gellio
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Posts posted by gellio
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Well, maybe this is a good thing. Their just not my favorite corps anymore. IMO, Vanguard has lost their way since 2001, getting it back briefly in 2004 and 2005. I would rather them march 2005 and place 8th every year, then do what they've been doing since. The visual was great in '08, but to me their shows have just lacked the Vanguard power, grace and emotion that was dominant in their past. There is so much great classical music out there - it boggles my mind why Vanguard has choosen (by and large) to play the music that has sucked the passion right out of classical music.
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I only loved two shows this year - Regiment and Crown.
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I know that I have judged guards who pleasantly surprised me, and as such I bumped their score probably more than I should have. Conversely, other guards who I expected to be good may have had a slightly off day/night, and so I dropped their score probably more than I should have. It happens.
It happens? I realize judges are human - but WOW! I thought judges were supposed to be unbiased and capable of evaluating a performance based on it's merits alone. I'm not ragging on you, but I think this shows that it's impossible to remove bias or preconceived notions from drum corps judging.
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The scores of the 12th, and often the 10th and 11th place corps, almost always go down finals night. As others have said it's about rank and placement, not an actual score. With fewer corps performing on Saturday night the scores tend to spread out; the lower ranking corps scores go down, the middle ranking corps scores stay about the same, and the top ranked corps scores go up.
Don't you all see how this illustrates just how flawed the current system is? Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't their some purpose in giving a corps a certain score? I mean, if you get a 9.5, isn't there some type of reasoning behind a 9.5 - i.e. achieving a performance level worthy of some criteria required to get a 9.5? I've always been confused about this, because you should score in relation to every other corps based on performance level and I assume a set of criteria needed to achieve a certainly level of a score. Are we really to believe that the lower corps always have worse shows, the middle the same, and only the top corps improve? I guess what I'm asking is, is there a certainly level a corps has to achieve to say earn a 9.5 in brass?
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Yes, but in those tie years, Phantom and Santa Clara also broke in with a win, too. So we're talking in technicalities here, but I do see the point. This is the first time since Star in '91 that a corps outside of those three has won the title outright.
Sweetie, are you drunk? :) Come on now, try to comprehend when you read :)
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MY personal preference would be a full bore, no holds barred version of 1812
I can just hear the low brass already LOL
Please no! I'm so sick of 1812. Even Tchaikovsky himself called it bombastic, and I'd agree. I'd love to see them do a show will all music coming from Swan Lake or The Sleeping Beauty. Symphony No. 2 "Little Russian" would be even better!
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Symphonie Fantastique
I'd LOVE that. 1985 was always my favorite Regiment show - until this year :)
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I know this is off topic, but I'm hoping someone here would know where Elsa is? I am a huge Wagner fan, but more so the later works (Ring, Tristan, Parsifal and Meistersinger). I have all his works on CD, but have hardly ever listened to Lohengrin -it's the one I've neglected the most. I am listening to it now, as I want to hear it and find Elsa's Procession to the Cathedral. I have the Solti recording with the Vienna Philharmonic, Norman and Domingo. Does anyone know where on this recording Elsa's Procession is? Or, does anyone know the German titling, so I can look for it?
Much appreciated.
P.S. I'm suing Phantom Regiment when I go deaf from listening to their QF ADP at ear-searing volume :) Is there any other way to listen to that opening?
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I also would like to know WHEN in the 75 year history of this corps did this happen. UNBELIEVEABLE
Members of this corps have ALWAYS been a class act !!!!!!!!!!!
Agreed. As much as I disagree with Hopkins' policies, the Cadets have ALWAYS been one of the classiest corps on the field.
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I hate ties as much as the next person, but coming within .025 of a title? That's virtually a tie IMO. What if the difference was .001? See what I'm getting at?
When you are talking about timed races (track, swim, auto, dragster) .025 can be considerable. When you are talking about artistic differences, not so much.
Everyone is talking about how great the 2008 season was. If there had been a tie, would that have diminished it? Do you think people would have booed last night?
I loved PR this year and thought they deserved the title (amazing horns and drums). But it seems a shame that BD lost on the last day (repeat of 1988 season almost).
There may have been a tie in overall score, but an outright winner would have been declared based on ordinals.
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In a word... No.
Todays drum corps is completely different to back then (when I marched). In my humble opinion THAT Vanguard corps would place somewhere around 10th this year. It's not that they weren't good, it's just that the activity has evolved so much since then. I was a lead baritone player for a Top 12 corps but I am not so sure I would even MAKE a hornline by todays standards.
I think when we look back on corps we should appreciate them for whet they were in their era. The 1989 Santa Clara Vanguard was a fantastic corps for 1989. They were the top of the heap. I loved their show then and still do now. But i dont think they would won now anymore than the 1979 Blue Devils would have won in 1989, Different eras, different standards.
Disagree. That show would place no where near 10th place today. Maybe 5th this year, but no where near 10th. Drum corps has not evolved THAT much since 1989. When you look at the differences from 1979 to 1982, it's extremely more advanced than 1982 to 2008.
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I didn't even think they should have won that year. They were very good (although I never really liked corps repeating entire shows), but Phantom's "New World" show was fantastic.
They didn't repeat the entire show from 1988. It was quite different. Furthermore, no returning member from 1988 marched the same drill or played the same book. Every member of that 1989 corps learned and marched a whole new show, just like everyone else in every other corps. Maybe they had an advantage from a design standpoint, but as far as the members concerned, they marched a new show.
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1. Des Plaines Vanguard
2. Holy Name Garfield Cadets of Bergen County sponsored by YEA and God Himself
3. Muchachos
4. 27th Lancers
5. Magic of Orlando
6. Kiwanis Kavaliers
7. Argonne Rebels
8. Mars Galaxians
9. Phantom Regiment
10. Tokyo Mega Super Cool Hyper Corps Yeah!
11. The Cavaliers
12. Kilties
13. Madison Scouts
Oh, no ones every posted something like this before. You're really original and funny.
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And this one kind of predates me but the fledgling Spirit of Atlanta went from like 21st in 1976 to 6th in 1977. People that heard that corps said they were incredibly loud.
You're close - Spirit's first competitive season was 1977 (they weren't fledgling, they were new) and they finished 21st. In their 2nd season (1978) they finished 6th.
Congratulations Blue Stars. I think this may be the first time in their history that they have broken 90.
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Congratulations 2008 Phantom Regiment. I was trying to follow BD's blog and it went out. I kept hitting refresh on dci.org, but that was failing too. I went to soundmachine.org and saw someone posted to the scores. I almost flipped out - are these real? Then, they popped up at dci.org. I just have to say I am thrilled and so excited for this organization. What a way to end the Cavies streak of 11 years of not losing to Regiment - by winning the DCI Title. I am thrilled and so happy. Congratulations Regiment - may this be your first (solo) title of many.
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I'm so happy tonight!
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It isn't that I have anything against Phantom, but I honestly feel like their scores alot of years HAVE been a gift. There is now way in 2005 they should have had 3rd with that show. I was there live, and have watched it on video over 20 times. It was not a 3rd place show. There were at least 2 corps that should have beat them that year that didn't.
2006, there is no way that Faust was better than Godfather Part Blue. Sorry, it just wasn't.
2007 I probably would have had SCV a little ahead of Phantom, but the scores in 4th through 7th were so close that I can see any of those 4 corps placing in any of the 4 spots that year.
This year, I know the audience really likes Phantom's Spartucus show, but it is definitely NOT better than Cavaliers. In 2007 I thought musically Phantom did have a better musical show than Cavies(which is rare), but in pure execution, Cavaliers were so much better. Same with this year. I can't understand how Phantom Guard is scoring anywhere near Crown, let alone beating them. There is obviously a push to get Phantom another ring, deserved or not(my opinion, that show is NOT worthy of a ring). However, even if it comes in 3rd or 4th(which it should), that doesn't mean people shouldn't like it any less. I personally think it is a great show, just not a top 2 show. Both Cavaliers and Blue Devils have what I would call championship shows. Great execution, great muscial and visual programs. It is also close, but I would put Crown ahead of Phantom in every category except drums. Colorguard to Crown by at least half a point.
So, in what I have seen so far this week, I wouldn't be surprised to see Phantom win outright tonight. I probably won't agree with the decision. But as someone who has formerly judged many events, I have totally given up on the DCI judging community. I have to say I think it is as rigged as American Idol.
Disagree. 2005 was absolutely a 3rd place show, and IMO 2006 was a championship caliber show! They and the Cavies were so close in final scores it's impossible to argue, and it would be impossible to argue had Phantom won that year as well.
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Yep, DT has had a problem with 'Coats, and no one knows why. Consistently has dumped them, even in strong guard years for Bluecoats. (Not that this year isn't strong, but they have had stronger guards).
They have had stronger guards, but there's no way this is a 12th place guard.
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Debbit Torchia judged last evening. Every time she has judged the Bluecoats guard this season, their score drops and then rises at the next show when someone else is judging For Example
Murfreesboro 17.5
Atlanta 16.5 (DT Judging)
Centerville (17.6)
Columbus 17.8
Allentown 17.3 (DT Judging)
Buffalo 17.9
Quarter Finals 18.5
Semi Finals 17.6 (DT Judging)
Finals ?????
Yah, I am a homer but such consistent inconsistency doesn't seem right especially a difference of of .9 finals week and a drop from 7th in guard to 12th in guard. from quarters to semis. If I were a betting man I would bet their guard score goes right back up tonight. . Go Blooooo and Go Bloooo Guard!
I agree - she is a BAD judge. I was worried she was going to knock Madison out of finals too, and she almost did!
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I am including you as a reference on my resume.
Thanks for letting me off the hook.
And Congrats.
Nothin' to be off the hook for. I was just giving you ####. I mean, so what if you liked XMen better? The Scouts aren't my favorite this year either - goes to Phantom and Crown for sure. My usual favorite SCV, isn't even up there on my list this year.
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I am including you as a reference on my resume.
Thanks for letting me off the hook.
And Congrats.
Nothin' to be off the hook for. I was just giving you ####. I mean, so what if you liked XMen better? The Scouts aren't my favorite this year either - goes to Phantom and Crown for sure. My usual favorite SCV, isn't even up there on my list this year.
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It's no different than thinking everything they do is amazing and if they don't score well the judges screwed them.
Where have I said the judges screwed them? Where have I praised everything they do? Obviously, theirs is not the best show in DCI, but it's a lot better than last year. I'm thrilled. In fact, I think the only corps I've praised this year are Phantom and Crown.....and I'm thrilled for LaCrosse too.
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..."Scouts fan can't agree, and can't watch it again".
Clarification: "Can't watch it again" looks kinda ugly on it's face. What I meant was....I can't watch it again for comparison's sake to see if I got it right or wrong.
Point taken: The thread in itself is not real productive now that I see it developing. Kind of the slippery slope.
Maybe the moderators will pull it. (I have no problem with that) Honesty meet sarcasm meet apology.
Apologies to the Men of Madison.
My opinion in this case may have been better kept to myself.
Ah, no biggie. We're all just really excited. I'm excited for XMen too, as they are obviously on the way up. And, we all spout off with our opinions - it's called passion. I'm still going to write DCI and tell them you should judge all captions next year
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Interesting. Would it really fit with their show? I think they should DO IT!!!!
Pearson Out at Santa Clara Vanguard
in DCI World Class Corps Discussions
Posted
Right! Sorry 7th place for the Vanguard is just not good enough. The programing coming out of Santa Clara since 2001 is just not good enough!