actually liked. Then it went into a gospel feel and then went into the tag. I guess that was an effort to fix it, but it seemed to break it as it made even less sense. I thought they should have eliminated that whole tag completely after cutting it down.
I don't think anyone that is still around had much to do with that, but I could be wrong. Obviously they made pretty drastic changes so kudos to the admin for identifying the issue and not trying to put a band-aid on it and hope it just fixes itself with time.
On to 2020 and it's already killing me that we probably won't know a thing about this corps or program until next year.
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3 hours ago, HockeyDad said:
Worst of the era?
”Hold my beer.”
- Relampago
unless you consider 2009 to be before the modern era
Three words: "Heart and Soul"
If they just got rid of the dude saying "Do better" that production would have been a million times better. If removing one thing improves it, then it is far from the "worst of the era".
IMO, I'll take "Do better" dude over ANY of the narration in "This I believe". Both are garbage, but at least one is in the category of music.
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15 minutes ago, fsthnds said:
Darcie was/is the Artistic Coord. I talked with her after she was announced a year ago and my understanding was she was there to oversee costuming and set design. Basically be the color coordinator for the production. It just seems everyone wants to blame/question her on all their 2019 staging/music/drill problems.
I think many (myself included) are doing just that. Most of us are probably giving her too much credit for the failures of last year. I do know the steps were mostly her design and they were one of the highlights of the season- they did look incredible. The uniform was hit/miss for me (initial look was a hit, but the hats/open jacket look were misses IMO) but certainly wasn't the reason the show didn't work.
She probably had little to no say as to the drill aside from what she had referred to in an interview (wanted it to be to Cadets standards- fast and frenetic .. not her exact words). Unfortunately the drill design was incredibly poor and they tried to fix it but it was too late. I do blame the design team for not having the thought that perhaps they knew what they were already getting.
I think Drew had a lot of say into the overall design of the show since he had a lot to say in the interviews in regards to the design. He is no longer there so we will see what Darcie will do with the new team.
There is something she said in interviews to consider : They had design talks about what they wanted to keep with The Cadets and what they didn't. I have gotta think since there's a new design team that these ideas will be talked about again and since the team is considerably different there's the possibility the things they want to keep will be much different than the previous team.
I just hope they don't stick to the idea that they need a story to make a good drum corps show. I hope it's more of a concept than a story that they can build off of and create drum corps moments that are exciting and make the crowd want to stand up and cheer, which is something last year was severely lacking.
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2 hours ago, MikeRapp said:The continual drama around Cadets is for me, at best, tiresome. I rarely even visited the Cadets thread for the past 18 months. It just seems like it’s been forever since non-Cadets loyalists were cheering them on, due to a variety of factors.
The Cadets show concepts have sucked for so long.
Drama on DCP... absolutely. Drama outside of DCP..... not so much. If you are referring to the GH drama, that isn't the fault of The Cadets, but they are certainly having to deal with the aftermath and hopefully the darkest days are behind us.
In regards to the shows, shows under GH were pretty rough. Marching in 99 and 00 I got to see first hand complete opposite sides of the spectrum. I saw when it went terribly wrong and I saw when it went incredibly right. In my opinion he went overboard in regards to narration.
Angels and Demons was incredible and I actually liked Side By Side as well as Power of 10. There were some very cringeworthy shows, but those performers performed the hell out of those shows. Say what you want about the show concepts, but those shows were competing for championships.
Top 5 placements since 2001
2001-Juxtaposition tied for 2nd
2002-American Revival- 3rd
2003-Our Favorite Things- 3rd
2004-Jethro Tull- 4th
2005-The Zone- 1st
2006- Vol 2 Through the Looking Glass- 5th
2007- This I Believe- 2nd
2008 ..and the pursuit of happiness- 5th
2009 West Side Story 3rd
2010 Toy SOULdier 5th
2011 Angels and Demons 1st
2012 12.25 4th
2013 Side x Side 3rd
2014 Promise: An American Portrait 3rd
2015 Power of Ten 4th
You can call these shows garbage all you want, but they were constantly placing in the Top 5. I'm not saying I liked these shows, but people are talking like The Cadets have been irrelevant for decades. That's just not true. Dislike the shows all you want, but there's no denying the fact that prior to 2016 The Cadets were a perennial Top 5 corps. You may not like some of those shows, but some of the most disliked shows were in contention for a title. Some corps would die to have the kind of run The Cadets had.
There is also no denying the fact that The Cadets have had a rough time since 2016 with some pretty poor conceived shows. I'm willing to give 2018 a pass due to the amount of stuff that was happening as well as the design team truly had to do the best they could with the short time they had. 2019- I really thought would be the year things changed, but hopefully this year will be the one that will turn it around. It isn't going to happen overnight, but hopefully this year will be the year we can look back as the year The Cadets became a threat again. It certainly looks like a very strong team and hopefully they can bring in the performers to make it happen.
Cautiously optimistic at this point, but optimistic nevertheless.
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12 minutes ago, 2000Cadet said:
I just got nightmares from hearing Jon Bilby's voice on that recording (I got yelled at a lot during my first year lol).
You aren't the only one! I think I got yelled at a lot both years!
I can still hear him yelling at me to "Check the shape!"
So much respect for him and very happy for him. IMO he truly is the epitome of what a Cadet should be.
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I actually like the additions. I wanted change, even if that change meant bringing in previous staff members. But I didn't feel like they were just bringing in old Cadets to bring in old Cadets. Those that they brought in were successful and don't appear to be done any time soon.
Very happy to have Jay back. Such a good guy and one hell of an arranger.
Happy to see Jeff's name, but a bit bummed he isn't going to be a drill writer, just a consultant. At the same time perhaps that's for the better. I have an incredible amount of respect for Bilby and look forward to seeing what he can do when he's being used at his full capacity. He did his best last year to fix the mess but there was only so much he could do. I think the corps is in good hands and will only be better having Saktig helping out.
Brass staff is one I felt like really needed an overhaul and I like the direction. I really like Whitlock and Stratton. Both really know their stuff and hopefully can bring in a staff that will elevate the hornline.
I'm glad they didn't mess with the drum line staff. The success they had should bring in even more talent.
Guard needed the most help in my opinion and so glad April is coming back. I didn't know if she really wanted to come back but so glad she is. She really is the reason the guard was such a force for a long time. I expect them to be the most improved part of the corps.
Lastly.. design. Not too much of a fan of bringing back Darcie, BUT she has a completely different team around her. I think that's a good thing, Hopefully these new minds can all work together to create a much better product. The fact that they cleaned house so drastically but she is still around speaks to me that there was way more going on behind the scenes than we were probably led to believe. Perhaps her vision for the show was changed by the others that were there.
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1 hour ago, MusicManNJ said:
And they do not have a bumper crop of C2 members to draw from any longer.
You say it like The Cadets were incredibly successful because they had C2 as a feeder corps. The Cadets had more championships without C2 than they did with C2. Any correlation? Probably not, but its not like they are in new territory.
They will get members just like most of the other corps.. through advertising and camps. They will be just fine.
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I heard there's a box turtle fighting ring in the back room.
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Could anyone please explain why this rule exists? Originally I was thinking it was there so corps aren't poaching other staff members so soon, but it doesn't seem like that is the case since there are rumors out there of firings and hiring new staffs already.
Corps members should be the focus here and it seems like the sooner corps members are aware of these things, they better off they are in making a decision that fits their best interest. Most corps members are fairly loyal, but I'm sure there are plenty that want to be taught by certain staff members.
I wonder how many will actually make an announcement after the time limit has been lifted. I would think corps would want that news out there as soon as possible to add excitement and give enough time for the news to get out before camps start and build those numbers.
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1 hour ago, FTNK said:
Where are the young new instructors? How many people in top spots for design are under 40? 30? Drum corps seems to recycle a lot of the same people from the last 3-4 decades....
I think there's a reason there aren't a lot of young guys in the top corps... experience. If you were a CEO for a big company, would you hire a guy that just started that seems to have the goods, or would you go with the guy that has proven success and the experience to back it up? Plus those people at the top are at the top for a reason. Most likely those spots won't open up unless that person is either going elsewhere, doesn't want to do it anymore, or is no longer wanted.
I believe those under 40 and 30 in world class corps are probably on the staff as a technician. When I marched with The Cadets there were people that were teaching that had only aged out a year or two prior. But were they heads of the staff? Absolutely not, nor should they have been.
I would say that if you looked past the top 12 and into open class, I'm sure you would find the staffs and those running them are either young or young to teaching in the activity. That is not to say that experienced instructors aren't teaching the lower ranked corps.
To protect the anonymity of a friend, I know a guy that is an assistant head caption of a Top corps in DCI. He is in his upper 30s but has been working with drum corps and music education for years. He has worked with several corps, including his alma mater I believe since he aged out. It was not an easy road for him to get where he is, but he is incredibly deserving and I feel that he will probably be the head caption instructor of a corps somewhere soon if he wants it.
My point is that I don't think that staffs recycle as much as it appears, because we all know about the people that are being recycled. There are plenty of other people that are grinding and working their way up through the ranks. Sometimes that takes a lot of time, but there's a reason. Teaching a top drum and bugle corps is incredibly difficult. I have a load of respect for those that have the talent to do so.
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5 minutes ago, 2000Cadet said:
I loved Wayne Dillon. He worked specifically with the trumpets. I would love to see Jeff come back. All I want is some great talent to get Cadets back to being competitive. And by "competitive," I mean win Championship #11.
Oh yes. I went there.
OMG you are 100% right. For some reason I connected that name to someone completely different and feel pretty #### stupid right about now. Wayne was awesome! He was a great guy and really enjoyed when he was working with us.
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34 minutes ago, Glenn426 said:
So Just speculation here; I haven't heard anything from anyone inside or outside the organization.
But looking at the available "Free Agents" out in the field who would be a big name that could move the needle.. Some names that come to mind;
Donnie Van Doren, History with Garfield in the 80's and was part of the Star, Blast, and Crown in the early years of their rise into the top Ranks of Brass performance.. HE has history with Denise as they wehere around the Corps at the same time, And I would imagine know each other and are friends..
Wayne Dillon - Currently one of DCI's Top Judges had previous involvement with the Cadets and Boston as a Brass Caption head. He has in depth knowledge of what it takes to have strong Modern day Brass line.
Those are two that have history with the Corps that I Think could move the needle in Recruitment..
As for the visual, I have said for a couple of Months now that Jeff Sacktig's return back to Cadets would make the most sense for Everyone at the Cadets.. His Geometric mastery and Sheer speed have been the staple of the Cadets for nearly three decades.. Crown enjoyed his brilliance this past season and while the Crownies initially snarled at his drill it came to bear fruit in the GE and Visual Captions later in the season.. While he is not a "Free Agent" per say, I doubt he's in a contract with Crown that would not allow him to move where he pleases... Especially with how nice and gracious Jeff has been with Crown.
IF he is not drawn away then another recent Drill writer with some success is Marc Sylvester.. Sully comes with a full Sully package but he has shown himself to be capable of producing a worthy product for the Cadets and is a known commodity..
With Jeff, I think now Comes Rick Subel.. Their collaboration at Paramount has been amazing for both and have elevated both to new heights especially in Jeff's Guard staging.. If Jeff moves It would be hard for me to imagine Rick not going with him as well..
IF Rick doesn't come along with Jeff or if Jeff doesn't move, Then for the Guard a good match up would be the staff responsible for AMP Winterguard.. Matt Hurley and Louis Hellinger They have assume the top guard position in NJ after the departure of the staff from Alter Ego last year and would have a strong local connection to NJ and Southeast PA which are prime recruiting areas for The Cadets..
Again not Rumors, Just Educated Speculation for possible staff acquisitions that would make an immediate impact..
I think Saktig makes a lot of sense. He clearly still loves The Cadets, but I don't know if he would really want to leave his job at Crown. He seemed really happy to be there. Then again, a lot has changed with The Cadets so perhaps the things that he was told was enough to bring him back. They definitely need him and that might be enough.
Dillon was with our staff for a little while in 2000, but didn't get to work with him a lot. I know this won't happen, but I'd love to see Matt Harloff come back to The Cadets. Donnie has obviously worked with them a lot over the years but I think it would probably be more likely that someone trained under Donnie would come back as opposed to Donnie himself.
I do think we will find out about the staff sooner rather than later. If it is a good staff, I would think they would want to announce that before the camps to get more talent and build excitement. The later they wait, the less of an impact it will make.
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11 hours ago, jonwoody said:
I remember hearing when GH was still here that Tom was being groomed as the next Director.
If indeed true, why didn't Aungst become Director once GH was gone? He was with the corps at the time and they needed a director. That's the one thing that makes me a bit skeptical of the rumor that Aungst is going to be the next Director.
As for Scott, I don't really know much about him. Why is he no longer the director? Was it intended to be temporary?
Lastly, I would have no problems with Aungst as Director. When I was marching, I always had the feeling he was the #2 guy. He was usually running ensembles and certainly knows what he's talking about. He was a good guy based on the interactions I had with him.
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14 hours ago, DCIKnowItAll said:
Two rumors heard following DCI this weekend:
1. That everyone is gone from cadets..including current director. (This doesn’t make much sense, but is what it is) Bonfiglio taking over and bringing in new design staff.
2. Everyone gone with the exception of the Percussion staff. This also has Aungst assuming corps director role.
Wow, that's crazy if true. I'm okay with that decision because it shows that they are aware changes need to be made. I would prefer option #2 because Aungst knows his stuff and why let go of the strongest part of the corps and essentially start over?
I just hope Bonfiglio has a plan or already has a short list of candidates. Worst case scenario is the people Bonfiglio wants don't want to be part of the staff and we're back to square one. A very risky move that could pay off or put The Cadets in an even deeper spiral.
For what it's worth, I also heard this rumor from someone I know fairly well and doesn't tend to spread rumors. It could be a rumor but there's certainly a lot of smoke at this point.
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If they are hurting financially, how on earth are they able to offer free camps?
Did a donor step up or is it something else?
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I would think we would hear about changes sooner rather than later. They started advertising for 2020 before 2019 was even finished and that doesn't come across to be as them wanting to take their time. I think they would like to lock in their staff fairly quickly and hopefully make some big hires. No fees for camps is pretty incredible, but bringing a better staff will really help build some excitement and hopefully some more talent.
While I would love to see Saktig back I don't think it'll happen. I just hope that whomever they choose is someone that can write complex drill. I am probably of the few that believe that a show can still be successful with good drill instead of staging. People like visual wow moments, and staging doesn't do that as much as awesome drill can. There's no doubt that staging is currently winning, but I don't think its THE reason. I think a great show idea with drill can still win, but it needs to be a balance. It's also a way to stand out. When I was marching one of the reasons I wanted to be in The Cadets was to do awesome drill. I don't see why they need to lose that identity, but they do need to regain it. Hopefully they can bring someone in that can bring that level of excitement and complexity back.
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Not getting my hopes up this time. There had better be significant changes. 9th place is not acceptable and they shouldn't behave like it is.
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38 minutes ago, Tony L. said:
Seems to me the flaw in this year's show is that it is not artistically coherent. Things happen and they just do not make any sense collectively. The performers are doing all they can, but honestly if this show was being done by a corps in the group just out of finals, they woud be lucky if they made top 17 or so.
At this point it is simple: enjoy what you can about the show and the performances and work on things next year.
I agree with that. The corps members are busting their tails out there, but they were not given moments that make the crowd want to stand up and cheer.
There's something that this design team did that really makes me feel like they don't get it. Early in the season, they actually had a really great moment in BOTW when the entire horn line came in strong. Instead of feeding on that, they took that moment away and catered to the judging panels by throwing in multiple dynamic changes. As a result, they absolutely ruined that moment in the show. For the "story" the original version seemed to fit as well as it felt like a huge moment for the character. Changing the music also changed the moment and ruined that as well.
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8 minutes ago, jwillis35 said:
I agree with you. They do need someone to write drill who actually stays on board for the summer and can make changes. But I also agree with your last comment. I, too, am not ready for them to make wholesale house cleaning changes. They have other things to deal with. Things that are financial, including things like rebuilding their youth offerings and perhaps re-branding their identity (YEA, etc.). Their are lawsuits to deal with, etc. I applaud that they wanted to honor and respect women with this show, but that is a tough thing to put on the field. They took it too far and were too literal with the theme. Hopefully they learned their lesson and from here on out do fun shows.
I totally agree. I also think this staff may be wanting to put too much of an emphasis on a story instead of entertaining. Coming from a Cadets alum, I really wish they would get away from the preachy messages. As a drum corps fan, I like drum corps to give me an escape from real life and just entertain me. THAT is what I want my Cadets to be. A corps that puts out an exciting product that makes me want to smile, stand up and cheer and forget about real life if only for a few minutes. I don't think that's asking too much.
Some of my favorite shows of all time had zero story line but made me feel something.
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Darcie did an interview early in the season talking about things they wanted and did not want.
Two things stood out: 1. Wanted an engaging show with emotion and a story. 2. Wanted fast paced drill (not her exact words btw)
Neither of those visions happened. The show's story is hard to follow and many people just don't get it. Plus there are very few moments that make the crowd want to stand up and cheer.
A lot of this has to do with the decision to fire the drill writer. Obviously it's hard to achieve #2 and I'm sure it also played a role into #1. While it had a huge impact on the end product, I still put a large chunk of the blame on the design staff. They knew what they were getting from him. They took a risk by expecting something out of him he had yet to do. They should have gotten rid of him in the fall. Was there literally no other option? I think not.
As for the percussion/brass performances: Drumline is a non issue, so that's good. Brass is totally different. Book is not inspiring, but I don't see that as big of an issue as I do the execution. There are technical issues that have not improved not to mention musicality and phrasing. Either 1. the members aren't good enough or 2. the brass staff isn't good enough to identify the issues or fix them, or 3. There is a disconnect between what the staff wants and the brass members understanding what they are being taught or why they are being taught in the way they are.
Regardless of reason, ultimately the blame has to be placed on the staff. I believe a good staff will elevate the performers no matter how good/bad they are. This staff for whatever reason isn't getting it done. You can blame it on the writing, but the performance of the writing isn't even close to being flawless. If they were executing the music at a higher level, then I would probably put far more blame on the writing.
I won't speak of the guard because I don't know even close to enough. All I will say is that the drill design probably hurt them the most. I don't know if I can say the staff is the issue or the writing is the issue.
The reflection on this season needs to be serious and change has to come in some areas. Drill absolutely needs a world class makeover. Design staff doesn't need to be fired, but they seriously need to look in the mirror and get a better product on the field for these members. Brass staff needs some change as well, but I am not ready to say they need to clean house... at least not yet.
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1 minute ago, Terri Schehr said:
I was painfully loyal. It would have been easy to have driven a little further up I-90 to Rockford but I stayed in Schaumburg.
I used to take offense to it, but I really don't any more. To some people, loyalty isn't a value that they hold to them. It doesn't make them bad people or anything, it just doesn't mean as much. In '99, a lot of people joined The Cadets for one reason and one reason only: they won the year before. I think that's what added to some of the anger in '99. We weren't in the run for the title and some people just couldn't accept it.
Going back to the previous discussion, I believe there was a trumpet player in '99 that left in the middle of the summer and she joined BD that same summer. I don't think we found out about it until we saw her in a BD uniform later that summer. Moving from one corps to another in different seasons is one thing. Doing that during the same summer I take issue with.
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4 minutes ago, 2000Cadet said:
Actually, you're right. It was SCV. And I have no idea who you are and that we even marched together.
Yea ya do. 😉
Cadets 2020
in DCI World Class Corps Discussions
Posted
I think there are right times and wrong times to do a throwback show. I truly feel 2020 is not one of those times. They really need to do something that looks forward next year and not backwards. Time to innovate. I really want to see something new and pushes the envelope. Bringing back a classic show is nice, but has been done a LOT from The Cadets.
As far as encores go, I am okay with them playing something from the past. There's nothing wrong with that, although whatever it is needs to be exciting. The Cadets need to market themselves and make them a group that fans want to follow and kids want to join. We know what they can be, but a lot of younger fans see them for what they have been these last few years.